Australia Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #11

[mandy.maree]

Hi 123 I reckon he was straight past Hera as a couple of other people were in front of him. I reckon they must if been getting in a cab on how hurried they seemed which then makes me think that JR is not waiting for a cab otherwise sury she would have taken that as she definately had been waiting longer.
JMOO


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She wasnt getting a taxi. She was waiting for someone. MM it appears.
Yet she didnt leave with him either it seems. All i can gather is he was getting his car or yelled out for her to follow from further down the street

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[Sutton]

A quick questions.

Has anyone here a) seen more of this footage b)knows anyone that has seen more of this footage. (I wonder if this is exactly what was shown to the 700 - I suspect not?)

I think we all agree that this is a mixmatch of feeds / cuts.

The only footage publicly released was the additional footage (uploaded by flect, 1:08 minutes) and the CIA episode. There are two (actually more, but those are just duplicates) versions of the CIA on YouTube--one uploaded by haleyjane1985, one uploaded by Alice S. These two versions might be slightly different. Several posters claim to have seen a slightly different version of flect's CCTV footage. This slightly different version is hotly contested on the threads, may show Jane walking towards a taxi, and is not available online.

I am not going to say who's claimed to have seen the extended footage. That argument shut down the thread several times.

Patrons of Conti were shown extended MM footage.

Summary:
1. flect's additional CCTV footage
2. haleyjane1985's copy of CIA
3. Alice S's copy of CIA
4. Extended version of CCTV footage (existence not confirmed)
5. Whatever police showed witnesses/patrons
6. Debbi Marshall's description of a video of Jane grinning and swinging around the post (see screenshot in the next few posts)

 

[user29]

The only footage publicly released was the additional footage (1:08 minutes) and the CIA episode. There are two (actually more, but those are just duplicates) versions of the CIA on YouTube--one uploaded by HaleyJane, one uploaded by -----. These two versions might be slightly different. Several posters claim to have seen a slightly different version of the additional footage. This slightly different version is hotly contested on the threads, may show Jane walking towards a taxi, and is not available online.

I am not going to say who's claimed to have seen the extended footage. That argument shut down the thread several times.

Patrons of Conti were shown extended MM footage.

Summary:
1. Additional CCTV footage
2. HaleyJane's copy of CIA
3. -----'a copy of CIA
4. Extended version of CCTV footage (existence not confirmed)

Thanks didn't realise it was such a can of worms - but then I guess it is bound to be.

Kudos for none of the other videos from leaking - everything seems to leak these days. I "imagine" they have footage of the patrons - to verify who they think is them is indeed them, hence they saw a different cut. I also speculate that over time ppl may have been shown different versions once they honed in on MM - as I suspect they have more footage of him. IMO

 

[123sniff]

I've compiled a timeline of screenshots of available CCTV footage, based on all the recent posts fellow Sleuthers have made. I have used the actual time-stamps on the footage so the timing is accurate in my notes. I am not suggesting anything by this, it is simply a compilation of many different posts. Make of it what you will...

Footage links: https://youtu.be/hbbg-FVij4c https://youtu.be/eTpMkQV_bfk

 

[Sutton]

There is also this claim, by Debbi Marshall in The Devil's Garden, but the book is fraught with error, IMO:

(Chapter 8)

 

[lsdmongre]

She wasnt getting a taxi. She was waiting for someone. MM it appears.
Yet she didnt leave with him either it seems. All i can gather is he was getting his car or yelled out for her to follow from further down the street

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I agree.

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[Sutton]

I've compiled a timeline of screenshots of available CCTV footage, based on all the recent posts fellow Sleuthers have made. I have used the actual time-stamps on the footage so the timing is accurate in my notes. I am not suggesting anything by this, it is simply a compilation of many different posts. Make of it what you will...

Footage links: https://youtu.be/hbbg-FVij4c https://youtu.be/eTpMkQV_bfk

Most of those people you have captioned as MM, have not been confirmed as MM. They may or may not be. I think we should stop referring to other people in the video as MM.

Just like the stairway man is not confirmed to be MM.

 

[123sniff]

Most of those people you have captioned as MM, have not been confirmed as MM. They may or may not be. I think we should stop referring to other people in the video as MM.

Just like the stairway man is not confirmed to be MM.

Yes I agree, however they're all "Mystery Men" to me. How would you like me to describe them?

 

[Sutton]

Yes I agree, however they're all "Mystery Men" to me. How would you like me to describe them?

Idk, what do you think? I'm not trying to take over, just eliminate confusion. [emoji6]

 

[Look4Clues]

This a quite a comprehensive article about the murders (it has probably has been posted before).

https://www.pressreader.com/


I still think that Jane may have met MM earlier in the night at the OBH in Cottesloe (a well known pub where WCE players drank in the 1990's and BRE is a WCE follower/fan) - and arranged to meet him at the Conti at midnight after her friends had left.

Jane and her friends didn't enter Club Bay View so I don't think she met him there earlier.

