Amanda Knox tried for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy *NEW TRIAL*#12

[otto]

Her "journalism" is limited to blogging on her 'freelance' site. Her pieces are not bought by any real media. It speaks for itself.

Andrea Vogt
16 Jan 2014

"It didn’t help that Knox ignored her lawyers’ pleas to travel from Seattle and attend court in Florence - she sent an email instead - nor that she repeatedly requested to meet the Kerchers, only to be sternly rebutted by their lawyer, who suggested she act more like a defendant.

... she had once faked a break-in as an April Fool’s prank before she left for Italy (a staged burglary is a key part of the case against her).

...her co-defendant Raffaele Sollecito’s lawyers have distanced his defence from Knox’s"

http://www.theweek.co.uk/europe/amanda-knox/56894/amanda-knoxs-fugitive-fears-shes-right-be-worried

 

[SMK]

Hmph! "Knox's PR machine..." ! Below the story there's a link with a bad photo of Amanda and the headline "Seven Signs Knox is a Psychopath". Clink on the link and all you get is a compilation of all articles by that author.

The reason I became interested in this whole story in the first place was the output of the enormous PR machine dedicated to not only proving this one woman guilty but destroying her, and her family.

I don't like unprofessional aspects, either, such as character-bashing, labeling her a psychopath, feeling glee at any negative prospects for her, or delighting in pain for her or her family. Just because I am open to guilt/partial culpability (while maintaining that I could always be proven wrong) does not mean I have any of the features of a "hater" or zealot. :snooty:

 

[SMK]

Andrea Vogt
16 Jan 2014

"It didn’t help that Knox ignored her lawyers’ pleas to travel from Seattle and attend court in Florence - she sent an email instead - nor that she repeatedly requested to meet the Kerchers, only to be sternly rebutted by their lawyer, who suggested she act more like a defendant.

... she had once faked a break-in as an April Fool’s prank before she left for Italy (a staged burglary is a key part of the case against her).

...her co-defendant Raffaele Sollecito’s lawyers have distanced his defence from Knox’s"

http://www.theweek.co.uk/europe/amanda-knox/56894/amanda-knoxs-fugitive-fears-shes-right-be-worried

Ha, we both posted this post-haste :laugh: I thought these points were very telling as well. The prank (which is actually quite an important piece of information, despite all nay-saying) has now fully made its way into mainstream media.

 

[quesarita]

I don't like unprofessional aspects, either, such as character-bashing, labeling her a psychopath, feeling glee at any negative prospects for her, or delighting in pain for her or her family. Just because I am open to guilt/partial culpability (while maintaining that I could always be proven wrong) does not mean I have any of the features of a "hater" or zealot. :snooty:

I know that, and I wasn't even referring to anyone else here really, regarding the "PR machine for guilt". I don't see how Amanda's family had any choice but to try to get public awareness of their side once the negative press had really started flying (at the beginning), much of it based on rumor and innuendo and flat out bad reporting.

IMO, the reporters and readers were initially just salivating over the unusualness of a female college student being arrested for a violent murder and rape, when 99 times out of a 100, that kind of crime against a woman is done by a man. From there, the story became "If she's guilty of that, she must be evil, depraved, psychopathic; and because she's evil and depraved, she's guilty. Anyone who can't see that is being manipulated by her face and her PR machine."

I don't like to think i'm being manipulated either, so I started looking into it. I was amazed to find that there was a third person arrested, tried and jailed, and the more I looked into his history, the more convinced I have become that he likely did this on his own.

 

[otto]

Filomena testimony about the window.

http://www.amandaknox.com/wp-conten...li-Battistelli-v-Altieri-Altieri-v-Grande.pdf

(page 25)
I complained to the Estate Agents immediately, from the moment I rented the apartment, because I would have preferred that my window had, I mean, I would have liked that the owner of the house could have installed… at least change the window lock, the windows themselves, or put bars, because it really wasn’t manageable and it didn’t give me a sense of security, they were old, they were old shutters, and so the glass was very thin and it didn’t give me an idea of security, in fact I personally complained a lot with the agency.

and later: (page 68)
Mauri: So on 3rd December you said to the police on page 24 to have closed the windows, to have drawn the shutters without latching them, to have closed only the right blind [internal shutter] and not the left one because (unheard) – do you remember this?
Filomena: in all honesty, seeing as I said that in the immediacy of the crime I can confirm because it was fresh in my mind.

