Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #5

[delbertGrady]

This particular incident is the most significant for mine.

The time frame doesn't allow for a stranger to talk SS into getting into the car, as has been said, the time taken to hang up the reciever, walk across the road and be witnessed waiting for her cab could only leave a few minutes at most.
I doubt a blitz attack by a sole operator could be pulled off in that time either.
It appears she just hopped into a car and disappeared.h

The question is, what type of car would someone who's just rung a cab get into within a few minutes, almost without question?

a taxi.

 

[BenJones84]

I wonder if the CSK got rid of his own blood soaked clothing and the victims (Jane Rimmers specifically) clothes at the same time, or if he kept his own clothing and just hid the victims? She was naked so I wonder whether the clothes/ underwear were ever located close by or if she was totally naked, if any item was ever found near by.

Kinda like this?

 

[CSK?]

Thanks for the write up GreenDevil, I agree with pretty much everything you theorized however with a Taxi only a few minutes away I find it very unlikely SS would accept a lift from anyone other than a Taxi, a Police officer or a friend. I just can't see her taking a ride from someone she didn't know or had only met once or twice unless faced with no other way of getting home to her friends house.

There has been so many articles and discussions about all the taxi drivers being DNA tested e.t.c but in the same breath articles have stated about a huge black market taxi service operating, I just can't see police tracking down every black market illegal taxi driver if any of them.

because of the small time frame between booking and waiting for a taxi I truly believe the only car SS got into that night was a Taxi, either from Swan taxi services or an illegally operated Taxi, to me the only other option would be someone she knew enough to consider a friend.

As for everything else you touched on, I think it makes for a very reasonable theory of what happened to SS that night.

 

[88mph]

You're right, the time frame is quite short, however I think it's still possible that someone could talk her into the car, it would only take a few seconds. It would need to be tested. I would say it's possible that she got into a car with someone in that time, if she knew them, but that can't be confirmed.

I'd say it's unlikely but possible that she knew the CSK and thats purely trusting the police have conducted extensive checks into her background.

I'm assuming that calling a taxi then abandoning the reservation wasn't really a polite thing to do back then, or was it??

Would SS be the kind of person to abandon her booking??

 

[Elwood_1]

Yes, speculation on that the girls had been taken by car down to a boat and taken out around to nearby marinas then transported in to their dump sites, off the road, and sight of police. It would mean the least path of risk in being discovered. It may explain the bricklayer sighting the dirty taxi that he never saw again. That the car was heading back to Two Rocks marina.
The dirty taxi may have been bogged? The bricklayer stated the car was a Ford Falcon station wagon? He felt someone was in the back.
http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...h/news-story/b80af943b3f4b839a9956cdffd1aa3ab

Woolcoot Rd is about 8,000 metres from Kwinana Beach. Assuming a 30 second time of flight you would need to hit the beach in your boat at about a 45 degree angle, and at just over the speed of sound to make it there. Assuming no aerodynamic drag, of course.


The landing would be pretty ugly though (buckle up), and you would probably need to trailer the wreckage home.


But on the bright side, that would get you up to about 17,000 feet, so you would have a really nice view of the city before you started your descent. The only real problem is that the sonic boom would probably tip off the neighbors that you were up to something. And the plume of dust from when you hit would certainly make your car dirty. Oh, yes. Two trips through the car wash that day.

 

[GreenDevil]

Thanks for the write up GreenDevil, I agree with pretty much everything you theorized however with a Taxi only a few minutes away I find it very unlikely SS would accept a lift from anyone other than a Taxi, a Police officer or a friend. I just can't see her taking a ride from someone she didn't know or had only met once or twice unless faced with no other way of getting home to her friends house.

