Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, Jun 1997 #5

[Meligator]

another piece of the puzzle that doesn't make sense is the trip to the "east" - she flew to Korea but looks like she went to Japan as well ( from the letterhead) The hotel (nikko) was an Airport hotel, I actually stayed there in December 1999, I was flying JAL - London to Auckland and had a 16hr layover so the room came with the flight.

Typically you would stay at an airport hotel, if you had an 12+ wait between flights and that would be organized by the airline, you had an early flight out and the place you had vacant was a long journey to the airport, or you had a middle of the night arrival and you stayed their before travelling on to your destination. I cant imagine Narita airport is a good place to base yourself for a trip to see the sights.

No one even knew she was holidaying in the East ? Not even her friend she was living with before she left seems to have enquired about her trip, not her family, collogues or friends ? I though maybe she had keep it secret and avoided conversation, but why then mention her trip to the east in the letter ?

The impression I have built from her sisters, and extended circle is they all seem pretty consumed with their own feelings, life, and well being not so much of others .. The fact that know one seems to have enquired about her trip is pretty sad.

Yes, another super odd part of this story. I don’t know that she was holidaying in the east. I can’t remember what words she used in her letter to Sally, but I remember thinking she was possibly describing an unusually long layover or delay. Could her flight to Korea have been rerouted last minute to Japan for some reason? Was Japan a purposeful stop so that no one would know she went through Korea? It’s all so confusing

 

[KiwiNZ]

From the letter below -

"I finally arrived in England after a most interesting visit to the East"

I feel like a interesting visits is longer than a layover lol but I am not sure

Its so frustrating nobody seems to have asked her even the smallest thing about her trip - you go for a meal the night before you leave and you don't even discuss trip plans ? like I am stopping off in Asia ? what airline your flying with, how long the flight is ? where are you going ? when do you arrive in the UK, I mean that is just polite conversation by most peoples books

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Could the "most interesting" reference possibly mean that it wasn't a scheduled stop and for some reason the plane had to stop there for awhile.

"I finally arrived in England after a most interesting visit to the East"

 

[Laughing]

From the letter below -

"I finally arrived in England after a most interesting visit to the East"

I feel like a interesting visits is longer than a layover lol but I am not sure

Its so frustrating nobody seems to have asked her even the smallest thing about her trip - you go for a meal the night before you leave and you don't even discuss trip plans ? like I am stopping off in Asia ? what airline your flying with, how long the flight is ? where are you going ? when do you arrive in the UK, I mean that is just polite conversation by most peoples books

bbm

Are any postcards available from this "most interesting visit?" OR just the letter from England on the hotel stationary?

I have a postcard my Grandmother sent from Japan.

jmho ymmv lrr

 

[KiwiNZ]

bbm

Are any postcards available from this "most interesting visit?" OR just the letter from England on the hotel stationary?

I have a postcard my Grandmother sent from Japan.

jmho ymmv lrr

Just a letter from the UK on the hotel stationary is the only reference I have seen - there is a picture of it on here but pictures are not easy to locate on websleuth .. unless I am doing it wrong

 

[KiwiNZ]

Could the "most interesting" reference possibly mean that it wasn't a scheduled stop and for some reason the plane had to stop there for awhile.

good point

I can see from a Korean Air flight plan it would take you straight over Japan when flying Brisbane to Korea.

 

[Estelle]

Yes, another super odd part of this story. I don’t know that she was holidaying in the east. I can’t remember what words she used in her letter to Sally, but I remember thinking she was possibly describing an unusually long layover or delay. Could her flight to Korea have been rerouted last minute to Japan for some reason? Was Japan a purposeful stop so that no one would know she went through Korea? It’s all so confusing

I also flew to London/Europe via Japan around that time. It was one of the cheapest ways to get there then. I stayed at the airport hotel overnight which was free and included dinner and breakfast. I did not go into Tokyo as there was not enough time but I really enjoyed my stay there. You could do this if your layover was less than 24 hours. I think the South Korea layover would have been just a few hours on the way. Perhaps Marion's travel agent suggested this route so she could take advantage of this offer and arrive before dinner time. You could then choose one of many capitals in Europe to end your journey. I chose Helsinki then Amsterdam. Marion could have chosen somewhere else in Europe then London. It would not have been a holiday in the East - just an economical way to get there with a free sleepover on the way so you felt more relaxed when you got to your final destination. I think Marion could have described it as "interesting" as she got a feel for the Japanese hospitality, culture and food at the airport hotel. I really felt spoiled by hotel staff.

 

[SaintGertrude]

I certainly agree with this, tutoring and a cash arrangement or some thing similar. Or a quaint little B and B.

Personally I think Marion did come back and she is /was living a long way from South East Queensland or anywhere she lived before. Perhaps South Australia or Western Australia?? Tasmania?

If Marion took off with an investor then maybe he did well with her money investing in stocks and shares. In October 1997 the stock market had a fall so any investor may have used the opportunity for long term investments.
The only lingering question would be any medical care or dentistry she may have needed.
Otherwise with good investments like for example in Amazon company shares and somewhere to live with a guy she may have remained hidden all this time in another country far away from Australia.

 

[FOXINBOX]

My first impressions, and from this distance, with a lack of decent facts, Fox thinks - window dressing [The letters] aside.
1. Serious consideration must be given to identity theft. I'm thinking she never left Australian soil.
2. Weird Asian trips, if they're real, might be explained if she got herself involved in some nasty smuggling stuff. She strikes me as being the gullible sort - all those marriages - she's believing what is told to her, and living to regret it.

