Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 #19

[Tulz]

Just an FYI regarding the immediacy of the investigation,


from here: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...ses-changed-20110406-1d3sy.html#ixzz1xJPiZ5Xp
HTH

Very helpful thanks!
I think this fits in with quite a bit of the discussions tonight, imo.

 

[linette]

However, now who led the Police to believe that Allison allegedly had a 'mental illness'( i.e. depression)?
It quickly turned into a unlawful homicide investigation. Mr. Ainsworth stated that to the MSM cited numerous times on this thread.
It is a murder investigation now.

Premeditated or not, it's looking more like they hoped to get away with it looking like a suicide. IMO. Glad it didn't work, that would be terrible to die at the hands of another and have it go down in history as suicide.

 

[pugsandfrogs]

I recall your earlier posts about your sad circumstance when you were young. In some way you and your brothers were in a similar situation as these 3 little girls, just a little bit older. I guess, as time goes by, they will also forget things about their mum, in particular the youngest one. And if the father has to go away too, that will be just awful. I hope Allison's sister becomes some sort of role model for the girls too.

Sorry I am just catching up on the last couple of days. When I was about 13 y.o. a man called Cliff Bartholamew killed his entire family (except 1 child that was at a sleepover) 10 in all. That little girl was around 5 and came to live at the back of our place with relatives for a few months.

She would walk up and down along the back fence all day singing to herself. What had happened had clearly disturbed the poor little thing. I know it won't take their pain away but they do have each other and the Dickies.

 

[Indromum]

Yes it is IMO, but that is subjective. Will be interested in the views of others ...

Yes...i don't think that bridge has ever been flooded. Even during last years devastating flood.

 

[mouse detective]

Just an FYI regarding the immediacy of the investigation,
from here: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...ses-changed-20110406-1d3sy.html#ixzz1xJPiZ5Xp
HTH

This could indicate that Allison was officially diagnosed for depression and may in fact have been receiving professional treatment and therefore the Police acted instantaneously.

Apart from the damage to the Prado - maybe there were no suspicious signs at the home.

 

[Indromum]

I'm interested to know why you don't think the perp parked in the side area and placed her there? I went to the bridge too, and walked down the slope, and after being there i was more convinced of the feasibility of it. It would have been hard, but not as hard as i thought, definitely possible. If the body was too heavy that might explain why assistance of another person was needed. I also thought it was possible she was thrown or pushed off, because her position was close enough to the edge of the bridge and the body may have moved a little when the water rose. As for being washed downstream, I'm not so sure, I felt there were too many areas to get caught in along the way, and too much of a coincidence she would end up where she did.

You could be right, but thinking about trying to walk down that steep slope in the dark with a body (no lighting, pitch black and the chance of cars driving by at any time) makes me believe it would be too risky and just downright dangerous (although this could account for scratches on a person - falling into scrub)

 

[kalamityk]

I think that GBC told the police when they came to the house that Allison suffered from depression (to reinforce the suicide/wandered off/ran away theory)
but wasn't there something that the officers saw at the house that morning that made them suspicious (apart from a lying, cheating husband)
My first impression back when Allison was first 'missing' was that she was a 'depressed' woman who had gone missing - and then I watched that interview - GBC is not a very good liar JMO of course

 

[grannie]

Whoever it was that mentioned bath water being in her lungs....water in lungs would support the notion of suicide without a mark on her.

It was me with a theory about possible bathwater in her lungs not matching (biochemically) the water of the creek. But the forensic examination has not revealed that, according to the media. So it was a dead end.

 

[Rational]

It was me with a theory about possible bathwater in her lungs not matching (biochemically) the water of the creek. But the forensic examination has not revealed that, according to the media. So it was a dead end.

Morning Grannie
You obviously have had access to the forensic and/or media reports regarding bathwater but forgot to put in the link. Would you like to share some more of that with us?

 

[Mani]

Thinking, I have read your post from last night - I must have just missed it after asking about the bridge.