There has been so many articles and discussions about all the taxi drivers being DNA tested e.t.c but in the same breath articles have stated about a huge black market taxi service operating, I just can't see police tracking down every black market illegal taxi driver if any of them.

because of the small time frame between booking and waiting for a taxi I truly believe the only car SS got into that night was a Taxi, either from Swan taxi services or an illegally operated Taxi, to me the only other option would be someone she knew enough to consider a friend.

As for everything else you touched on, I think it makes for a very reasonable theory of what happened to SS that night.

I believe that if it was a bogus taxi that other drivers would've made reports of seeing them/it in the area. Especially in SS's case as per what Peter Kurten said, it's likely that the legitimate Taxi that SS called actually drove past the vehicle that SS got into.

Furthermore, if we consider the abduction vehicle in JR's case was a Holden Commodore, it is highly unlikely that it was a bogus Taxi, as Commodores were very rarely almost never used as Taxis, and if one was getting around as a bogus Taxi, legit Taxi drivers would have spotted it easily as it would have been odd.

If we theories that all girls were abducted using a Holden Commodore, then I believe we can rule out the bogus Taxi theory. Also, Macro put countless man hours into this theory, both bogus and legitimate Taxis and exhausted all avenues of enquiry, and I believe they would have ruled it out.

 

[Bartholemeus]

Regarding the method of SS abduction

We need to take into account that it was the night of Australia Day. A lot of people out and about. Fireworks on The Swan in front of the city, big crowds at Kings Park and The City. A lot of people at pubs and clubs all over Perth.

SS had no knowledge that her taxi was 3-4 minutes away. Given the busy night right across the city it's not hard to imagine she was leaning on that bollard thinking "how long am I going to wait for this taxi? Will it be hours?". I know in the pre-smart technology era that sort of stuff was normal.

I also noticed people taking at face value friends and family saying "she wasn't than inebriated" and "she would never get in a car with a stranger" etc. I'm not saying she was quite drink, nor she necessarily got in a car with a stranger, nor she wasn't an intelligent and street wise woman BUT.......

Let's be realistic here. Young people do get trashed on alcohol. Young people do display risky behaviour. Even the best and most well-intentioned young adults do it.

The most likely scenario is as GreenDevil says because of the following reasons;

1. The car that didn't proceed through the lights. How can this be explained? It's possible the car turned into Chatsworth Tce, saw the news the next day and thought, "wow, that was me but if I say anything the police will no doubt search my property and I have a hydro set-up or kiddy- etc so I will stay silent". But why has this person never come forward? Another option is the car turned down Chatsworth Tce to stay at a friends home, got up the next day, left the country because he/she is a foreigner. Possible but very unlikely.

2. It was Australia Day. SS had no idea how long a taxi would take and it's plausible that she was thinking she might have been in for a 1-2 hour wait. She had no reason to suspect anything untowards would happen because the CSK attacks hadn't started yet (as in widespread media coverage).

3. There was a car seen when CG was abducted who also never forward. That's 2 out of 3 abductions where a car was seen and neither occupants have come forward.


The other option is blitz attack. If we assume that the CSK also did Karra then he's adept at blitz attack abduction. He's able to get a girl without her making too much noise and without her seeing him. An ambush at a phone box is a great idea except how did he know a girl would call a taxi and then wait across the road? Surely a better spot is in the walk through at the set of offices right next to the phone box? It's possible he started there and crossed the road but if this were the case he would have grabbed her before crossed the road. If he was lying in wait near BC Body Club then he would have had to get her to the back of the Olifants building and walk along the Hwy which is very risky.

I think the evidence we have available strongly suggests the girls got into cars.

Which poses the question - why have the media been saying police think they were blitz attacked?

 

[Sutton]

...I believe it's most likely that the driver of that vehicle stopped, had a small conversation with SS during which he gained her trust and gave off the persona that he was a harmless person. I think it's most likely that he had met SS previously, but in a very limited capacity of which no connection could be made. An example of this is a clerk behind the counter at the MVR. It was enough to gain her confidence in any case. SS accepted a lift and willingly got into the vehicle. The reason I discount a blitz attack in this instance is due to the limited time frame (3 mins), she was standing out in the open and easily visible to witnesses, which would have made a blitz attack "high risk"...

