Amanda Berry, Gina deJesus & Michelle Knight FOUND! #3

[PrettyWoman86]

Do you believe the reports of Mr Poindexter and his brother who witnessed the abduction, reported her clothing, her description the location of the abduction (verified by Gina) reported the vehicle nake/model and description of the driver?
The officer never wrote a report.

I personally believe the ball was dropped, hindsight being 20/20 shows clues that could have led police in the right direction. I also believe that since all women were abducted from Lorain Avenue, that police missed the connection of a serial abductor by not looking into Michelle's disappearance. I believe her mother made a police report, I don't think the Knight family is a strong family unit which is why it may seem no one cared, but I am not sure that was the case.

 

[kalekona]

There needs to me new protocol when people go missing but what or how those changes should occur is hard to say. Police forces simply do not have the resources to treat every case as an abduction-

I think teens should always be seen as abductions first and if information is found otherwise then change their status to runaway- error on the side of causation.
But it wasn't negligence by LE- just poor policy (a policy that is pretty standard across the country)

When it comes to Michelle things are different- She was an adult and she had indicators that made it reasonable to conclude she left on her own- What her mother did or didn't do originally is still in question- she filed an missing person report and may have put up some fliers but she clearly never made noise, she didn't haunt the police station or keep on them about her daughter- she moved away. So Michelle being removed from the missing person list is understandable- if her family wasn't looking for her they must not be concerned (and according to her brother he didn't even know she was missing)
Michelle is a sad case. But I don't see LE being negligent in her case- I see her family as negligent.

 

[carmenugt]

The only thing I see LE handling wrong (aside from the missing vs left voluntarily thing that is a judgment call.) is why they didn't interview AC- and I think the fact that Gina's family never suspected him works in LE favor.

I don't believe all the reports about calls about naked women or screaming children.

Did LE miss things? Sure and in 11 years procedures change.

I simply don't see a lawsuit in this case- unless LE was in that house and missed the women.
The times they had contact with AC had nothing to do with the missing women- there was never a cause to search the home- I just don't see negligence here (looking at what we know right now)

Do you believe the reports of Mr Poindexter and his brother who witnessed Gina's abduction, reported her clothing, her description the location of the abduction (verified by Gina) reported the vehicle make/model and description of the driver?
The officer never wrote a report.

 

[Seajay]

I have to wonder what was going through Castro's mind when he started this. How did he think this was going to end??? Was he eventually planning on killing them, to leave no witnesses??? And what was he going to do when he lost the house in July??? Was he going to try to find a new place and moved them secretly or was he realizing the jig was up and he was about to be found out??? Or was he planning on leave a few little goodbye presents buried in the backyard when he was foreclosed on in July???

I know it matters not, but I always wonder what they were thinking, where they thought this was going, how they thought it was going to end. It's a part of my curiosity in the minds of criminals. I guess if we can better understand that, then we can better understand how to prevent it or what to look for. IMO.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

I was hoping that Michele would be able to stay with one of the other young women while she recuperates and transitions back into society. According to this article she is staying with Gina De Jesus. I was just thinking about how different it must be for them to now be apart after depending on one another for so many years.

2nd try to post link..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eJesus-refusing-mother-released-hospital.html

 

[Beyond Belief]

Maybe if we could get all the actual runaways to inform someone it sure would cut down on the confusion and maybe save someones life.

 

[carmenugt]

There needs to me new protocol when people go missing but what or how those changes should occur is hard to say. Police forces simply do not have the resources to treat every case as an abduction-

I think teens should always be seen as abductions first and if information is found otherwise then change their status to runaway- error on the side of causation.
But it wasn't negligence by LE- just poor policy (a policy that is pretty standard across the country)

When it comes to Michelle things are different- She was an adult and she had indicators that made it reasonable to conclude she left on her own- What her mother did or didn't do originally is still in question- she filed an missing person report and may have put up some fliers but she clearly never made noise, she didn't haunt the police station or keep on them about her daughter- she moved away. So Michelle being removed from the missing person list is understandable- if her family wasn't looking for her they must not be concerned (and according to her brother he didn't even know she was missing)
Michelle is a sad case. But I don't see LE being negligent in her case- I see her family as negligent.