Thanks for asking but I don't have a theory about Allison. I am thankful for the concise and logical posts of members such as Mountain High, who have an insight due to their relationship with lawyers who understand the legal system and the cases that have gone before this one.

I don't believe Allison went for a walk that Thursday night but she might have driven off in the car to cool off after a fight. However the more I read from members such as MH, the more it makes me think she has been killed in her own home.

I find the story to have more holes in it than a piece of Swiss cheese and it just doesn't make sense to me based on the limited facts available to us.

So kudos to all the members who are able to speculate and garner ideas that make sense. Based on the weight of probability, the person most close to Allison committed this crime against Allison by taking her life, with no respect for her worth, her life or her dignity.

However, I have a nagging feeling that he didn't do it and nothing in his personality (as evidenced by what we have been shown in the MSM) influences me to say that. Even after all of the posts, I find it difficult to believe, maybe in part because I don't want to believe a person could kill the mother of 3 young girls. I know that history proves me wrong as this has happened in other cases and unfortunately will happen again. This is why I say that I will be pelted with cabbages and pies in the town square.

 

[grannie]

Morning Grannie
You obviously have had access to the forensic and/or media reports regarding bathwater but forgot to put in the link. Would you like to share some more of that with us?

Hi Rational,
Why obviously? If you read my post again, you will see the words "according to the media". We could not possibly know the autopsy results. But if the forensics did find some mismatch in Allison's lungs, would not they arrest GBC straight away?

 

[kalamityk]

Mani - I don't think that when her killer thought about her that he thought of her as a mother but that he saw that she was in his way

 

[coffeechick]

Where there is a pastor there is a pest exterminator not far away MOO

My husband is minister - I can assure you there is no pest exterminator not far away. I think demeaning the sister and her husband who IMO has nothing to do with ABC murder is a bit low myself.

 

[Mani]

Mani - I don't think that when her killer thought about her that he thought of her as a mother but that he saw that she was in his way

Thank you MH - great post.

Mani, I am confident that who the perp is although I wouldn't be confident saying whether it was premiditated or not. I would take a stab that it wasn't however there is still the nagging issue of serious money problems. Life insurance aside (which admittedly is a mine field of legal implications by way of getting paid eventually, so it wouldn't be an instant winfall) there may have been other immiedate cash benefits that we don't know about by way of some property she may have still had in her own name (unlikely), perhaps a few hundred grand in super (who knows) that may have got him out of trouble temporarily. Or it could be as simple as her name was on some legal and/or company documents as a Director for example and in the event of her death he was able to walk away from a considerable amount of debt.

I don't know whether GBC or anyone in his family are seasoned killers but would take a stab and say no. therefore whilst It has all the trademarks of a domestic gone horribly wrong, you raise a good point about the methodical nature of this crime followed up with a sound cover up which up until now has seen him evade an arrest. Which in some ways could sway me back to thinking that this in fact was pre meditated. (to a degree)

I have never been entirely convinced that this was not completely 'not thought out'. Meaning that, he may have started in his own mind to think about how this particular 'night' would play out (if at all) at some point leading up to this night. Be it weeks or be it months prior to the 19th April. Where would I dispose? how would I get there? Do I need help? Who would be the best to help me? How would I kill her? (darn better do some research) How do I react afterward? (do i crash a car) Do I grow a beard or don't I? etc etc

If none of the above EVER happend and this was a simple argument followed by strangulation or a bath drowning or completely accidental in every sense, then he has clearly done quite well (for want of a better word) to cover the hard evidence trail to date. Particularly for an amateur without priors in anything remotely related to this type of thing. In this day and age he would be in the absolute minority (probably 2-3%) that manage to get away with murder. (if this is how it turns out)

Yes. MH's point last night about debt gave me the chills as it is something I had not considered.

 

[kalamityk]

Hi Rational,
Why obviously? If you read my post again, you will see the words "according to the media". We could not possibly know the autopsy results. But if the forensics did find some mismatch in Allison's lungs, would not they arrest GBC straight away?