Thanks for finding that. It's interesting, because I have spent some time looking at how the rock could have been thrown from the parking pad and through the window, and I came to the conclusion that the right inner shutter (from the inside) was most likely closed. Additionally, in trying to understand why the rock was aimed at the left (from inside the room) side of the window, I wondered if the left inner shutter was open. That is, in order to understand the trajectory of the rock, I arrived at the conclusion that is consistent with what Filomina said about the shutters, even though I didn't know that this is what she said about the shutters.

Something else that I've wondered is that although there were no bars on the window at the time of the murder, if the window was broken, could the wooden frame have been used to hoist someone up to the window ledge in the same way that the newly installed security bars were used.

It is still very unusual that none of the glass from the window fell to the ground below. I have seen the usual reply to this, suggesting that investigators did not look for evidence below the window, but that simply isn't true. So the question is, if Guede did break the window and did scale the wall, is it simply an unusual situation that none of the glass fell from the ledge to the ground below as he climbed onto the ledge and into the window? We know from the video of the athlete that he was all over the window ledge as he climbed, so it does seem unusual that the glass on the ledge was not disturbed.

Additionally, Guede had been caught inside places (the nursery school), but he didn't attack anyone, instead he was passive. What would make a break in at the cottage different, where he would murder instead of do what he always did in the past?

 

[otto]

Ha, we both posted this post-haste :laugh: I thought these points were very telling as well. The prank (which is actually quite an important piece of information, despite all nay-saying) has now fully made its way into mainstream media.

Knox should never have admitted that she had a history of staging a break-in to torment a roommate that is consistent with the staged break in at her cottage in Italy. Her parents paid good money to the PR Firm to keep that one under wraps for six years. Maybe she's smoking pot again and has no inhibitions when she's under the influence. Perhaps that why she demonstrated such poor judgement in spilling that information while the trial is stll ongoing.

 

[SMK]

Knox should never have admitted that she had a history of staging a break-in to torment a roommate that is consistent with the staged break in at her cottage in Italy. Her parents paid good money to the PR Firm to keep that one under wraps for six years. Maybe she's smoking pot again and has no inhibitions when she's under the influence. Perhaps that why she demonstrated such poor judgement in spilling that information while the trial is stll ongoing.

I thought this was very strange as well - first, that her attorneys, PR spokespeople, and parents would allow her to be blogging during the midst of an appeals trial. Secondly, that she would write information like this on a public blog prior to finding out the verdict in Florence. It's amazing, really.

 

[quesarita]

Thanks for finding that. It's interesting, because I have spent some time looking at how the rock could have been thrown from the parking pad and through the window, and I came to the conclusion that the right inner shutter (from the inside) was most likely closed. Additionally, in trying to understand why the rock was aimed at the left (from inside the room) side of the window, I wondered if the left inner shutter was open. That is, in order to understand the trajectory of the rock, I arrived at the conclusion that is consistent with what Filomina said about the shutters, even though I didn't know that this is what she said about the shutters.

Something else that I've wondered is that although there were no bars on the window at the time of the murder, if the window was broken, could the wooden frame have been used to hoist someone up to the window ledge in the same way that the newly installed security bars were used.

It is still very unusual that none of the glass from the window fell to the ground below. I have seen the usual reply to this, suggesting that investigators did not look for evidence below the window, but that simply isn't true. So the question is, if Guede did break the window and did scale the wall, is it simply an unusual situation that none of the glass fell from the ledge to the ground below as he climbed onto the ledge and into the window? We know from the video of the athlete that he was all over the window ledge as he climbed, so it does seem unusual that the glass on the ledge was not disturbed.

Additionally, Guede had been caught inside places (the nursery school), but he didn't attack anyone, instead he was passive. What would make a break in at the cottage different, where he would murder instead of do what he always did in the past?

The glass couldn't have fallen to the outside if the window was broken from a rock thrown from outside; it would have fallen inward, as you said earlier. The pieces of glass on the outer part of the sill look like they were placed there, by someone removing them from the frame to avoid cutting himself when opening the window latch.

