AR - Dexter Williams, 24, found dead in hot tub with TV weatherman, 5 Sept 2011

[HastingsChi]

Hastings, I think some of us have assumed the tub MIGHT have been full at some earlier time. Didn't somebody mention a ring of blood? That would suggest there was water in the tub and the blood was floating on top of the water. (ETA I see you understand the blood was at the bottom of the tub, so never mind this question.)

Not to make anyone uncomfortable but I had assumed that the ring of blood was found in the tub might be due to some sort of anal tearing. I never considered that it was blood that was in the tub when full and wound up there when the tub drained.

Also, the OP who mentioned somebody smothering the victim by lying on him wasn't assuming the person on top was asleep. The example given has the suffocation happening during copulation (i.e., with the victim on the bottom).

From the police report: He then entered the bathroom where he observed Brett and Dexter in the tub which had no water in it. He observed that Dexter's head was lying behind Brett's left shoulder.

Nova: I adore you for giving me reason to learn a new word & definition today: "copulation"

By giving weight to the theory that suffocation occurred during copulation, are we in agreement that:
(a) Cummins (and likely Barbour) did not sleep.
(b) Cummins & Barbour covered up and sanitized the scene.
(c) Cummins & Barbour developed a story minimizing their culpability in Williams' death
?

 

[Nova]

Hastings, I have no experience with crystal meth or Adderall. My entire experience with cocaine consisted of trying it two or three times in the early 1980s. (I discovered I have a strong tendency toward nose bleeds, which may be another explanation for the blood in the tub.)

I'm not assuming you have personally used either, but I am relying on your assertion that nobody slept that night. So, yes, I agree with your (a), (b) and (c) above.

As for the suffocation, Cummins doesn't seem big enough to accidentally suffocate an adult male during sex. I'm thinking plastic bag or some other form of play I haven't read about yet.

 

[wfgodot]

Unless Cummins and Barbour had been partying on crystal meth for days and days, there is no way that they would have been sleeping (and all three of them falling asleep on crystal meth? come on...).

snippy-snip

Mention was made in early stories about drinking going on in addition to the powders; were this to involve copious amounts of hard liquor, yes, I think sleep might have been achieved, depending, I suppose, upon the quality of the crystal and the amount taken.

Also, this is an excellent thread, full of terrific posts. Thanks, all.

 

[annmarie62]

However the death occurred, I believe it was accidental (incidental?), meaning that neither Cummins nor Barbour intentially "murdered" the victim. I DO believe that all of them were really, really intoxicated. Many people connect the idea of "intoxicated" with the mental image of someone stumbling around/incoherent/passed out- like really drunk people act. However, "speed" intoxication such as comes with meth/cocaine/adderall is an entirely different form of intoxication and many people are not familiar with the way(s) it can cause someone to behave/respond. This type of drug-influenced behavior is commonly known as "geeking"; the person's mind is rushing a million miles a minute; often extreme paranoia and hallucinations occur. I think that this death was either sex-related/caused...as a result of autoerotic asphyixiation a la the dog collar...or the victim simply OD'd...possibly choked on his own vomit. I believe C & B were very, very messed up and that nothing they did that night can be viewed through a "logical" point of view. I am not sure if they noticed the death right away, but I am pretty sure they did, and immediately both went into "cover-up" mode, although their thought processes sprang from pure panic and paranoia- logic had "left the building"! Cummins knew he was, in essence, a "public figure." I know a TV weatherman is not "public" like, say, a judge, a city councilman, a police chief or even a schoolteacher- but still, he was on TV every day and the public "knew" him... and certainly his employers expected him to uphold a certain public image. So, imo, he knew he would be crucified and fired, if not arrested. And the "gay" aspect wasn't helping him any. I'm pretty sure media organizations, even a "local" television news show, had basically a "don't ask/don't tell" unwritten policy re. their gay employees- and Cummins knew that he had to keep his private life VERY private...and this is Arkansas. So I can totally see how his mind leapt into cover-up planning right away, instead of rational "call 911 immediately" thought processes. Hell, even if they all had been sober and a decade-younger victim had had a heart attack, say, in the jacuzzi... where BC couldn't be blamed... he knew everyone would put 2-and-2 together, as in "Dude had a DUDE in his hot tub!... no avoiding scandal, and no sympathy/protection could possibly be expected from his employer. While it disturbs me greatly that these two obviously lied about and tried to sugarcoat the victim's demise, BC knew his goose was cooked and his career over. He probably had to hide his sexual orientation all the time, thus paranoia was never far from the surface, even when he was stone-cold sober. This case is a tragedy on many levels, in my opinion.:twocents:

 

[Nova]

snippy-snip

Mention was made in early stories about drinking going on in addition to the powders; were this to involve copious amounts of hard liquor, yes, I think sleep might have been achieved, depending, I suppose, upon the quality of the crystal and the amount taken.