RSBM. Thanks for taking the time to write this.

Do you think SS just happened to 'know' the CSK? Or are you suggesting he targeted and stalked her specifically?

Do you think his original intent was to kill his victim that night? Or did he have to kill her because he knew her? Or something went wrong?

 

[GreenDevil]

RSBM. Thanks for taking the time to write this.

Do you think SS just happened to 'know' the CSK? Or are you suggesting he targeted and stalked her specifically?

Do you think his original intent was to kill his victim that night? Or did he have to kill her because he knew her? Or something went wrong?

I think it's a possibility that they may have had some previous interaction, but it's unlikely. The reason I thinks it's possible is due to the type of job I believe the CSK has. Which is an ordinary 9-5 job like a clerk at the MVR, or a checkout operator or perhaps even a school teacher. I am not suggesting that they knew each other but they may have had some sort of interaction that the CSK used to gain her confidence. But trying to find that connection would be like a needle in a hay stack. I believe a potential line of enquiry WRT SS is the obtaining of her drivers licence if she had one, perhaps the licence issuer or driving test instructor???

I think he intended to kill SS, that's part of the thrill he received from the whole situation.

 

[JackHigh]

Thanks for the write up GreenDevil, I agree with pretty much everything you theorized however with a Taxi only a few minutes away I find it very unlikely SS would accept a lift from anyone other than a Taxi, a Police officer or a friend. I just can't see her taking a ride from someone she didn't know or had only met once or twice unless faced with no other way of getting home to her friends house.

There has been so many articles and discussions about all the taxi drivers being DNA tested e.t.c but in the same breath articles have stated about a huge black market taxi service operating, I just can't see police tracking down every black market illegal taxi driver if any of them.

because of the small time frame between booking and waiting for a taxi I truly believe the only car SS got into that night was a Taxi, either from Swan taxi services or an illegally operated Taxi, to me the only other option would be someone she knew enough to consider a friend.

As for everything else you touched on, I think it makes for a very reasonable theory of what happened to SS that night.

Thats how i feel, to happen so swiftly it needs to be either the Taxi she thought she was getting, a cop or a friend.

Any known links between the victims would have been well researched so it would be safe to say its not someone familiar enough to get her to ditch her cab and jump in, in a few minutes.
I havent read anything that supports a cop being involved.

Im leaning towards a taxi for all the reasons that the investigators looked there in the early days, it just fits.

The question is, is it an on duty legitimate driver, a bogus taxi or is it possible the offender is a taxi driver who was off duty on the nights in question, in his own car, prowling the streets, saw SS, knew her from picking her up in his cab plenty of times before, pulled over, offered her a ride and she disappears.

 

[JackHigh]

The one thing that has featured in almost every facet of this case is the taxi.
The woman who broke her leg jumping from a cab after being attacked, especially considering what she described as a sudden attack from behind, a blitz if you like.I
t was what SS was waiting for, what the other two may have been looking for, what the bricklayer saw, what the Police initially thought, and lastly, what Droc was so adamant about.

Nothing else comes close to covering all those bases.

IMO anyway.

 

[JackHigh]

How do we know the S1 VS was the taxi, is it possible she had been in one earlier in the day, rubbed up against someone who had ridden in one, whilst dancing at the club?

 

[GreenDevil]

How do we know the S1 VS was the taxi, is it possible she had been in one earlier in the day, rubbed up against someone who had ridden in one, whilst dancing at the club?

I believe I've read somewhere they the fibers were lifted from such an area on the body where that would not be possible or extremely unlikely. Have you read what I write previously about the Taxi theory either bogus or legit, it's very unlikely that Commodores were used as Taxis.