Guede was passive when confronted by the nursery school owner with two repairmen and the police. I've read that when he was drinking, his acquaintance said he was obnoxious toward women. I'll look for that.

 

[otto]

I don't like unprofessional aspects, either, such as character-bashing, labeling her a psychopath, feeling glee at any negative prospects for her, or delighting in pain for her or her family. Just because I am open to guilt/partial culpability (while maintaining that I could always be proven wrong) does not mean I have any of the features of a "hater" or zealot. :snooty:

Unfortunately, Knox has brought on much of it herself. Reports about her behavior in prison, bursting into loud song in a restaurant, strumming the same chord on the guitar over and over again pretending that it's music, her chaotic writings, her tendency towards graphic violence against women in her short stories, her bizarre, expressed desire to have contact with the victim's family and so on. Knox has been out of prison for a few years, and instead of seeking professional help (Joran van der Sloot also had no use for professional help after the disappearance of Holloway), she has been saying too much and taking the wrong actions. Regardless of the verdict, many people will give her a wide berth for the remainder of her life due to her inappropriate behavior throughout the past six years.

 

[SMK]

Thanks for finding that. It's interesting, because I have spent some time looking at how the rock could have been thrown from the parking pad and through the window, and I came to the conclusion that the right inner shutter (from the inside) was most likely closed. Additionally, in trying to understand why the rock was aimed at the left (from inside the room) side of the window, I wondered if the left inner shutter was open. That is, in order to understand the trajectory of the rock, I arrived at the conclusion that is consistent with what Filomina said about the shutters, even though I didn't know that this is what she said about the shutters.

Something else that I've wondered is that although there were no bars on the window at the time of the murder, if the window was broken, could the wooden frame have been used to hoist someone up to the window ledge in the same way that the newly installed security bars were used.

It is still very unusual that none of the glass from the window fell to the ground below. I have seen the usual reply to this, suggesting that investigators did not look for evidence below the window, but that simply isn't true. So the question is, if Guede did break the window and did scale the wall, is it simply an unusual situation that none of the glass fell from the ledge to the ground below as he climbed onto the ledge and into the window? We know from the video of the athlete that he was all over the window ledge as he climbed, so it does seem unusual that the glass on the ledge was not disturbed.

Additionally, Guede had been caught inside places (the nursery school), but he didn't attack anyone, instead he was passive. What would make a break in at the cottage different, where he would murder instead of do what he always did in the past?

Excellent points - however, when he was discovered illegally in the day school, the Proprietor had her 6 year old son and 2 maintenance workers with her (Guede had in fact taken a knife from the school's kitchen). He could not really attack under these conditions. What he did, the proprietor said, was to approach the group very confidently and politely, telling them his name, that he was from Perugia, that he had needed a place to stay, and that he had been recharging his computer. I had often wondered (back when I believed he was the lone wolf) if he had tried similar on Meredith: "Hi, remember me? I am Giacomo's friend? I was just using your bathroom" but perhaps Meredith didn't buy it.

As things stand, I still feel he may have been a "lone wolf" but with a couple of pranksters behind him and involved with him.

 

[quesarita]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...er-trial-Rudy-Guede-was-violent-to-women.html

"In the document, Abukar Mohamed Barrow, known as “Momi”, accused Guede of drinking too much, taking drugs and trying to steal the handbags of young women during nights out on the town.
“Rudy was often drunk. I know he took cocaine. Often he was off his head with the drugs that he was taking. And when he was like that he would be a nuisance to girls, he’d block their path and try to hassle them. When we were in crowded places he stole their bags,” Barrow testified, according to excerpts of his evidence printed in the Italian press."

 

[otto]

I thought this was very strange as well - first, that her attorneys, PR spokespeople, and parents would allow her to be blogging during the midst of an appeals trial. Secondly, that she would write information like this on a public blog prior to finding out the verdict in Florence. It's amazing, really.

Knox is what ... 26 years old? She's willful and has always appeared to treat the court and justice system as something unworthy of respect. I doubt that she listens to anyone about what she should or shouldn't do today. The fact that Knox published that information suggests to me that she continues to have poor judgement.

