Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, June 1997 #13

[BonnieB]

Anxiety can cause repeated phrases too. Unless a medical report from a treating neurologist or specialist has been provided to the court confirming RB Parkinson’s diagnosis, I don’t believe it.

He has been diagnosed with Essential Tremor and possible early Parkinson's ( because in the early stages Parkinson's is hard to diagnose definitely)
IMO, having had experience with Essential Tremor, it is usually more pronounced in the dominant hand (in his case, the right hand) It DOES NOT affect speech, thinking or memory. IMO, he has studied up on the symptoms of Parkinson's and is putting on the per, per, per, perfor, performance of his life! Amazing how he sparked up when angered by MC's love letter. Yes, I think he could well be capable of violence if provoked!!

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Interesting his use of the word 'untermenschen' which is the german word the nazis used in persecution of jews, gypsies, etc. Hints that he comes from a jewish background maybe? Or he's playing on that pitiful story?

And that his extreme narcissistic exploitative predatory behaviour is a compensatory personality disorder for feeling worthless and persecuted.

 

[BonnieB]

My thoughts: He chose her new name. I can see him saying something like “you’re my Florabella” in one of his creepy notes or just in person. And then convinced her to change her name to that because it suits her and blahblahblah. Totally romantic. He wanted to have her initials and his initials to match (FD Ramakel). I can also see him saying something like “oh, I sent this over the phone they must have mistaken Florabella for Ferdinand” or some other bs. Or just telling her to use FD for one reason or another.

I’m completely on the fence about whether the tea chests existing or not. It seems to fit the con pattern. But at the same time anything even tangentially related to Marion he seems to lie through his teeth about… I absolutely can’t see him having them in his family home, or even allowing Marion to know where his family lived. It’s just too dangerous IMO. What if she drives by and sees his kids/wife? Or sees something inside/outside that points to their existence? I can’t help but wonder if there was a secondary location we haven’t heard about/hasn’t been discovered that he was using for his “homebase”. Something off books that he was renting with cash.

I still think his wife was aware of his cons. She just didn’t care. So long as she had nice things (and I’d put money on some of those nice things being stolen). I wish we had earlier pictures of her, because I think she withdrew money as Marion in Byron Bay.

What’s amazing to me is I feel like, even after all his testimony, we still don’t know who this man is. Was he really Willy Wooters? Was he injured? Or did he just steal that identity too?

Excellent summary! Agree, agree, agree! I have a sneaky feeling we might get a few answers tomorrow. Oh shoot, it's today!

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Re where Marion stayed if she returned to Aus.

Why did WW say at some point in this most recent Inquest that 'police told me she was staying in a motel'? Has this been raised before?

 

[BonnieB]

Interesting his use of the word 'untermenschen' which is the german word the nazis used in persecution of jews, gypsies, etc. Hints that he comes from a jewish background maybe? Or he's playing on that pitiful story?

And that his extreme narcissistic exploitative predatory behaviour is a compensatory personality disorder for feeling worthless and persecuted.

Very observant! He used the Christian name "Chaim", also Jewish and spent about 5 years in Germany, or so he says.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Yes he said that people treat you differently if they know you're just a pensioner.

He used the word "inferior".

Interesting his use of the word 'untermenschen' which is the german word the nazis used in persecution of jews, gypsies, etc. Hints that he comes from a jewish background maybe? Or he's playing on that pitiful story?

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

My thoughts: He chose her new name. I can see him saying something like “you’re my Florabella” in one of his creepy notes or just in person. And then convinced her to change her name to that because it suits her and blahblahblah. Totally romantic. He wanted to have her initials and his initials to match (FD Ramakel). I can also see him saying something like “oh, I sent this over the phone they must have mistaken Florabella for Ferdinand” or some other bs. Or just telling her to use FD for one reason or another.

I’m completely on the fence about whether the tea chests existing or not. It seems to fit the con pattern. But at the same time anything even tangentially related to Marion he seems to lie through his teeth about… I absolutely can’t see him having them in his family home, or even allowing Marion to know where his family lived. It’s just too dangerous IMO. What if she drives by and sees his kids/wife? Or sees something inside/outside that points to their existence? I can’t help but wonder if there was a secondary location we haven’t heard about/hasn’t been discovered that he was using for his “homebase”. Something off books that he was renting with cash.

I still think his wife was aware of his cons. She just didn’t care. So long as she had nice things (and I’d put money on some of those nice things being stolen). I wish we had earlier pictures of her, because I think she withdrew money as Marion in Byron Bay.

What’s amazing to me is I feel like, even after all his testimony, we still don’t know who this man is. Was he really Willy Wooters? Was he injured? Or did he just steal that identity too?

Agree. Now we've heard his fanciful romantic ways then I agree he 'fed' Marion the name Florabella and then suggested hey why don't we make names with ALL our initials the same. For what reason I'm not quite clear yet but I guess it would be quite easy to alter 'Mrs F N M Ramakel' to 'Mr F N Ramakel' on certain types of documents?

Also, appears to have been hinted at in the Inquest that WW was perhaps trying to persuade Marion he was in fact the real Fernand Ramakel, former soccer star who also has those initials - FNM(E)R - in his full name.

So confusing. As for tea chests, I imagine they would have gone to a nearby storage locker he owned or had access to and been either sent overseas to get them far away then plundered. Shipped in Marion's name on the premise of 'shipping personal items and teaching materials to the UK' on the pro forma - maybe he's worried that a shipping docket will materialise - clearly things get packed in tea chest for shipping transit not for general storage as they become far to heavy to move.

 

[BonnieB]

Re where Marion stayed if she returned to Aus.

Why did WW say at some point in this most recent Inquest that 'police told me she was staying in a motel'? Has this been raised before?