If MM is the accused - BRE, remember that he was married at the time and in all likelihood she (and him) wanted to keep it a secret for obvious reasons.

It would also explain why nobody recognised him at the Conti that night.

 

[user29]

I've compiled a timeline of screenshots of available CCTV footage, based on all the recent posts fellow Sleuthers have made. I have used the actual time-stamps on the footage so the timing is accurate in my notes. I am not suggesting anything by this, it is simply a compilation of many different posts. Make of it what you will...

Footage links: https://youtu.be/hbbg-FVij4c https://youtu.be/eTpMkQV_bfk

In terms of the second pic - think this is the first time I have seen a mention of a possibility of MM being in this frame walking and J looking at him (or have I just missed it)

 

[meticulously]

Edited By.Me photo from Google of jane .

Contrary to some opinions about the VICTIMs looks .
I find in the cctv footage she looks extremely attractive.
she may have unfortunately caught the attention of the csk as she waits out the front of hotel at midnight , at this moment his black heart pulses and thinks to go for his premeditated plan to take "a victim" (jmo).
Watching cctv of her standing out the front is rather perverse to watch imo . the way drunken singles are milling around uninhibited thats when the csk wanted her to be his victim, it would be a victory over those certain male competitors too. But he had the New Car for pulling power , impressive enough for success .
I think we all agree the chance of a car pickup is most highest ?
Imo ,There was more than a few guys there at that time who had noticed her vulnerable position & fancied "rescuing" her from being alone .
At that time, I think the only reason she was not witnessed departing was because of the annebriation of the bystanders .

Question still is ;
how did she "dissappear" from the cameras view , Where Did she go?
Theories ?

.

 

[123sniff]

In terms of the second pic - think this is the first time I have seen a mention of a possibility of MM being in this frame walking and J looking at him (or have I just missed it)

Hi user29, please refer to CuriousChum's post #1435

 

[Sutton]

...I think we all agree the chance of a car pickup is most highest ?...

I guess I'm in the minority, but I still vote blitz attack. Idk if MM is even BE. Hang on, let me find some 'support' for my argument.

 

[123sniff]

Idk, what do you think? I'm not trying to take over, just eliminate confusion. [emoji6]

Well, other users have indicated that it could be MM (not necessarily my opinion). What about PMM (Potentially MM)?

 

[Sutton]

In terms of the second pic - think this is the first time I have seen a mention of a possibility of MM being in this frame walking and J looking at him (or have I just missed it)

I think this is what was being discussed at in the last hundred posts of the last thread. It was mixed into the discussion about MM walking with one foot turned inward.

 

[ShellyGale]

The satchel bag has long straps on it and Jane has it slung over so it was resting just behind a hip on the back of her jeans, almost looks like a black pocket. It's definitely there in the footage.

How do you know Jane had a satchel bag? I've never seen that reported anywhere? And it is not visible in the footage. Thanks.

 

[123sniff]

In terms of the second pic - think this is the first time I have seen a mention of a possibility of MM being in this frame walking and J looking at him (or have I just missed it)

I think this is what was being discussed at in the last hundred posts of the last thread. It was mixed into the discussion about MM walking with one foot turned inward.

Which is why I created the summary/timeline of all our posters' theories regarding the CCTV footage.

 

[user29]

Hi user29, please refer to CuriousChum's post #1435

thanks - I really didn't pick up on the significance ,

We almost need a separate video thread!

 

[lampformypath]

Im confused.
JR does have her hair out in the cctv. She flips it over her shoulder at least once.
Im undecided if 2nd pic IS her..but with all the editing color and changes made it could well be.
Certainly looks like MM there.
Whats he even doing? Drinking or taking photos?

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This is freaking me out seeing this guy (CSK) taking photos (at least that's how it looks to me. Sort of leaning back. Could be about to fall down drunk, who knows!). Remember I suggested in the previous Thread 10 #908 that the CSK may have posed as a photographer, handed out fake business card to JR earlier in the night at OBH and said he had a job to do first (a wedding or whatever) and that he'd catch up later "Where will you be, beautiful? Oh, Wow, what a coincidence, I've got to go there to take photos for The Sunday Times/West Social Pages, would love to have a gorgeous photogenic girl like you in a photo. In those days very few cameras about other than professionals at night , no mobiles with cameras, so if you saw a cameraman taking pictures in a pub you'd think nothing of it, not as privacy conscious as we are today. He could have said, come back to my place so I can show you my studio, have all my equipment at a house near here, then I can take you home. Don't tell ya mates, I want you all to myself. (sick , but I could imagine this kind of chat up line). As I suggested before the serial killer in USA The Butcher Baker who killed at least 17 women and raped another 30 (could have killed at least 38 as he had maps showing burials/bodies left with just leaves and twigs over them, all over the place). See link below if you want to check out this horrible guy. What's to say our CSK didn't study various other killers of the past, he certainly sounds a lot like this bloke! Different methods for different girls. Hideous.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2731559/Alaska-serial-killer-dies-decades-murders.html