Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #5

[crabstick]

There is still posts on the GBL in the forum. Its all there
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...er-1996-1997-Perth-Western-Australia-2/page36

I believe mods deleted your GBL posts because they were false. But maybe some of them slipped by. Who knows?

 

[crabstick]

https://books.google.com.au/books?i...MAhUEL6YKHUZsAfkQ6AEIGzAA#v=onepage&q&f=false

Source please.

 

[Sutton]

Crabstick

The Devil's Garden does NOT mention GBL. A link to a book is not a complete source. Please post a page number or location. Thank you.

 

[Sutton]

There is still posts on the GBL in the forum. Its all there
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...er-1996-1997-Perth-Western-Australia-2/page36

Those are not the posts I was referring to. The posts I referred to were deleted.

 

[crabstick]

Ha! Im going to have to dig out the paper version in the pile of books. In the digital version i can find no reference to the yacht club wedding nor the GBL.

Here is reference to the sisters wedding. Ill just have to dig the paper version reference out.

Ciara, a 27-year-old lawyer, who had just got back to Perth from a year overseas and in time for her sister’s wedding, was described by many as “sensible and outgoing.” Friends thought it was improbable that she would have got in a stranger’s car. “It didn’t matter if she’d been drinking, she always kept her head screwed on,” said one friend.
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...h/news-story/b80af943b3f4b839a9956cdffd1aa3ab

 

[crabstick]

Do you have a source?

Those are not the posts I was referring to. The posts I referred to were deleted.

 

[Sutton]

...Here is a cracker Bart. I say I didnt read about Noel Coward in the book.
You say it is, then post a pic of page 88 which has no reference to someone named Noel Coward.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...er-1996-1997-Perth-Western-Australia-2/page36

RSBM. Here's the passage Bart posted:

Buckley tells of another informant who nominated three men and a woman as responsible for the killings and who passed the information to a university professor. 'One of the men was a taxi driver and the woman used to travel in the car with him. She had been a patient at a drug rehabilitation centre two kilometres from Wellard, where Jane Rimmer's body was dumped. The cabbie had been driving the night Jane went missing and couldn't explain his movements between critical hours late that night. The professor passed the information to police, but to my knowledge nothing was done about that. They ignored it.'

We know from his blog and from BF that Noel Coward
• Stated several men and a woman were responsible for the murders
• Claimed one of the men was a taxi driver who provided numerous versions of what he was doing when Jane went missing
• Claimed the taxi driver was friends with a prostitute, M, who was a drug addict
• Passed his information to a college professor in an effort to get the police to listen to his information
• Was dismissed by police

I think it's obvious the book is referring to Noel Coward.

 

[Sutton]

Do you have a source?

No. I clearly stated that it was my opinion in my original post. Sources are for case related facts. My belief that posts may have been deleted is not a case related fact.

 

[crabstick]

No worries. I am going to dig the 'paperback' out tomorrow. Its not an easy job. There is a few boxes of books to look through.

Here is a reference of someone speculating about GBL. Obviously not me but whoever it talks about GBL
I didnt know GBL was freely available at the time "in Australia"

Considering what chemicals may have been found, I have wondered about GBL rim cleaner and whether traces may have been found on clothing of the deceased or litter in the vicinity of the disposal site.

GBL (gamma-Butyrolactone) was a freely obtainable industrial solvent back then, often misused as a party drug and as a date-rape drug (its a precursor to GHB - basically same thing). These days its illegal to import GBL into Australia or possess it for consumption, though its advertised widely for sale on the internet. It's effects are dose dependent and can range from euphoria to death. It was originally used in the 60s as an anaesthetic and has been dubbed "coma in a bottle"
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/claremont-serial-killings.985161/page-38.

RSBM. GBL is not discussed in The Devil's Garden. Please provide a link or page number supporting your statement.

 

[Sutton]

Ha! Im going to have to dig out the paper version in the pile of books. In the digital version i can find no reference to the yacht club wedding nor the GBL...

RSBM. I'm not disputing a yacht club wedding. That fact is widely known. I asked about your statement that Ciara was at the Freshwater Yacht Club the day before she disappeared. This could be true. I have no idea if it is or not.

 

[Bartholemeus]

The question mark is a good start



Here is a cracker Bart. I say I didnt read about Noel Coward in the book.
You say it is, then post a pic of page 88 which has no reference to someone named Noel Coward.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...er-1996-1997-Perth-Western-Australia-2/page36

DM didn't mention his name but the story she refers to is a direct match to Noel's story. Without a doubt she is referring to Noel.