Also, this is an excellent thread, full of terrific posts. Thanks, all.

If not sleep, alcohol can certainly bring on unconsciousness. Which might amount to the same thing in this case.

 

[Nova]

...I think that this death was either sex-related/caused...as a result of autoerotic asphyixiation a la the dog collar...or the victim simply OD'd...possibly choked on his own vomit....

annmarie, the rest of your post makes perfect sense to me, but there is nothing in the autopsy to suggest the victim was strangled by the dog collar or choked on his own vomit.

 

[deelytful1]

I'm agreeing strongly with the asphyxiation for pleasure idea.
Without getting too graphic, and in the risk of "reaching" there are also fetishes that involve things such as saran wrap and mummification
Unfortunately since they had so much time to dispose of such evidence, that one would be very hard to prove.

 

[annmarie62]

annmarie, the rest of your post makes perfect sense to me, but there is nothing in the autopsy to suggest the victim was strangled by the dog collar or choked on his own vomit.

Thanks much for clearing that up! I am just trying to wrap my mind around the theory that, while I believe the death was accidental/unintentional (not to say that "involuntary manslaughter" doesn't cross my mind...); still it is driving me crazy wondering just how, EXACTLY, this young man died. I know it happens, but I wish C & B would just drop the BS and tell the plain truth... although, honestly, I can see why they are remaining mum at present.

 

[wfgodot]

If not sleep, alcohol can certainly bring on unconsciousness. Which might amount to the same thing in this case.

Truly. I should have made reference to "passing out" in my post.

 

[wfgodot]

However the death occurred, I believe it was accidental (incidental?), meaning that neither Cummins nor Barbour intentially "murdered" the victim. I DO believe that all of them were really, really intoxicated. Many people connect the idea of "intoxicated" with the mental image of someone stumbling around/incoherent/passed out- like really drunk people act. However, "speed" intoxication such as comes with meth/cocaine/adderall is an entirely different form of intoxication and many people are not familiar with the way(s) it can cause someone to behave/respond. This type of drug-influenced behavior is commonly known as "geeking"; the person's mind is rushing a million miles a minute; often extreme paranoia and hallucinations occur. I think that this death was either sex-related/caused...as a result of autoerotic asphyixiation a la the dog collar...or the victim simply OD'd...possibly choked on his own vomit. I believe C & B were very, very messed up and that nothing they did that night can be viewed through a "logical" point of view. I am not sure if they noticed the death right away, but I am pretty sure they did, and immediately both went into "cover-up" mode, although their thought processes sprang from pure panic and paranoia- logic had "left the building"! Cummins knew he was, in essence, a "public figure." I know a TV weatherman is not "public" like, say, a judge, a city councilman, a police chief or even a schoolteacher- but still, he was on TV every day and the public "knew" him... and certainly his employers expected him to uphold a certain public image. So, imo, he knew he would be crucified and fired, if not arrested. And the "gay" aspect wasn't helping him any. I'm pretty sure media organizations, even a "local" television news show, had basically a "don't ask/don't tell" unwritten policy re. their gay employees- and Cummins knew that he had to keep his private life VERY private...and this is Arkansas. So I can totally see how his mind leapt into cover-up planning right away, instead of rational "call 911 immediately" thought processes. Hell, even if they all had been sober and a decade-younger victim had had a heart attack, say, in the jacuzzi... where BC couldn't be blamed... he knew everyone would put 2-and-2 together, as in "Dude had a DUDE in his hot tub!... no avoiding scandal, and no sympathy/protection could possibly be expected from his employer. While it disturbs me greatly that these two obviously lied about and tried to sugarcoat the victim's demise, BC knew his goose was cooked and his career over. He probably had to hide his sexual orientation all the time, thus paranoia was never far from the surface, even when he was stone-cold sober. This case is a tragedy on many levels, in my opinion.:twocents:

Wonderfully well-said ("Dude had a DUDE in his hot tub!" lol - yep, that's the Arkansas I've lived in).