I don't think so Grannie - that only happens in fiction - the police will have to rule out any other scenarios - he has probably been told not to leave the area

 

[Mani]

Hi Indromum,

Thank you for placing flowers with CJ60 from all of us. That was a very kind thought.
RIP Allison

Thanks Marlywings for asking for the bridge height from any locals on last night.
Thanks Jubillee for the photo of the Kholo in flood.
Was that during the floods in 2011? It's a lotta water!

 

[Fergie]

What about this scenario?
1. Police have already been at house for dv that night.
2. After police leave , dv heats up again and Allison is murdered.
3. Murderer rings dad and tells him about whole evenings murder and also that police attended earlier. They agree on plan to coverup murder and get rid of body and evidence. Agree on scouts area to dump body.
4. Fathers job is to walk up to kenmore roundabout , and watch for police activity. He will alert murderer if police head out along brookfield rd or moggill rd. Father sits at bus stop as its best view in both directions. ( spotter)
5. Son rings lover and she arrives at house soon after. They drive out to dump body. (2 cars involved)
6. Lover drives back through roundabout to her house afterwards.
7. Son drives back through roundabout and picks Father up and drives back through roundabout to get home again to cleanup all evidence. Father and son spend next few hours 4am - 7am conspiring and cleaning up.
8. Son rings police ....

Great post, I think this is exactly what happened

 

[Rational]

Hi Rational,
Why obviously? If you read my post again, you will see the words "according to the media". We could not possibly know the autopsy results. But if the forensics did find some mismatch in Allison's lungs, would not they arrest GBC straight away?

Yes I saw those words but I did not see any media report (unless I missed it which is possible) that said she had water (bath or creek or both) in her lungs. So if you could provide the link for your post I would be most grateful?
:groucho:

 

[Thinking]

Thinking, I have read your post from last night - I must have just missed it after asking about the bridge.

Thanks for asking but I don't have a theory about Allison. I am thankful for the concise and logical posts of members such as Mountain High, who have an insight due to their relationship with lawyers who understand the legal system and the cases that have gone before this one.

I don't believe Allison went for a walk that Thursday night but she might have driven off in the car to cool off after a fight. However the more I read from members such as MH, the more it makes me think she has been killed in her own home.

I find the story to have more holes in it than a piece of Swiss cheese and it just doesn't make sense to me based on the limited facts available to us.

So kudos to all the members who are able to speculate and garner ideas that make sense. Based on the weight of probability, the person most close to Allison committed this crime against Allison by taking her life, with no respect for her worth, her life or her dignity.

However, I have a nagging feeling that he didn't do it and nothing in his personality (as evidenced by what we have been shown in the MSM) influences me to say that. Even after all of the posts, I find it difficult to believe, maybe in part because I can't believe a person could kill the mother of 3 young girls. I know that history proves me wrong as this has happened in other cases and unfortunately will happen again. This is why I say that I will be pelted with cabbages and pies in the town square.

Thanks mani . I agree with you in many ways. I also find it incomprehensible that a man could do this to the mother of his children and I am ever hopeful (yet not confident) that it wasn't GBC.

I have a niggling feeling that Allison may have gone out in her car and this somehow ties with NBC being at the bus stop, and both cars being seen at 4am...can't put it together though....

 

[Mani]

Thanks mani . I agree with you in many ways. I also find it incomprehensible that a man could do this to the mother of his children and I am ever hopeful (yet not confident) that it wasn't GBC.

I have a niggling feeling that Allison may have gone out in her car and this somehow ties with NBC being at the bus stop, and both cars being seen at 4am...can't put it together though....

I appreciate you asking me for my opinion Thinking.

I have just edited the original post from I can't believe to I don't want to believe as I think it is incomprehensible - that is the word I was looking for thanks.

Yes it is hard to put it all together but I am confident that there are some great minds working on this case and it is their experience and tenacity that will bring justice for Allison.

Justice might be blind (folded) but IMO detectives never give up! I have a big soft spot for ambos, firies, SES and the police because of the work they do and their dedication to supporting the public.