 

[SMK]

Knox is what ... 26 years old? She's willful and has always appeared to treat the court and justice system as something unworthy of respect. I doubt that she listens to anyone about what she should or shouldn't do today. The fact that Knox published that information suggests to me that she continues to have poor judgement.

Yes, 26, and I had assumed she had been through so much that she would think a bit more before posting things.

The only way I can explain it - other than her headstrong character, as you note, and to which I agree - is that having all these experts proclaiming her innocence, and a book deal, and the acquittal under Hellmann , perhaps made her overly confident? (If I misspeak, there will be hundreds ready to defend me, which in this case, was true - it was still a massive error, though, and now that it has been published within a European media format, doubly so.)

 

[otto]

The glass couldn't have fallen to the outside if the window was broken from a rock thrown from outside; it would have fallen inward, as you said earlier. The pieces of glass on the outer part of the sill look like they were placed there, by someone removing them from the frame to avoid cutting himself when opening the window latch.

Guede was passive when confronted by the nursery school owner with two repairmen and the police. I've read that when he was drinking, his acquaintance said he was obnoxious toward women. I'll look for that.

If the outer shutters were closed and the window was broken from the inside with a rock, then the glass would have fallen onto the outer window ledge. The fact that the glass fell onto the window ledge, but none fell to the ground below is what is difficult to understand.

That's an interesting point about removing the glass and placing it on the ledge, but why not toss the glass away so as to not cut oneself while climbing into the window. I don't see any reason for keeping the glass on the ledge as that would only increase the chances of being cut by the glass.

I have heard that when Guede was drinking he was obnoxious towards women. I think that can be said of many drunk people. Drunk and obnoxious are often together in the same sentence, so that doesn't say anything to me about Guede.

 

[otto]

Excellent points - however, when he was discovered illegally in the day school, the Proprietor had her 6 year old son and 2 maintenance workers with her (Guede had in fact taken a knife from the school's kitchen). He could not really attack under these conditions. What he did, the proprietor said, was to approach the group very confidently and politely, telling them his name, that he was from Perugia, that he had needed a place to stay, and that he had been recharging his computer. I had often wondered (back when I believed he was the lone wolf) if he had tried similar on Meredith: "Hi, remember me? I am Giacomo's friend? I was just using your bathroom" but perhaps Meredith didn't buy it.

As things stand, I still feel he may have been a "lone wolf" but with a couple of pranksters behind him and involved with him.

Something else that has always bothered me is that if he broke into the cottage when no one was home and was in the bathroom when Meredith came home, then his first thought was most likely to get out of there. IIRC, the front door was a double key lock, meaning that Meredith would have locked the entrance with a key. Guede's only exit would have been out the window again, which may not appear as easy as climbing in the window. Additionally, he may have been afraid of drawing her attention (and she would recognize him) as he tried to leave via the window.

If he was stuck in the cottage with Meredith, it probably wouldn't take too long for her to discover him. Meanwhile, he would have taken out his knife in anticipation of defending himself. We know that Meredith's mouth/nose was bruised from a hand suffocating her, or more likely trying to prevent her from screaming. If Meredith was in her room, preparing to study, and Guede sneaked down the hall with his knife, then the minute they saw each other, she would have screamed, and he would have tried to silence her.

He needed her keys to leave the cottage, and indeed the keys were missing. Her bedroom door was locked, and even Guede would have had a reason to delay the discovery of her body.

... finish the thought later ... doorbell

 

[quesarita]

If the outer shutters were closed and the window was broken from the inside with a rock, then the glass would have fallen onto the outer window ledge. The fact that the glass fell onto the window ledge, but none fell to the ground below is what is difficult to understand.

That's an interesting point about removing the glass and placing it on the ledge, but why not toss the glass away so as to not cut oneself while climbing into the window. I don't see any reason for keeping the glass on the ledge as that would only increase the chances of being cut by the glass.

I have heard that when Guede was drinking he was obnoxious towards women. I think that can be said of many drunk people. Drunk and obnoxious are often together in the same sentence, so that doesn't say anything to me about Guede.

If the rock broke the glass from inside, none of the glass would have fallen into the room, certainly not into the middle of the room on the blue rug.

