Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, Jun 1997 #5

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  • #941
  • #942
  • #943
  • #944
Could Marion have stayed here at local bands farmhouse in Rye. I think she was more classical music though. (Wasn't her ex husband a greyhound breeder). I will try to find out if there was B&B there at all.
The Cutting Crew - Official Band Site

Married to Nikki, tour manager, they foster & adopt Greyhounds at their old farmhouse near Rye in East Sussex,
 
  • #945
  • #946
Referring to the postcard Marion sent saying she was staying at a farmhouse near Rye.
I don't think anyone has worked out yet who she may have been staying with so just putting it out there.
 
  • #947
31st January 2022, Byron Bay, New South Wakes has been announced for the next inquest.
 
  • #948
  • #949
End of Janary, so not long to go now.
 
  • #950
  • #951
Let's hope something positive comes out of it.
I wonder if we will find out who the mysterious Mazz was mentioned in Marion's postcard.
I put forward to Lady vanishes team that in 1997 there may have been a police lady in Rye called Marianne (nickname Mazz) who sometimes worked front desk at Rye and Hastings police stations. Mazz was married to a fellow policeman who was quite well known in Rye town.
Mazz has a mention on page 16 of the following but in 2013. I cannot find confirmation that she was there in 1997.
https://www.dutysheet.com/Special_Impact/Special_Impact_Issue_10.pdf
 
Last edited:
  • #952
I wonder if we will find out who the mysterious Mazz was mentioned in Marion's postcard.
I put forward to Lady vanishes team that in 1997 there may have been a police lady in Rye called Marianne (nickname Mazz) who sometimes worked front desk at Rye and Hastings police stations. Mazz was married to a fellow policeman who was quite well known in Rye town.
Mazz has a mention on page 16 of the following but in 2013. I cannot find confirmation that she was there in 1997.
https://www.dutysheet.com/Special_Impact/Special_Impact_Issue_10.pdf
Could be a connection here as according to freebmd site it appears that the policeman had a previous wife before Mazz who lived in Australia for some time.
I hope that detectives have looked at Marion's overseas trip to the UK in fine detail
 
  • #953
Re-posting this. Should anything be changed or added?

Marion Barter TIMELINE with credit to Mel 1303

(Printed here so we can add to or edit it. What's missing?)

October 3, 1945- Born in Marrickville

1950ish- moved to Brisbane.

1957ish- Moved to Oyster Bay

Dec 1967- Marries Johnny Warren (ep 2)

Tuesday 3 Sept 1968 to Thursday 9 January 1969. Johnny & Marion’s trip to the UK (Marion visited Amsterdam for the first time on this trip)

Monday 25 November 1968 Johnny played his last game for Stockport County Reserves in the Northern Floodlit League (he never managed to play in their 1st team) so what were Marion & Johnny doing in the period before they left the UK?

What happened in this period with Johnny and Marion?

1971- Splits from Johnny Warren, suffers nervous breakdown (according to John Economis)

1972- Began working with Janice White

1972- Began relationship with Stewart Brown

May 1973- Sally born

Oct 1974- Owen born

1975- Left Stewart, took children to Queensland. Returned to try and rekindle relationship when father-in-law was diagnosed with cancer

1977- Married Stewart Brown

1979- Divorced Stewart Brown, moved to Lapstone

?- Ray Barter moves in, after a few dates, having never met the children.

June 9 1985- Marriage to Ray

1988- Marion, Ray and Sally (Owen?) move to Gerringong

1989- Divorced Ray Barter

1993- Interviewed for position at TSS

?Marion buys house

1994- Commenced work at TSS

1996- Christmas with parents and Wilson family.

?Marion talks about a melanoma

?Marion had a theft from her car a while before her trip to the UK. Sally remarked the person on CCTV looked like Marion. Medicare card and wallet stolen.

?April 1997 Marion resigns from TSS

?Marion sells house

May 15th 1997 changed name by deed poll to Florabella Natalia Marion Remakel

?Dentist signs paperwork for new passport

?Date of new passport

?Marion is sighted by Sally with a man in a car

?Marion stays with Lesley Loveday

?Lesley Loveday drives Marion to bus station

June 23 1997- Left Australia from Brisbane airport with two suitcases

June 1997 Arrives in Seoul, South Korea

? Marion arrives in London

? Marion hires a car

July 15th 1997 date supposed to travel on Orient Express but decided not to

? Mention of Mazz and the Dutch dentist in postcard (date of postcard?)