Money should never be a reason not to search for children. As a health care worker, I know (and the police know) children who runaway are at far greater risk when missing.
As someone who demanded and lead a search for children who were presumed runaways, who was threatened with incarceration for holding the police department accountable to search for 2 missing children in my neighborhood, their parents hurt and panic is not lessened by the circumstances that lead to them being missing. They don't love them less. They don't see their lives as less valuable.

A week later the children were found dead. They were not found to be runaways.

 

[kalekona]

Whether Gina's family suspected AC or not, does not work in LE's favor at least IMO. They questioned Arlene's stepfather, I would assume they would think they questioned her bio father as well. Also Gina's family is not LE, so I don't know if I feel safe going on their suspicions alone (no disrepect intended).

Another thing, I don't think LE shares every POI with a victim's family for several reasons. Some children refer to step parents as parents simply. So if Arlene told them I talked to my dad before walking home, given Cleveland's history they may not have bothered to check with both dads.

I'm not saying it was up to Gina's family to come up with a suspect-I am saying that if it wasn't obvious to them that AC was questionable I see why he wouldn't be top of the list with LE.
I also think if his name was brought up by someone other than the man he accused of abusing his daughters Police would have shown some interest.

There has been several versions of what happened to Gina that day-not all reports say Arlene told police her father was there.

Arlene didn't live with AC it is reasonable that those immediately close to her on a daily bases were interviewed while those who didn't see Arlene regularly were missed.

Hind sight clearly points to AC as a prime suspect but I'm not sure how clear that was back then.

 

[PrettyWoman86]

There needs to me new protocol when people go missing but what or how those changes should occur is hard to say. Police forces simply do not have the resources to treat every case as an abduction-

I think teens should always be seen as abductions first and if information is found otherwise then change their status to runaway- error on the side of causation.
But it wasn't negligence by LE- just poor policy (a policy that is pretty standard across the country)

When it comes to Michelle things are different- She was an adult and she had indicators that made it reasonable to conclude she left on her own- What her mother did or didn't do originally is still in question- she filed an missing person report and may have put up some fliers but she clearly never made noise, she didn't haunt the police station or keep on them about her daughter- she moved away. So Michelle being removed from the missing person list is understandable- if her family wasn't looking for her they must not be concerned (and according to her brother he didn't even know she was missing)
Michelle is a sad case. But I don't see LE being negligent in her case- I see her family as negligent.

It's never understandable for any person to be removed from the missing person list unless they are found, point blank period. From the looks of Michelle's family, they didn't have the resources to make noise. They were convinced by the police and social workers (which gives me clues that they were receiving assistance) that Michelle may have left on her own. I don't think they might have wondered where she was, but they weren't a close family in the first place so I'm sure some doubt was left.

OT: I think when people do not have a strong family unit, things like this slip through the cracks easier. The case that comes to mind is Joyce Vincent which was a tragedy in itself.

 

[carmenugt]

I have to wonder what was going through Castro's mind when he started this. How did he think this was going to end??? Was he eventually planning on killing them, to leave no witnesses??? And what was he going to do when he lost the house in July??? Was he going to try to find a new place and moved them secretly or was he realizing the jig was up and he was about to be found out??? Or was he planning on leave a few little goodbye presents buried in the backyard when he was foreclosed on in July???

I know it matters not, but I always wonder what they were thinking, where they thought this was going, how they thought it was going to end. It's a part of my curiosity in the minds of criminals. I guess if we can better understand that, then we can better understand how to prevent it or what to look for. IMO.

POWER, CONTROL, MISOGYNY (HATE OF WOMEN) AND SEX. It is obvious he held some women as "saints" and some as "". However, he hated them both.

 

[mysteriew]

Michelle released a statement saying she's in "good spirits," asking for privacy and thanking the community for support.

https://twitter.com/ScottTaylor19

Lots of updates on Michelle.