Should also be remembered that back in '08 KARK had tried to get rid of BC, and, per the Save Brett Cummins petition page, most felt that, whatever the given reason (if there was one) at the time, it was because of his sexual orientation.

 

[HastingsChi]

Should also be remembered that back in '08 KARK had tried to get rid of BC, and, per the Save Brett Cummins petition page, most felt that, whatever the given reason (if there was one) at the time, it was because of his sexual orientation.

Wfgodot: In this post I had mentioned that I had confirmed, with two unimpeachable sources, the reason for Cummins' 2008 termination:

* It has been noted here and in a couple media reports that Christopher Barbour (occupant of 16 Village Way) was arrested and charged with third degree domestic battery on December 23, 2010. This information caused a great deal of discussion and speculation about Barbour here at WS. What we have been unaware of is that Barbour is not the only one whose past has included violence; Brett Cummins has also been disciplined for violence. The backstory: Brett Cummins was fired by KARK 4 in May 2008 and rehired in September 2009. Cummins was rehired because he won a wrongful termination lawsuit against the station. I've been able to confirm that the reason KARK fired Cummins in May 2008: "he got into a fight at a bar in Little Rock" and was not arrested; the lawsuit settlement reinstated him.

Hope that info helps.

 

[HastingsChi]

Without getting too graphic, and in the risk of "reaching" there are also fetishes that involve things such as saran wrap and mummification

deelytful1 : That is brilliant! I had not even considered that because in all the online personals profiles that I have tracked down and am 99% sure are Williams', those two specific fetishes were not mentioned; however the profiles lead me to believe Williams was very open-minded so I'd bet it is a possibility.

In my opinion, things mentioned in the police report and in this thread we should not forget about:
* The statement of Barbour & Cummins cleaning up vomit in the living room and the officer noting how clean the house appeared.
* The possibility that the living room was the "crime scene"
* The home at 16 Village Way has 3 bedrooms yet Barbour places himself on the couch to "sleep"

 

[wfgodot]

Wfgodot: In this post I had mentioned that I had confirmed, with two unimpeachable sources, the reason for Cummins' 2008 termination:

Hope that info helps.

Mea culpa, I'd forgotten. Moot point as to whether a heterosexual newsman would have been so readily dismissed by the station, I guess.

 

[Steely Dan]

HastingsChi, you mentioned earlier that they officially listed the manner of death as undetermined and the cause of death Asphyxia along with significant findings of Acute Combined Methamphetamine and Amphetamine Intoxication. There was no finding of strangulation listed on the Cause of Death report. This confirms my friend's claim that Dex was taking Adderall, and he apparently mixed it with meth, which is a recipe for disaster in itself, but it also totally supports what you've been saying all along... Barbour's story was totally fabricated and that it was conceived in order to cover up whatever happened that night. I'm not sure how you knew so early on, but I'm completely convinced now.



I think they ruled out drowning and vomit, but some other options certainly seem plausible.

Possible scenarios:

First, the asphyxiation could have been part of a sex act, which happens more likely than most people realize. Erotic asphyxiation is practiced by partners and individuals for for pleasure, and accidentally killing yourself in this manner is more common than I realized because the adolescents who die this way are usually listed as suicides to protect the family of the deceased. http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=51776

Second, your comment that Cummins may have been lying across his face seems worth consideration. It's embarrassing to admit this, but I've had an experience with a man was overly aggressive and who choked me (not with his hands) to the point where I couldn't breathe and ended up pushing him off me so I could catch my breath. (Sorry to get a little too personal there, but it's an experience I expect many people have encountered at some point, and guys can be overly aggressive when drunk and/or inebriated.

Lastly, the possibility of Dexter having had an asthma attack is unlikely but not impossible. It would just make their story sound even more peculiar though. If it was asthma, why was there blood?

And I want to know why they lied about what really went on that night! Obviously nobody slept that night, and there is no excuse for Cummins leaving, both men cleaning the scene, and nobody calling 911 to get help as soon as he lost consciousness. These two better not be granted a "Get out of Jail Free Card" for this. The Arkansas' justice system is so incompetent that nothing surprises me, but I'll hope for the best. The Maumelle Police need to contact HastingsChi; he's apparently doing their job better than they are right now.

BBM

I have a feeling that in some parts of Arkansas that gay men can be charged with serious crimes for just being gay and convicted on slight evidence. JMO

What about the blood at the bottom of the tub?