July 31 1997- Marion calls Sally, leaving a message on her answering machine.

July 1997- sent early birthday gift to sister Deirdre, whose birthday was August 7.

August 1 1997- Marion calls Sally from a payphone, indicating that she had postponed her trip on the Orient Express (highly suspicious in my opinion- everyone said that she desperately wanted to do this). Marion specifically says that she won't be in touch much (after having sent postcards/letters to a lot of people).

August 2 1997- Passport returns to Australia. Passenger Arrival card states that...........

August 30, 1997 - postcard sent from Tunbridge England to Marion's family

August/September 1997- daily withdrawals of $5000 from a bank in Byron Bay, with three of those days having withdrawals coming from a bank in Burleigh Heads. (exact dates of these withdrawals?)

September 13 1997- Marion visits Optometrist in Grafton

October 18th 1997 - Son Owen’s birthday but no call was made to him which alerted Sally

October 22 1997- Sally reports to Byron Bay police station, with Senior Constable Graeme Childs lodging an occurrence. A stop was placed on Marions account, with a message for her to contact her daughter as a matter of urgency.

Late oct 1997- Byron Bay police related to Sally by phone- that he had spoken to Marion, who didn’t want any contact, or anyone to know where she was. No record in police documentation of this.

Late 1997- Jack Wilson, Marion's father, in notes prepared for the Salvation Army, states that he asked the police what identification had been made and they said that the bank security had contacted Marion on the phone and that she didn’t want any contact.

1997- Sally showed photo of Marion to bank teller, who seemed to recognise her and took the photo to the manager. The teller returned, took a copy of the picture and asked Sally what she would like him to say if he saw her.

Feb 12 1998 Betty Brown sends letter to Jack Wilson, confirming that his request for assistance had been received.

March 18 1998- Letter from Salvation Army- to Jack Wilson. Confirming phone call, reiterating that his daughter had been identified withdrawing money at a different bank and that she spoke of starting a new life. Colonial State Bank at Ashmore- 15 October, 1990 (typo?) Marion withdrew the balance of her account. In referenced phone call, Marion had said she was angry with Sally for not putting the money from the car sale into her account, that she didn’t want anything to do with her family.

Oct 22 1998- Sally marries at TSS- Marion didn’t attend.

July 20 2001- Sally's first child born

March 6, 2002- Son, Owen, dies at 27 years old.

2002- Crimestoppers caller says a woman called Marion who was missing from northern nsw was killed and buried in bushland near Armidale.

April 15 2003- Salvation Army begins new search, instigated by Sally.

July 1 2003- Jack Wilson, Marion's father, dies.

2010- Gary Sheehan investigates in Armidale- SES, dog in Armidale. Followed up at an address in Armidale. Address real, name not- people at the house had no idea.

Feb 7 2006- Salvation Army unable to locate Marion

2007- Marion’s passport expired

2007- Sally contacts AFP missing persons unit. AFP going to use Marion’s case for missing persons week, but NSW police asked them not for investigative reasons.

July 6 2007- Sally had NSW police unit changed to missing from occurance

July 11 2007- officer in NSW missing person unit sent email confirmed that status had been changed.

July 27 2007- NSW inspector to AFP- Marion was spoken with in last month.

August 2007- email to AFP- shows that Marion was not spoken to in the last month.

2009- Gary Sheehan takes on Marion’s case.

2010- Sally makes statement to police- prior to disappearance, Sally called her mother at Lesley’s, but Lesley thought that Marion was staying with Sally. Lesley said that her mother had also comeback very late on night, saying she had locked her keys in the car. (I assume this is after she has sold the house, before she left).

May 15 2011- NSW police inform Chris (Sally’s husband) that Marion had changed her name prior to leaving. Gary Sheehan went to Sally’s house to tell her about the change in name on her passport.

October 2011- Marion noted as “located”

December 2011- Apparently Sally is told that Marion was removed from the missing person- which Sally disputes.

2012- Gary Sheehan has Marion removed from listing as a missing person. (This is confusing)

July 23 2013- Clark Hunter messages on facebook- Natalia is alive but you will never see her again. It was not her intention to disappear, she was forced.

The Lady Vanishes

Inquest
 
  • #954
Re-posting this. Should anything be changed or added?
31st August 1997 Marion tells her family that her location is at that point in Tunbridge Wells in Kent. She is having afternoon tea with some little old ladies
 
  • #955
Re-posting this. Should anything be changed or added?
August 1997 Marion sends her family member a postcard from Rye saying that she is staying with a family at a nearby Oast House.
 