She is out of hosp.
Won't be speaking anymore until she has an attorney appointed for her. (Good news IMO)

 

[carmenugt]

I was hoping that Michele would be able to stay with one of the other young women while she recuperates and transitions back into society. According to this article she is staying with Gina De Jesus. I was just thinking about how different it must be for them to now be apart after depending on one another for so many years.

fhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2322809/Troubled-Michelle-Knight-staying-fellow-captive-Gina-DeJesus-refusing-mother-released-hospital.htmlor

YIpPEE!! (JUMPING UP AND DOWN ESTACTICALLY):floorlaugh::heartbeat::thewave:arty::fireworks::fireworks2::xena_banana::bananajump:

lol!

 

[kalekona]

Money should never be a reason not to search for children. As a health care worker, I know (and the police know) children who runaway are at far greater risk when missing.
As someone who demanded and lead a search for children who were presumed runaways, who was threatened with incarceration for holding the police department accountable to search for 2 missing children in my neighborhood, their parents hurt and panic is not lessened by the circumstances that lead to them being missing. They don't love them less. They don't see their lives as less valuable.

A week later the children were found dead. They were not found to be runaways.

Which is why I clearly said kids under 18 should be treated as abductions until it is clear they are runaways.

But like it or not money does matter- there are fewer officers on the streets because of budget issues that isn't their fault that is reality.

 

[Beyond Belief]

I keep wondering if Castro was hitting his mother up for money. The daughters interview that he would show up for dinner, then leave for an hour or so makes me feel his Mom handed him a few bucks which in turn he ran to mcd's and got the girls some food.

 

[carmenugt]

I keep wondering if Castro was hitting his mother up for money. The daughters interview that he would show up for dinner, then leave for an hour or so makes me feel his Mom handed him a few bucks which in turn he ran to mcd's and got the girls some food.

LOL! Not your comment but the idea of a grown man running home to mommy for money to buy his women food. Loser.

 

[Beyond Belief]

LOL! Not your comment but the idea of a grown man running home to mommy for money to buy his women food. Loser.

Men run to their Mommies all the time when they need money, I don't think it would odd at all. Some I know abt are not losers to people around them only to people like me that know the truth.

 

[waltzingmatilda]

YIpPEE!! (JUMPING UP AND DOWN ESTACTICALLY):floorlaugh::heartbeat::thewave:arty::fireworks::fireworks2::xena_banana::bananajump:

lol!

That is fantastic news isn't it!?

BTW for some reason I put the word 'or' at the end of that original link but I went back to post 411 and edited/corrected it.:blushing:

 

[carmenugt]

Good reading! Here is a synopsis of articles chronologically reporting the history and events surrounding the Anthony Sowell case. (Cleveland East Side Serial Killer, 2008)
Their are so many similarities involving the attitude and response of CPD in regard to missing women in their city.
http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/predators/anthony_sowell/1.html

 

[SilkySifaka]

I was hoping that Michele would be able to stay with one of the other young women while she recuperates and transitions back into society. According to this article she is staying with Gina De Jesus. I was just thinking about how different it must be for them to now be apart after depending on one another for so many years.

2nd try to post link..

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...eJesus-refusing-mother-released-hospital.html

This is wonderful, it looks like from what he says the brother is in no position to take her in so Gina's family have opened their hearts and home. I am not surprise, i remember the aunt and mom saying Michelle and Amanda were family too. They meant it clearly. Gina's family are simply amazing

 

[jjenny]

I'm not saying it was up to Gina's family to come up with a suspect-I am saying that if it wasn't obvious to them that AC was questionable I see why he wouldn't be top of the list with LE.
I also think if his name was brought up by someone other than the man he accused of abusing his daughters Police would have shown some interest.

There has been several versions of what happened to Gina that day-not all reports say Arlene told police her father was there.

Arlene didn't live with AC it is reasonable that those immediately close to her on a daily bases were interviewed while those who didn't see Arlene regularly were missed.

Hind sight clearly points to AC as a prime suspect but I'm not sure how clear that was back then.

I haven't seen a single report stating Arlene told police her father was there. She told them about her step-father-and step-father was questioned.
Castro was never even questioned as far as I can tell.