Rather than petty squabbling, it would be easier if you just kept to the facts and/or admit you errors and move on.

 

[Parkie]

The GBH drug was hardly known about in 1996. The reference to the Yacht club is pure speculation. I think the same person was trying to hint ages ago under another name that cg was taken by boat. I remember when Bart caught them out when they said they were at school with JR. He asked them consise questions which proved they were not there.

 

[crabstick]

Not having a lot of joy locating the paperback. It may have been rented out to someone. Will endeavour to find the hardcopy. And I will have to go through the book to find the page numbers.

Both, sections stating that Ciara went to Freshwater Bay Yacht club to help with her sisters wedding just prior. (This stuck with me because it was a catering, something Cutler had been involved with) And Dixie for that matter who was a chef later cleared. Someone who had a raging drug habit. I wont be surprised if they acted together.

*Note, police are looking for a hospitality student that they cannot locate
https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

And the section that discusses Ciaras crime scene and the presence of GBL, chemicals as stated above for cleaning vehicles, and in the printing industry.
It does appear, the person may have ripped the clothes line down at the back of the printing shop and used the rope to strangulate them. (speculation according news reports)

Cutting throats in a new Commodore sounds like a stupid idea. Not something easy to clean up before work.

Alarm bells began ringing for Denis and Una Glennon the next morning when their daughter missed a hairdresser’s appointment and then failed to show up at her sister’s hens’ party that was organised for that afternoon.
https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/w...ial-killer-nightmare-begins-for-third-family/

 

[crabstick]

Thats correct Parkie, but not under another name. GBL, aka liquid ecstasy, often sold as fantasy in Perth. Ive made enquiries with people. People wouldn't have known.

And Im still adamant that I read that Ciara had been to the yacht club in organising her sisters wedding, and it was in a book, because it was describing the lead up to her disappearance. The reason I remember this, is because I felt, if the girls went by boat, it would be straight down the hill, into the open gates of the Claremont Yacht Club. (3 minutes)
If it had been Freshwater Bay, then that would mean the car would have to head around to Peppermint Grove to get to the yacht club.

The easy answer is, did Cairas sister have her Wedding at the Freshwater Bay Yacht club?

Yes, speculation on that the girls had been taken by car down to a boat and taken out around to nearby marinas then transported in to their dump sites, off the road, and sight of police. It would mean the least path of risk in being discovered. It may explain the bricklayer sighting the dirty taxi that he never saw again. That the car was heading back to Two Rocks marina.
The dirty taxi may have been bogged? The bricklayer stated the car was a Ford Falcon station wagon? He felt someone was in the back.
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...h/news-story/b80af943b3f4b839a9956cdffd1aa3ab

Being mindful, police are looking for someone involved in the hospitality industry.

I have to go.

The GBH drug was hardly known about in 1996. The reference to the Yacht club is pure speculation. I think the same person was trying to hint ages ago under another name that cg was taken by boat. I remember when Bart caught them out when they said they were at school with JR. He asked them consise questions which proved they were not there.

Police investigate disturbing report that woman had drink spiked at a Quinns Rocks beach before sexual assault
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...t/news-story/e23712e522d6089e1ad6b03a0ccdd3ed

THE state’s sexual assault support services say drink spiking is a common occurrence but vastly under-reported.
http://www.examiner.com.au/story/3509877/spiking-of-drinks-common-occurrence/

 

[Bartholemeus]

Not having a lot of joy locating the paperback. It may have been rented out to someone. Will endeavour to find the hardcopy. And I will have to go through the book to find the page numbers.

Both, sections stating that Ciara went to Freshwater Bay Yacht club to help with her sisters wedding just prior. (This stuck with me because it was a catering, something Cutler had been involved with) And Dixie for that matter who was a chef later cleared. Someone who had a raging drug habit. I wont be surprised if they acted together.

*Note, police are looking for a hospitality student that they cannot locate
https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

And the section that discusses Ciaras crime scene and the presence of GBL, chemicals as stated above for cleaning vehicles, and in the printing industry.
It does appear, the person may have ripped the clothes line down at the back of the printing shop and used the rope to strangulate them. (speculation according news reports)

Cutting throats in a new Commodore sounds like a stupid idea. Not something easy to clean up before work.

No one gives a flying frisbee whether or not CG went to the Freshie the day before she was abducted. It's not important.