  • #956
UPDATED TIMELINE

Marion Barter TIMELINE with credit to Mel 1303

October 3, 1945- Born in Marrickville

1950ish- moved to Brisbane.

1957ish- Moved to Oyster Bay

Dec 1967- Marries Johnny Warren (ep 2)

Tuesday 3 Sept 1968 to Thursday 9 January 1969. Johnny & Marion’s trip to the UK (Marion visited Amsterdam for the first time on this trip)

Monday 25 November 1968 Johnny played his last game for Stockport County Reserves in the Northern Floodlit League (he never managed to play in their 1st team) so what were Marion & Johnny doing in the period before they left the UK?

What happened in this period with Johnny and Marion?

1971- Splits from Johnny Warren, suffers nervous breakdown (according to John Economis)

1972- Began working with Janice White

1972- Began relationship with Stewart Brown

May 1973- Sally born

Oct 1974- Owen born

1975- Left Stewart, took children to Queensland. Returned to try and rekindle relationship when father-in-law was diagnosed with cancer

1977- Married Stewart Brown

1979- Divorced Stewart Brown, moved to Lapstone

?- Ray Barter moves in, after a few dates, having never met the children.

June 9 1985- Marriage to Ray

1988- Marion, Ray and Sally (Owen?) move to Gerringong

1989- Divorced Ray Barter

1993- Interviewed for position at TSS

?Marion buys house

1994- Commenced work at TSS

1996- Christmas with parents and Wilson family.

?Marion talks about a melanoma

?Marion had a theft from her car a while before her trip to the UK. Sally remarked the person on CCTV looked like Marion. Medicare card and wallet stolen.

?April 1997 Marion resigns from TSS

?Marion sells house

May 15th 1997 changed name by deed poll to Florabella Natalia Marion Remakel

?Dentist signs paperwork for new passport

?Date of new passport

?Marion is sighted by Sally with a man in a car

?Marion stays with Lesley Loveday

?Lesley Loveday drives Marion to bus station

June 23 1997- Left Australia from Brisbane airport with two suitcases

June 1997 Arrives in Seoul, South Korea

? Marion arrives in London

? Marion hires a car

July 15th 1997 date supposed to travel on Orient Express but decided not to

? Mention of Mazz and the Dutch dentist in postcard (date of postcard?)

July 31 1997- Marion calls Sally, leaving a message on her answering machine.

July 1997- sent early birthday gift to sister Deirdre, whose birthday was August 7.

August 1 1997- Marion calls Sally from a payphone, indicating that she had postponed her trip on the Orient Express (highly suspicious in my opinion- everyone said that she desperately wanted to do this). Marion specifically says that she won't be in touch much (after having sent postcards/letters to a lot of people).

August 2 1997- Passport returns to Australia. Passenger Arrival card states that...........

August 30, 1997 - postcard sent from Tunbridge England to Marion's family

August/September 1997- daily withdrawals of $5000 from a bank in Byron Bay, with three of those days having withdrawals coming from a bank in Burleigh Heads. (exact dates of these withdrawals?)

September 13 1997- Marion visits Optometrist in Grafton

October 18th 1997 - Son Owen’s birthday but no call was made to him which alerted Sally

October 22 1997- Sally reports to Byron Bay police station, with Senior Constable Graeme Childs lodging an occurrence. A stop was placed on Marions account, with a message for her to contact her daughter as a matter of urgency.

Late oct 1997- Byron Bay police related to Sally by phone- that he had spoken to Marion, who didn’t want any contact, or anyone to know where she was. No record in police documentation of this.

Late 1997- Jack Wilson, Marion's father, in notes prepared for the Salvation Army, states that he asked the police what identification had been made and they said that the bank security had contacted Marion on the phone and that she didn’t want any contact.

1997- Sally showed photo of Marion to bank teller, who seemed to recognise her and took the photo to the manager. The teller returned, took a copy of the picture and asked Sally what she would like him to say if he saw her.

Feb 12 1998 Betty Brown sends letter to Jack Wilson, confirming that his request for assistance had been received.

March 18 1998- Letter from Salvation Army- to Jack Wilson. Confirming phone call, reiterating that his daughter had been identified withdrawing money at a different bank and that she spoke of starting a new life. Colonial State Bank at Ashmore- 15 October, 1990 (typo?) Marion withdrew the balance of her account. In referenced phone call, Marion had said she was angry with Sally for not putting the money from the car sale into her account, that she didn’t want anything to do with her family.

