Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #5

[Coldpizza]

Thread is back open for posting as long everyone can carry on a civil discussion without hurling insults and allegations toward one another.

No problem shutting it down again if the above can't be adhered to.

:bump:

 

[Bartholemeus]

In actual fact the other witness that said he observed Sarah the night before she disappeared, had observed her at 160 Mill Point Road which I believe was her address. She was standing in the foyer with a man described as having short dark wavy hair; facial features pointed. To me that description matches Dorrough. I have posted the newspaper article re this witness sighting previously.

the 3 Dorrough family members - mother, father and Richard Dorrough are buried in the "FC" section of Karrakatta which is the Wesleyan section of Karrakatta - if is situated very close to the rear of the cemetery adjacent to the Karrakatta rape victim location (as described)

Media reports in 1996 with quotes of Ferguson stating they believed the victims were 'blitz attacked'

Wow. It seems you have dug up a whole heap of new information. Well done. Any chance you can provide some sources? I'm particularly interested in the location of the Karra rape. I never knew that was public so you really have outdone yourself in acquiring this information.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Bartholemeus]

Yes. I think she was referring to SR.

Unlikely. This was 2007 and SR was publicly outed as a POI in 2004 so she would have known they were investigating him and wouldn't have needed to ask.<modsnip>

 

[crabstick]

So LW was quite a character in Perth. Quite well known then Parkie? Who on earth are they talking about?

Lee concedes the individual I have named is known as a character in Perth, that he is a possibility.

Unlikely. This was 2007 and SR was publicly outed as a POI in 2004 so she would have known they were investigating him and wouldn't have needed to ask. Maybe it's Moonchild69's old legal mate?

 

[lampformypath]

A weird "co-incidence", there was a Clairemont Serial Killer (note the different spelling) in USA in 1990 who killed 6 women, was sentenced to death. Met women via a health club. Could BC Body Club (which burned down in an act of arson, 2004) have been a hunting ground for our CSK and this area chosen as a copy cat crime?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleophus_Prince_Jr.

 

[elastic]

Unlikely. This was 2007 and SR was publicly outed as a POI in 2004 so she would have known they were investigating him and wouldn't have needed to ask. Maybe it's Moonchild69's old legal mate?

A_____ D_____?
Peter Weygers?
Donald Morey?

All well known in 2004 and more so in 2007?

Clare and Dixie werent well known in Perth... The others I mentioned had been splashed all through the media by then

 

[lampformypath]

This article proves that there IS hope the CSK will be caught. This serial killer, called the "Grim Sleeper" is hideous, they're not even sure how many women he killed more than 20 years ago, but they've got him!

http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world...eper-serial-killer/ar-BBtWRWE?ocid=spartandhp

 

[Bartholemeus]

So LW was quite a character in Perth.

LW was an absolute nobody.

 

[elastic]

LW was an absolute nobody.

Would have to agree.. I think its more than likely A______ D____ that they mentioned. He keeps turning up involved in some infamous cases. McMahon abduction/murder, Claremont Serial Killer case, Susan Christie murder.. To turn up consecutively in these high profile murder mysterys makes you wonder about this "character" and what he may or may not get up to in his private time.

 

[Parkie]

A.D did not do in SMM. With Susan Christie me thinks it is likely...

 

[Parkie]

This article proves that there IS hope the CSK will be caught. This serial killer, called the "Grim Sleeper" is hideous, they're not even sure how many women he killed more than 20 years ago, but they've got him!

http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world...eper-serial-killer/ar-BBtWRWE?ocid=spartandhp

<modsnip> why is this mentioned?

 

[Bartholemeus]

A.D did not do in SMM. With Susan Christie me thinks it is likely...

DM is a monty for SMM.

I haven't read much about Susan Christie but she was going to meet a Doctor shortly before she died. It has been speculated that Doctor was AD and he was the last person to see her alive.

 

[Bartholemeus]

This article proves that there IS hope the CSK will be caught. This serial killer, called the "Grim Sleeper" is hideous, they're not even sure how many women he killed more than 20 years ago, but they've got him!

http://www.msn.com/en-au/news/world...eper-serial-killer/ar-BBtWRWE?ocid=spartandhp

It all comes down to DNA. If they do in fact have DNA or get a DNA profile in the future the CSK will be caught or revealed. If they don't have DNA the unbackable favourite is another Wanda/Beaumont scenario.

 

[Parkie]

DM is a monty for SMM.

I haven't read much about Susan Christie but she was going to meet a Doctor shortly before she died. It has been speculated that Doctor was AD and he was the last person to see her alive.

Yep, the mustard Jaguar seen behind her flat... That tells us all somewhat. Mind you I have seen f/knuckle doctors up there at his same surgery. Makes me make plans. Big ones...

 

[Bartholemeus]

Yep, the mustard Jaguar seen behind her flat... That tells us all somewhat. Mind you I have seen f/knuckle doctors up there at his same surgery. Makes me make plans. Big ones...

MSK? Mundaring Serial Killer?

 

[Parkie]

No. Just quacks masquerading as Doctors.. At Mundering, north of Kala. Chat to Dr. Dunnit, & the equally useful/ inept Dr. Mac. Both sueable as to who it may concern in each case....