There are three ways one can do crystal meth:
1) Snort it up the nose: In his statement Christopher Barbour stated they snorted drugs.
2) Smoke it in a glass pipe: In his statement Barbour mentioned cleaning up glassware in the bathroom. (Maybe he was going to get another hit from the pipe?)
3) Inject it into the veins: As scary as this sounds, injection is becoming the preferred way for people to do crystal meth. As someone who is terrified of needles and can't even see a needle on TV without looking away, this baffles me. (Might an injection gone wrong have led to asphyxiation followed by a cover-up?)

BBM

A needle mark should have been noted on the autopsy report. However, after finding out who did the autopsy it wouldn't surprise me if it were missed. JMO

 

[wfgodot]

o/t a wee bit:

Hi Steely Dan, welcome back!

 

[Nova]

Truly. I should have made reference to "passing out" in my post.

That's okay. When I drink, I call it "going to sleep", too. So I think we all knew exactly what you meant. :great:

 

[Nova]

Everybody has been more than decent about not invoking stereotypes in this case, and I very much thank everyone for that.

But I would like to point out (and I think HastingsChi will second my point here) that it is a minority of gay men who do anything more than brief experimentation with extreme sexual behaviors and/or hard-core drugs.

Most of us are just as boring in bed as lots of straight people and just as likely to reach for a Bud Lite rather than a pipeful of crystal meth.

 

[tezi]

Here is something that crossed my mind for weeks you guys might want to comment on: Might the plan have been for Cummins to dispose of evidence, get himself cleaned up and then go to the TV station, record the infamous weather forecast and return to Barbour's to deal with the situation? Maybe Cummins was taking too long and Barbour became a Nervous Nellie and called the police. Thoughts?

RSBM: I think this very well could have been the case HastingsChi. Personally speaking, if I had a dead body in my tub, I'd be a bit of a Nervous Nellie, myself.

Regarding the house, I think the crime probably did occur in the living room, just because of the cleanliness. Two people on meth can clean like no tomorrow.....

 

[dsntslp]

http://www.crystalmethaddiction.org/Crystal_Meth_Overdose.htm

Symptoms of a Crystal Meth overdose include:

cardiovascular collapse
heart attack, stroke, or coma
convulsions
dangerous rise in body temperature
high fever
sudden and dangerous increase in blood pressure
sweating
user could see spots (due to pressure on the nerves of eye)
-------------

Could they have put the victim in the tub with it filled with cool or cold water to try and cool him down?
Perhaps if the victim was not cooperative (delusional, freaking due to OD etc...) and was not remaining in the tub, maybe Cummins got into the tub with him to try and calm him, perhaps lean on him and hold him in the tub 'for his own good'. If the victim then died and Cummins was sitting in front of him like that, it might be possible that Cummins physically felt the victim calm down and his breathing slowing (actually dying) but Cummins did not recognize the signs of impending death due to his own inebriation? I could never fall asleep in a cold bath (Cummins was not OD'ing) but maybe some people can if they are high enough? It may be possible that the victims breathing became slower and slower as he was dying and Cummins thought the victim was just calming down and breathing slower. Foaming at the mouth would not be seen by Cummins because he was sitting in front of the victim. Any gurgling type noises may have been mistaken as snoring. Convulsions may have been mistaken for the victim still fighting to get out of the tub. Maybe Cummins did fall asleep in the tub by the time the victims breathing was noticeably deficient.

Agonal breathing:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agonal_respiration

Me: Agonal breaths are often mistaken by bystanders at accidents scenes etc... as the victim is breathing. Often, nobody starts CPR because they think the victim is breathing when the reality is that the breaths are insufficient to sustain life and actually herald the dying process. CPR should be started immediately if a victim has agonal respirations, from what I have been told.

Maybe they initially put the victim in the tub after he vomited so as to clean him up and be able to put him to bed to sleep it off.

Maybe they weren't taking a bath so much as trying to cool the victim and prevent the OD.

Thoughts?

ETA: I do concede that this scenario would not explain the blood pooling to the victims head.

 

[HastingsChi]

snippy-snip

Mention was made in early stories about drinking going on in addition to the powders; were this to involve copious amounts of hard liquor, yes, I think sleep might have been achieved, depending, I suppose, upon the quality of the crystal and the amount taken.

Also, this is an excellent thread, full of terrific posts. Thanks, all.

In thinking about it and reading about similar parties, I think that Barbour used the alcohol as a red herring (if you recall his statement mentions they had been snorting illegal drugs but he didn't know what type) because he & Cummins did not want it to be viewed as a crystal meth case (for numerous reasons).