Oct 22 1998- Sally marries at TSS- Marion didn’t attend.

July 20 2001- Sally's first child born

March 6, 2002- Son, Owen, dies at 27 years old.

2002- Crimestoppers caller says a woman called Marion who was missing from northern nsw was killed and buried in bushland near Armidale.

April 15 2003- Salvation Army begins new search, instigated by Sally.

July 1 2003- Jack Wilson, Marion's father, dies.

2010- Gary Sheehan investigates in Armidale- SES, dog in Armidale. Followed up at an address in Armidale. Address real, name not- people at the house had no idea.

Feb 7 2006- Salvation Army unable to locate Marion

2007- Marion’s passport expired

2007- Sally contacts AFP missing persons unit. AFP going to use Marion’s case for missing persons week, but NSW police asked them not for investigative reasons.

July 6 2007- Sally had NSW police unit changed to missing from occurance

July 11 2007- officer in NSW missing person unit sent email confirmed that status had been changed.

July 27 2007- NSW inspector to AFP- Marion was spoken with in last month.

August 2007- email to AFP- shows that Marion was not spoken to in the last month.

2009- Gary Sheehan takes on Marion’s case.

2010- Sally makes statement to police- prior to disappearance, Sally called her mother at Lesley’s, but Lesley thought that Marion was staying with Sally. Lesley said that her mother had also comeback very late on night, saying she had locked her keys in the car. (I assume this is after she has sold the house, before she left).

May 15 2011- NSW police inform Chris (Sally’s husband) that Marion had changed her name prior to leaving. Gary Sheehan went to Sally’s house to tell her about the change in name on her passport.

October 2011- Marion noted as “located”

December 2011- Apparently Sally is told that Marion was removed from the missing person- which Sally disputes.

2012- Gary Sheehan has Marion removed from listing as a missing person. (This is confusing)

July 23 2013- Clark Hunter messages on facebook- Natalia is alive but you will never see her again. It was not her intention to disappear, she was forced.

The Lady Vanishes

Inquest


Please check sequence of events and advise of any events that are missing.
 
  • #957
UPDATED TIMELINE

Marion Barter TIMELINE with credit to Mel 1303

October 3, 1945- Born in Marrickville

1950ish- moved to Brisbane.

1957ish- Moved to Oyster Bay

Dec 1967- Marries Johnny Warren (ep 2)

Tuesday 3 Sept 1968 to Thursday 9 January 1969. Johnny & Marion’s trip to the UK (Marion visited Amsterdam for the first time on this trip)

Monday 25 November 1968 Johnny played his last game for Stockport County Reserves in the Northern Floodlit League (he never managed to play in their 1st team) so what were Marion & Johnny doing in the period before they left the UK?

What happened in this period with Johnny and Marion?

1971- Splits from Johnny Warren, suffers nervous breakdown (according to John Economis)

1972- Began working with Janice White

1972- Began relationship with Stewart Brown

May 1973- Sally born

Oct 1974- Owen born

1975- Left Stewart, took children to Queensland. Returned to try and rekindle relationship when father-in-law was diagnosed with cancer

1977- Married Stewart Brown

1979- Divorced Stewart Brown, moved to Lapstone

?- Ray Barter moves in, after a few dates, having never met the children.

June 9 1985- Marriage to Ray

1988- Marion, Ray and Sally (Owen?) move to Gerringong

1989- Divorced Ray Barter

1993- Interviewed for position at TSS

?Marion buys house

1994- Commenced work at TSS

1996- Christmas with parents and Wilson family.

?Marion talks about a melanoma

?Marion had a theft from her car a while before her trip to the UK. Sally remarked the person on CCTV looked like Marion. Medicare card and wallet stolen.

?April 1997 Marion resigns from TSS

?Marion sells house

May 15th 1997 changed name by deed poll to Florabella Natalia Marion Remakel

?Dentist signs paperwork for new passport

?Date of new passport

?Marion is sighted by Sally with a man in a car

?Marion stays with Lesley Loveday

?Lesley Loveday drives Marion to bus station

June 23 1997- Left Australia from Brisbane airport with two suitcases

June 1997 Arrives in Seoul, South Korea

? Marion arrives in London

? Marion hires a car

July 15th 1997 date supposed to travel on Orient Express but decided not to

? Mention of Mazz and the Dutch dentist in postcard (date of postcard?)

July 31 1997- Marion calls Sally, leaving a message on her answering machine.