The article, which was titled Rudy Guede 'was violent to women' said that he would block their path, an aggressive move intended to intimidate.

 

[quesarita]

"Could this whole persecution of Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito, therefore, be nothing but an attempt to misdirect or distract the attention of the world, and especially the Kercher family, from the fact that Rudy was able to do what he did to their lovely daughter because the Perugian authorities failed, even neglected their duty, and perhaps intentionally released a dangerous criminal for some other reason? If so, the Perugian authorities would be both morally and financially liable to the Kerchers. In addition, potential students and visitors from England and from elsewhere would have good cause to avoid Perugia and, possibly, all of Italy as unsafe destinations for study or tourism.

This analysis is supported by the vehemence of the prosecution of Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito and the absence of much if any comment from the Kerchers about the lenient treatment of Rudy Guede. Prosecutor Mignini criticizes a media PR campaign by supporters of Amanda Knox, in particular, in hopes people will be distracted from the massive media campaign waged by the Perugian authorities through their media accomplices, Pisa, Vogt, Nadeau and others. The campaign to demonize Amanda Knox, in particular, was both sustained and brutal, using confidential material entirely within the possession of the prison authorities such as the list of Amanda’s romantic partners which was, in itself, obtained by the brutal deception perpetrated by the prison using fraudulent means that she was HIV positive."

Interesting article asking why Rudy was still at large after his earlier break-ins:
http://ajaxlaw.blogspot.com/2011/09/shouldnt-we-trust-authorities-in.html

 

[quesarita]

Rudy, in his own words:
“I often hear people who have never known me and anything about the trial saying I am a liar, a drifter or whatever,” he said.
“If I am a liar, I say to the judges, well then what is the truth?”

Guede urged the judges to ignore evidence from “people like Mario Alessi”, a child killer who previously testified that Guede had told him in a prison exercise yard Miss Knox and Mr Sollecito were innocent of the murder.
“Unfortunately the truth has still not been revealed and never will be if you continue to listen to people like Mario Alessi and others like him,” Guede said in his letter.

So, Rudy is also addressing the world. Why so mysterious and obscure? It'd be great to see a translation of that whole letter.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/wor...ts-Meredith-Kercher-killer-is-still-free.html

 

[Katody]

If the outer shutters were closed and the window was broken from the inside with a rock, then the glass would have fallen onto the outer window ledge. The fact that the glass fell onto the window ledge, but none fell to the ground below is what is difficult to understand.

There would be damage to the shutter that is nonexistent. Instead there is damage and embedded glass on the outward facing surface of the inner scuri.

 

[quesarita]

"And so, during this chat with the friend, when he was still abroad, where he had fled after the crime [fatto], Rudy Guede does not implicate in any way Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito as perpetrators of the crime. And in that moment, because he was abroad, and therefore in a certain way safe, or because he was convinced he was conversing just with a friend, perhaps his only real friend, he would not have had any reason to keep quiet on such a matter. Which leads us to believe, being himself, on the contrary, certainly a perpetrator, alone or with others (here it does not matter), of the crimes committed on Via Della Pergola, that if Amanda Knox and Raffaele Sollecito had also participated, he would have in that moment revealed it to his friend.

Nor can one assume that to keep quiet a fact of that kind, even hypothetically, could have been due to a need to distance himself from the suspects to try to avoid finding himself also involved, since, being already aware that in that moment they had already been arrested, he would not have had reason to nurture the hope that, remaining silent during the conversation with the friend, he could in some way affect the legal situation [situazione processuale] of the other two and, so, improve his own personal situation, having reason, on the contrary, to fear that they, if really present with him in Via della Pergola, would have been able, being by now arrested, accuse him and only him of committing the crime in an attempt to exonerate themselves, perhaps recognizing their own presence in that house but nevertheless [asserting] their non-involvement [estraneità] in committing the crime. With the result that he would have had interest in attributing to them, in that chat with the friend, the responsibility for what happened on Via Della Pergola: this is why the Rudy Guede of the chat seems more credible and this is why Rudy not having attributed to them, in the chat, the responsibility for the homicide represents an element of a certain reliability in favor of the current defendants."
From the Hellman report, concerning the letter.