 

[Itsapuzzle]

Itsapuzzle when you mention a preparatory school for boys in that area there is always Icklesham Primary School and an Oast House is very nearby as well.

H'mm, yes, could be a school like that for sure. Have been wondering about the Round Square conferences again, looking in Trove ... could Marion have made a Remakel connection then, back in 1995. Was Luxembourg involved in Round Square? France, per chance? Will have a better look.

 

[FOXINBOX]

Is there stamped passport entries for the countries Marion visited or is the proof that Marion was travelling coming from her letters? sorry, just can't read all those back pages without my foxy brain exploding

 

[Curiosity Cat]

If Marion took off with an investor then maybe he did well with her money investing in stocks and shares. In October 1997 the stock market had a fall so any investor may have used the opportunity for long term investments.
The only lingering question would be any medical care or dentistry she may have needed.
Otherwise with good investments like for example in Amazon company shares and somewhere to live with a guy she may have remained hidden all this time in another country far away from Australia.

Yes Saint Gertrude, her medical needs is one of the areas unexplained, but dental doesnt have an ID requirements and no medicare rebates requiring a Medicare card. That's why i believe she has a new identity. Getting another Deed Poll name which leads me to thinking about her being Somebody Wilson. She can revert to that name without getting any further ID . Just a marriage certificate, which she probably already had. Struck me from a comment on the Podcast they had been looking for Marion Barter or Remakel. Sorry if i missed something!!

 

[Curiosity Cat]

Yes, another super odd part of this story. I don’t know that she was holidaying in the east. I can’t remember what words she used in her letter to Sally, but I remember thinking she was possibly describing an unusually long layover or delay. Could her flight to Korea have been rerouted last minute to Japan for some reason? Was Japan a purposeful stop so that no one would know she went through Korea? It’s all so confusing

Around that time, 1996 or 1997, i recall Japan Airlines had well priced tickets to Europe, flying via Japan with a layover for one night and flying over the North Pole.

Why didn't she mention this before she left? Weird.

 

[KiwiNZ]

I also flew to London/Europe via Japan around that time. It was one of the cheapest ways to get there then. I stayed at the airport hotel overnight which was free and included dinner and breakfast. I did not go into Tokyo as there was not enough time but I really enjoyed my stay there. You could do this if your layover was less than 24 hours. I think the South Korea layover would have been just a few hours on the way. Perhaps Marion's travel agent suggested this route so she could take advantage of this offer and arrive before dinner time. You could then choose one of many capitals in Europe to end your journey. I chose Helsinki then Amsterdam. Marion could have chosen somewhere else in Europe then London. It would not have been a holiday in the East - just an economical way to get there with a free sleepover on the way so you felt more relaxed when you got to your final destination. I think Marion could have described it as "interesting" as she got a feel for the Japanese hospitality, culture and food at the airport hotel. I really felt spoiled by hotel staff.

The flight was Brisbane direct to Korea which has been confirmed, so we cant figure how she ended up in Japan - or at least ended up with letterhead from a Narita Airport Hotel.

1. the flight path goes over Japan, was there an emergency stop during the flight.
2. Did she go to Korea and then catch another flight to Japan ?
3. was it someone's else stationary she wrote the letter on ?

I cant understand if she was planning sometime in Asia she wouldn't have at least mentioned it to someone

 

[KiwiNZ]

Is there stamped passport entries for the countries Marion visited or is the proof that Marion was travelling coming from her letters? sorry, just can't read all those back pages without my foxy brain exploding

she phoned her daughter from the UK, letters, postcards and gifts to many people - all confirm it is Marions handwriting etc... all from southern UK

 

[KiwiNZ]

Around that time, 1996 or 1997, i recall Japan Airlines had well priced tickets to Europe, flying via Japan with a layover for one night and flying over the North Pole.

Why didn't she mention this before she left? Weird.

her flight has been confirmed as Brisbane to Korea - if she did then fly to Japan to get a connecting flight to Europe or the UK why ? that's like flying backwards to go forwards, odd.

All we have is the letterhead from the hotel in Japan, put posted from the UK .. to suggest she was there but was it her paper or someone else ?

all very odd lol

 

[FOXINBOX]

Dammit, I can't access the podcast. I'm relying on 7News's web page, but a payphone, from Tunbridge Wells to Australia. That's crazy. Is there any way of verifying the location apart from Marion's say so? No identity of the old ladies she was talking to? Any other locations in the south of England? I'm good for various contacts that might help.
If her family were to go to court to have Marion declared legally dead, they could then gain control of her finances, and they might be able to work out what happened. This was done by the Lamplugh family in London, and by the Strehles in California.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Can you not access the podcast on this site? The Lady Vanishes on acast

Unlike another site that I used to use, with the Acast one I didn't have to register. Or is it a geographical thing ?

Dammit, I can't access the podcast

 

[FOXINBOX]

Can you not access the podcast on this site? The Lady Vanishes on acast

Unlike another site that I used to use, with the Acast one I didn't have to register. Or is it a geographical thing ?

Thank you for the link, it looks like it's going to work

 

[FOXINBOX]

Wikipedia says Marion's passport never left the country, so how was she travelling?