July 1997- sent early birthday gift to sister Deirdre, whose birthday was August 7.

August 1 1997- Marion calls Sally from a payphone, indicating that she had postponed her trip on the Orient Express (highly suspicious in my opinion- everyone said that she desperately wanted to do this). Marion specifically says that she won't be in touch much (after having sent postcards/letters to a lot of people).

August 2 1997- Passport returns to Australia. Passenger Arrival card states that...........

August 30, 1997 - postcard sent from Tunbridge England to Marion's family

August/September 1997- daily withdrawals of $5000 from a bank in Byron Bay, with three of those days having withdrawals coming from a bank in Burleigh Heads. (exact dates of these withdrawals?)

September 13 1997- Marion visits Optometrist in Grafton

October 18th 1997 - Son Owen’s birthday but no call was made to him which alerted Sally

October 22 1997- Sally reports to Byron Bay police station, with Senior Constable Graeme Childs lodging an occurrence. A stop was placed on Marions account, with a message for her to contact her daughter as a matter of urgency.

Late oct 1997- Byron Bay police related to Sally by phone- that he had spoken to Marion, who didn’t want any contact, or anyone to know where she was. No record in police documentation of this.

Late 1997- Jack Wilson, Marion's father, in notes prepared for the Salvation Army, states that he asked the police what identification had been made and they said that the bank security had contacted Marion on the phone and that she didn’t want any contact.

1997- Sally showed photo of Marion to bank teller, who seemed to recognise her and took the photo to the manager. The teller returned, took a copy of the picture and asked Sally what she would like him to say if he saw her.

Feb 12 1998 Betty Brown sends letter to Jack Wilson, confirming that his request for assistance had been received.

March 18 1998- Letter from Salvation Army- to Jack Wilson. Confirming phone call, reiterating that his daughter had been identified withdrawing money at a different bank and that she spoke of starting a new life. Colonial State Bank at Ashmore- 15 October, 1990 (typo?) Marion withdrew the balance of her account. In referenced phone call, Marion had said she was angry with Sally for not putting the money from the car sale into her account, that she didn’t want anything to do with her family.

Oct 22 1998- Sally marries at TSS- Marion didn’t attend.

July 20 2001- Sally's first child born

March 6, 2002- Son, Owen, dies at 27 years old.

2002- Crimestoppers caller says a woman called Marion who was missing from northern nsw was killed and buried in bushland near Armidale.

April 15 2003- Salvation Army begins new search, instigated by Sally.

July 1 2003- Jack Wilson, Marion's father, dies.

2010- Gary Sheehan investigates in Armidale- SES, dog in Armidale. Followed up at an address in Armidale. Address real, name not- people at the house had no idea.

Feb 7 2006- Salvation Army unable to locate Marion

2007- Marion’s passport expired

2007- Sally contacts AFP missing persons unit. AFP going to use Marion’s case for missing persons week, but NSW police asked them not for investigative reasons.

July 6 2007- Sally had NSW police unit changed to missing from occurance

July 11 2007- officer in NSW missing person unit sent email confirmed that status had been changed.

July 27 2007- NSW inspector to AFP- Marion was spoken with in last month.

August 2007- email to AFP- shows that Marion was not spoken to in the last month.

2009- Gary Sheehan takes on Marion’s case.

2010- Sally makes statement to police- prior to disappearance, Sally called her mother at Lesley’s, but Lesley thought that Marion was staying with Sally. Lesley said that her mother had also comeback very late on night, saying she had locked her keys in the car. (I assume this is after she has sold the house, before she left).

May 15 2011- NSW police inform Chris (Sally’s husband) that Marion had changed her name prior to leaving. Gary Sheehan went to Sally’s house to tell her about the change in name on her passport.

October 2011- Marion noted as “located”

December 2011- Apparently Sally is told that Marion was removed from the missing person- which Sally disputes.

2012- Gary Sheehan has Marion removed from listing as a missing person. (This is confusing)

July 23 2013- Clark Hunter messages on facebook- Natalia is alive but you will never see her again. It was not her intention to disappear, she was forced.

The Lady Vanishes

Inquest


Please check sequence of events and advise of any events that are missing.
Thank you Estelle and Mel 1303, you have put lots of hard work into this and it will prove to be very useful.
 
  • #958
Please check sequence of events and add any other events so that I can update it if necessary.
 
  • #959
Marion left Australia on the 22nd June 1997? Not 23rd?
 
  • #960
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