 

[crabstick]

Exactly my point. Who are they talking about?
Lee concedes the individual I have named is known as a character in Perth, that he is a possibility.

LW was an absolute nobody.

 

[elastic]

It all comes down to DNA. If they do in fact have DNA or get a DNA profile in the future the CSK will be caught or revealed. If they don't have DNA the unbackable favourite is another Wanda/Beaumont scenario.

I think honestly that they do have DNA for two reasons.

1. They took DNA from almost everyone they possibly could. They always said that 'Future Advances" may help solve the case, eg. hinting they had something in the bag, and in the future they will one day be able to get that vital piece of evidence to get a conviction. eg. DNA.

2. a) There has been reports that LCN (Low Copy Number) expert. Dr Jonathan Whitaker has been attending Perth to work on the case. If true, It means they have the 'Stranger' DNA that was reported in the Post newspaper articles on file as evidence, and it is of very little value because its such a useless partial profile that it can at best rule a few suspects out, and do very little else when narrowing down suspects/POI's that share similar DNA structures and markers. You would not bother to get this expert in to do any analysis using the LCN technique which can build a profile from literally just a few cells that can be left from anything including skin or sweat and can be a millionth of the size of a grain of sand and still be analysed by some experts to build an almost complete profile.

2 b) The LCN technique must have only started to be used in 2015. The reports clearly state that WAPOL visted Dr Jonathan Whitaker and then he visted Perth to 'work on the case' if true then he has not had a huge amount of time to build the DNA profile into something that can be used to rule in and out any suspects with absolute certainty. He must have been able to rule enough of the identifying loci in to make a connection to Karakatta, however I thought they made the Karrakatta connection with the DNA much earlier, around 2008, so I wonder if they specifically targetted building a profile to match against the Karrakatta profile once enough markers and loci could be matched between the two profiles. The reports seem to make it a certainty that a connection was made with DNA, although you never know and the link could be a different forensic link and the DNA profile has only recently been matched to Karrakatta and it was just assumed that the they must have been connected because a few loci matched exactly and that narrowed their focus and made them convinced, and maybe Dr Jonathan Whitaker confirmed this for them recently. I wonder how long it takes to crawl the DNA database of almost a million and try and match a near useless profile to all the others in the Database and whether new software needs to be created for this?

I do think the DNA profile that they obtained (The 'Stranger DNA') must have been useless though for many many years and they new of techniques being worked on in areas where they could one day maybe use of the profile that they had obtained, I am surprised it has not been contaminated given just how sensitive the DNA can be when analysed using LCN techniques.

 

[crabstick]

They have a ballistics database they could adapt. It is more, how long to enter the data, than pull it out. Probably 5 seconds to pull out the match

I think honestly that they do have DNA for two reasons.

1. They took DNA from almost everyone they possibly could. They always said that 'Future Advances" may help solve the case, eg. hinting they had something in the bag, and in the future they will one day be able to get that vital piece of evidence to get a conviction. eg. DNA.

2. a) There has been reports that LCN (Low Copy Number) expert. Dr Jonathan Whitaker has been attending Perth to work on the case. If true, It means they have the 'Stranger' DNA that was reported in the Post newspaper articles on file as evidence, and it is of very little value because its such a useless partial profile that it can at best rule a few suspects out, and do very little else when narrowing down suspects/POI's that share similar DNA structures and markers. You would not bother to get this expert in to do any analysis using the LCN technique which can build a profile from literally just a few cells that can be left from anything including skin or sweat and can be a millionth of the size of a grain of sand and still be analysed by some experts to build an almost complete profile.

2 b) The LCN technique must have only started to be used in 2015. The reports clearly state that WAPOL visted Dr Jonathan Whitaker and then he visted Perth to 'work on the case' if true then he has not had a huge amount of time to build the DNA profile into something that can be used to rule in and out any suspects with absolute certainty. He must have been able to rule enough of the identifying loci in to make a connection to Karakatta, however I thought they made the Karrakatta connection with the DNA much earlier, around 2008, so I wonder if they specifically targetted building a profile to match against the Karrakatta profile once enough markers and loci could be matched between the two profiles. The reports seem to make it a certainty that a connection was made with DNA, although you never know and the link could be a different forensic link and the DNA profile has only recently been matched to Karrakatta and it was just assumed that the they must have been connected because a few loci matched exactly and that narrowed their focus and made them convinced, and maybe Dr Jonathan Whitaker confirmed this for them recently. I wonder how long it takes to crawl the DNA database of almost a million and try and match a near useless profile to all the others in the Database and whether new software needs to be created for this?

I do think the DNA profile that they obtained (The 'Stranger DNA') must have been useless though for many many years and they new of techniques being worked on in areas where they could one day maybe use of the profile that they had obtained, I am surprised it has not been contaminated given just how sensitive the DNA can be when analysed using LCN techniques.

 

[elastic]

<modsnip>why is this mentioned?

Because that case used familial DNA to catch the suspect, and it was reported that familial DNA may lead to an arrest in this case a few years back. There are similarities between how the offender may be caught in the CSK case and how the offender was caught in the Grim Sleeper case.