Yes, Marion wrote that she planned to stay at the Novatel, Brisbane on her incoming flight card, although there's no proof she did so.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Best line of this Inquest ever:

WW: "Somebody's been using my name!" - 02:23:09

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Yes, Marion wrote that she planned to stay at the Novatel, Brisbane on her incoming flight card, although there's no proof she did so.

Aha. And he's distorted it to say 'the police told me she was staying at a Motel' as if it's an accepted truth. OK that's where she was then.

 

[BonnieB]

Best line of this Inquest ever:

WW: "Somebody's been using my name!" - 02:23:09

Classic!

 

[BonnieB]

Aha. And he's distorted it to say 'the police told me she was staying at a Motel' as if it's an accepted truth. OK that's where she was then.

I also wondered if it was a 'slip' of the tongue. In 1997 a hotel at the airport would not be referred to as a 'motel'. In 1997, a motel was a place along the road where you parked your car at your room.
IMO he collected MB at the airport and took her to a motel some distance from her stated accommodation.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Called motels, because you "motored" there in your car.

Originally called "motor hotels"

I also wondered if it was a 'slip' of the tongue. In 1997 a hotel at the airport would not be referred to as a 'motel'. In 1997, a motel was a place along the road where you parked your car at your room.
IMO he collected MB at the airport and took her to a motel some distance from her stated accommodation.

 

[ruby925]

I know I am in the minority here, but I still think MB's name change was not instigated by RB. The Remakel name was a link back to RB whatever his plan was, and as her bank accounts were in the name of MB, they could not be accessed with her FNMR passport, thereby necessitating a trip back to Aus. IMO MB's name change sealed her fate.

 

[Penguinpoet]

Best line of this Inquest ever:

WW: "Somebody's been using my name!" - 02:23:09

I came to post the same thing! I nearly splurted out my tea when he said that

 

[BonnieB]

"The name that I was wearing at the time"

Excuse me for a moment while I slip into a more comfortable name...

 

[bbbounce]

I like the idea of Wonks shipping Marion's things abroad to sell, but wouldnt the risk be great, having one of your many names on the shipping receipts? But what if he told Marion HE would ship the tea chests to Luxembourg for their new house and then disposed of goods in Australia? Either way he runs a big risk having his name attached.

Unless. . .Marion herself ships her things to the real FR in Luxembourg. And he's implicated. He sells furniture, right? His old buddy Ric calls in a favor or tells him a lady wants to sell her things in Europe, will he help? And give Wonks a cut? Just kidding!!

This is where i think the FN Remakel initials become important. I don’t think it was any coincidence Marions new name happened to also shorten to the same initials. This would have made it easy for him to send and receive mail in her name. My father and I have the same initials. I could often collect his mail, deliveries etc and vice versa.

 

[bbbounce]

Personally, I thing RB's insistence that he stored Marion's belongings has two purposes. Either they found evidence of her belongings associated with his family OR he is afraid they did.

AND to create an alternate culprit - that of the pilot she ran off with overseas.

When women disappear, statistics lean towards it being at the hands of their partner. So it's in RB's best interest to give the idea he was not her last lover. IMO.

I also noticed he is adamant that he never went to Brisbane. Which is coincidentally where Marion changed her name to FNMR.

And also that he constantly speaks about using the bus depot. Which is coincidentally where Marion was last seen.

Agree. How do we know the bus depot is where Marion was last seen?

 

[Eyespywithmylittleeye]

IMO 100% the name chosen was deliberate.

I doubt highly she stored things at his house but I don’t doubt that there were things of value that were in tea chests with the view to ship overseas for ‘their’ new life.

I suspect she trusted him to store these things and may not have even known where he chose to store them for her. Perhaps she believed they were in a storage unit when he fact he had them at his house. I also think he has only said this in case there is a record somewhere or someone saw them being delivered.

The only other theory I have that she knew they were there is he has given her the spiel of ‘my marriage is over we share the house for the sake of the children’ a line that is not uncommon for married men that play around.

so maybe she knew about his wife and children and he was planning to leave..?

he finds a house for them OS and they do return to access $. After money is out he then changes his mind and says he ‘can’t ‘ leave his wife.. and there is some sort of argument that leads to - well something awful.

Lies to him are completely normal so any story could have been said to MB and if she was really in love she would have believed them in the beginning.

the gap in between transfers makes me feel the final $60k was not done by Marion. Regardless of what the Ashmore branch say.

honestly who could remember 100% all those years ago a particular person coming in to close an account? You would just look at records and say it was closed by the account owner.

He is the reason behind everything.. the name, the secrecy and ultimately the disappearance.

IMO

 

[Satchie]

I know I am in the minority here, but I still think MB's name change was not instigated by RB. The Remakel name was a link back to RB whatever his plan was, and as her bank accounts were in the name of MB, they could not be accessed with her FNMR passport, thereby necessitating a trip back to Aus. IMO MB's name change sealed her fate.

Good point. RB didn't suggest a name change for his other target, did he?

It could be that Marion was anticipating getting married in Luxemberg, and decided to anticipate the happy event by doing some of the paperwork (most brides wait until after...)

Since she indicated that she was married when she came back, did she go through an actual marriage ceremony that gave her the rationale/ committment to transfer her money to a joint account...? This might answer the question of why she was willing to transfer money after she came back, which she didn't do before she went (ie, the 40K account in the UK).

IMO, if she was being impersonated, why didn't they impersonate her flying back to Luxemberg? Why didn't they impersonate her all the way to the UK, to claim that 40k?

That's the loose end that RB left hanging in this scheme. Was that just laziness? Or, was this a one-man operation, with no accomplices to have to share the money with, be blackmailed by, or who might go to police once they got fed up him?

JMO