 

[firestarter]

I believe I've read somewhere they the fibers were lifted from such an area on the body where that would not be possible or extremely unlikely. Have you read what I write previously about the Taxi theory either bogus or legit, it's very unlikely that Commodores were used as Taxis.

The fibers were linked to JR.
It is possible the same car was used for SS but it could of well been a falcon taxi that stopped at the lights or any other vehicle.

 

[JackHigh]

If ever there was a time in local manufacturing when the Commodore and Falcon looked similar enough to confuse the two, especially from a distance and at night, it would be during the VR/VS Commodore and EF Falcon era of 93-96.
The rear ends of wagons even more so.

 

[JackHigh]

Perhaps the abduction vehicle wasn't a VS. Is it possible the girls were taken somewhere by one means, subject to whatever took place and then taken to the discovery sites by a VS commodore?
Infact if you think about it, it makes perfect sense.
Lets say a taxi was used, it wouldnt be able to sit idle all night whilst whatever happened, happened, so the taxi brings the girls to the murder site, then returns to the streets. Another vehicle is used for disposal.

If we accept that the fibres were in such a place, we must then consider that whatever JR was subjected to happened before she was placed in the VS or whilst in the car.

 

[GreenDevil]

Perhaps the abduction vehicle wasn't a VS. Is it possible the girls were taken somewhere by one means, subject to whatever took place and then taken to the discovery sites by a VS commodore?
Infact if you think about it, it makes perfect sense.
Lets say a taxi was used, it wouldnt be able to sit idle all night whilst whatever happened, happened, so the taxi brings the girls to the murder site, then returns to the streets. Another vehicle is used for disposal.

If we accept that the fibres were in such a place, we must then consider that whatever JR was subjected to happened before she was placed in the VS or whilst in the car.

So you're suggesting more the one person is involved in these murders? That's even more unlikely, in my opinion.

 

[firestarter]

So you're suggesting more the one person is involved in these murders? That's even more unlikely, in my opinion.

Or possibly picked up in taxi.
Taken home to conduct the murder.
Then transferred to Drop of vehicle.
Many taxi drivers would have a personal vehicle Imo.

 

[NotAClue]

Thats how i feel, to happen so swiftly it needs to be either the Taxi she thought she was getting, a cop or a friend.

Any known links between the victims would have been well researched so it would be safe to say its not someone familiar enough to get her to ditch her cab and jump in, in a few minutes.
I havent read anything that supports a cop being involved.

Im leaning towards a taxi for all the reasons that the investigators looked there in the early days, it just fits.

The question is, is it an on duty legitimate driver, a bogus taxi or is it possible the offender is a taxi driver who was off duty on the nights in question, in his own car, prowling the streets, saw SS, knew her from picking her up in his cab plenty of times before, pulled over, offered her a ride and she disappears.

If it were a taxi, would it have been randomly driving around the streets or parked away on Gugeri St or some other quieter location and once a girl leaving a club was observed, went back to car and then drove around? At 2am there would be plenty of people wanting taxis and hailing them if it were just driving around the streets. It was either pure chance (3min window) the "taxi" arrived after SS had called a cab or is it possible the CSK saw SS leave and presume she was heading to the phonebox, went on foot to taxi and then drove to Stirling Rd??

 

[firestarter]

If it were a taxi, would it have been randomly driving around the streets or parked away on Gugeri St or some other quieter location and once a girl leaving a club was observed, went back to car and then drove around? At 2am there would be plenty of people wanting taxis and hailing them if it were just driving around the streets. It was either pure chance (3min window) the "taxi" arrived after SS had called a cab or is it possible the CSK saw SS leave and presume she was heading to the phonebox, went on foot to taxi and then drove to Stirling Rd??

Or another taxi driver other than the one that accepted the job heard the call on the radio and picked up SS before the allocated taxi arrived.
I believe that's how the system worked back then.
A call was put out over the radio and whoever replied first got the job.
Imo