But your comments regarding GBL and other comments being at the site are not based on fact. It would be great if you could please refrain from stating this is fact and be clear that it is your theory.

 

[Peter Kurten]

I think if we keep touching on John of UK's boat theory, it may scare new posters off. Not what this thread needs at all.

 

[Sutton]

Crabstick

We've been discussing the links to your claims for the last 50-75 posts. That's a bit excessive, IMO.

In a previous thread Bart posted a partial list of your claims and asked that you provide a source. No source was ever provided.

This thread is dedicated to the discussion of the CSK. Our continued bickering is a distraction from and an insult to his victims. Please post the source for your recent claims--either a link to an article or the title and page number for printed material.

I am not trying to be petty. I've made plenty of mistakes and posted slightly incorrect details. We need to correct these errors so they don't become part of the lexicon.

Please post your source and let's move forward.

 

[elastic]

This is an interesting article you once posted Sutton. It specfically says the following:

Irish beauty Ciara Glennon may have been raped before she was murdered and dumped by a Ripper-style maniac.

Her naked body was discovered near a popular fishing spot 40 miles north of Perth yesterday, three weeks after she had gone missing from her Australian home.

A 23-year-old labourer found her lying 20 yards from a pathway, covered in shrubbery.

Her clothes had all been stripped off and officers identified her by the jewellery she was wearing.

Police refused to confirm she had been raped and did not say how and when she died.

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/STRIP...IPLE+KILLER+AFTER+MISSING+IRISH...-a061104395

How much of that information do we know is not factual.

It was Jane Rimmer who was dumped naked? she was not a beauty queen, but yes there has always been a suspicion she was raped.

But could the information regarding Ciara be wrong and she was also found naked, and HAD been raped?
-------

This article mentioned a ripper style killing:

Aussie cops say they are closing in on the serial killer who butchered Irish beauty Ciara Glennon.

They have drawn up a psychological profile of the Ripper-style assassin, suspected of killing two other attractive blondes. They believe he is a loner with a job, a car buff who drives everywhere and polishes his vehicle every day. Detectives have already questioned several men.

A 20-year-old labourer stumbled across Ciara's naked body near a popular fishing haunt 40 miles north of Perth.

Police in the west Australian capital have still not revealed how the 27-year-old lawyer died and refuse to confirm if she was raped.

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/WE'LL...+Aussie+cops+vow+to+nab+`jumpy'...-a061104056

So if we assume butchered is accurate, then could that be the cuts around the neck, maybe the killer/rapist was so enraged he didnt just cut her throat, he did it over and over and stabbed the neck area before leaving the body, HYPOTHETICALLY if this happened I would assume it was done at the dump site and rain has washed all the evidence away into the sand etc, Blood dries up pretty quickly with dead roadkill and carcasses so with the shrubs covering her there wouldnt have been much blood around the body.

How accurate are these two articles mentioned above. They definitely do suggest rape, which goes back to Karrakatta and what we know with that crime.

 

[elastic]

[h=1]STRIPPED AND THEN DUMPED; COPS HUNT TRIPLE KILLER AFTER MISSING IRISH BEAUTY IS FOUND DEAD IN OZ.[/h]There are striking similarities between Ciara's abduction and murder and the cases of 23-year-old Jane Rimmer and 18-year-old Sarah Spiers.

Childcare worker Jane was also found murdered last August.

She had been stripped naked and stabbed to death.

Her body was found in swampy bushland 40 miles south of Perth, three months after she vanished.

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/STRIP...IPLE+KILLER+AFTER+MISSING+IRISH...-a061104395

This article specifically mentions that Jane had been stabbed to death, stripped naked and dumped, we have often assumed raped.

Where did these two articles originally originate from, which news papers? they certainly share alot of information not thought to be known to the public and kept in the secret realms of WAPOL.

 

[crabstick]

Slitting throats and draining blood sounds like fantasy more than fact.

Of course Ciara being at the yacht club involved in the catering in the lead up is important, because Cutler disappeared post hospitality event at the Parmelia Hilton hotel.

Ciara may have met someone, or that someone in the hospitality industry remade the connection at midnight.

Heres a scenario the next night "Hey! Im working at your sisters wedding. Remember me. Need a lift!"

And police are trying to find a hospitality student who was under the radar with no fixed address in a Claremont share house. Who has vanished into thin air.
https://www.scribd.com/doc/289515831/POST-Newspaper-for-14th-of-November-2015

Take your frisbee and throw it elsewhere