Australia Australia - Marion Barter, 51, missing after trip to UK, June 1997 #8

[FullMinder]

Actually, this could work! Initial reports from Sally and podcast had Marion getting dropped off at bus stop on the 22. But when they found passenger cards, it was amended to the 23 as that was the flight date. Maybe SHE DID spend a night in a hotel with him Awesome pick up!

The only thing about that is the official reports still state she left on the 22nd. Marion BARTER (AKA Florabella Natalia Marion REMAKEL)
Suspicious disappearance of Marion Barter - NSW Police Public Site

I wonder if that had originally been the plan: that they'd spend a few nights in the hotel to get situated before taking off. Otherwise why would Bronwen have known that? But then he clearly changed his plans (as she understood them at the time) and departed on the 17th of June, just a few days before Marion left, and so she changed her plans to meet him overseas. He probably gave her some big important excuse as to why he needed to leave early (creating confusion and uncertainty in her) and she thought well, I'll just ask Lesley to drop me off.

 

[Eyespywithmylittleeye]

I grew up in a border town (Vic/NSW) and am just a few years younger than his daughter. At the time some people at my school would use relatives addresses over the border in NSW to get their Ps at 17 at year early. Vic was 18. I'm not sure what equivalents are?

Not sure what it was back then it’s currently 16 for learners here and at 17 you can get licence but I have this feeling qld back then was earlier. So maybe a qld licence was possible at 16 in 97??

 

[FullMinder]

As an aside: I want a class in organization from the person who put all of these binders together.

I WILL FREAKIN PAY TO BE TAUGHT THIS LEVEL OF ORGANIZATION!

 

[Estelle]

16yo

I'm not sure of the exact rules in NSW at the time, but when I got my provisional license at 16, I had my own car (a white Mitsubishi magna station wagon as it so happens).
At the time you only needed to be on your Learner license for 6 months. This was in early 2000's

ETA I was in South Australia at the time though so NSW may have been slightly different

A learner can drive at the age of 16 under the supervision of a fully licensed driver since 1966. After obtaining a licence, a driver continues to be subject to restrictions during a 4-year probationary period. A Learner's Permit may be obtained by a person over 16 years.

Their daughter turned 16yo in late April, 1997. They bought the car in early August, 1997 so she would have only had her Leaner's Permit for a little more than 3 months so one of her parents would have to sit with her while she drove.

 

[roland625]

Surely RB had an accomplice in the UK?! Why else take his victims there rather than all the other countries he has aliases in? Or was it because he had actually lived there as an adult and knew it better than the other countries?

Because he had a record in some of those other places?

 

[Passingthru]

I just want to remind everyone that while he’s been a downright atrocious liar on the stand, he was likely very good at it “in situ”. Casselden (and all of us) have the benefit of hindsight and facts that his victims would not have had. The reason he can’t lie well right now is because he has to account for decades of lies and it’s just not possible to do in the moment.

 

[Littleguy7]

Because he had a record in some of those other places?

Or because MB and JO had family connections in the UK so thought he could abandon them there?

 

[Estelle]

Surely RB had an accomplice in the UK?! Why else take his victims there rather than all the other countries he has aliases in? Or was it because he had actually lived there as an adult and knew it better than the other countries?

What about those two days after he left JO that Casselden asked him about? Did he spend it alone in east England was the question?

I wondered if Marion was murdered and buried by someone else in Sussex so he spent those two days checking up on things after he left JO.

 

[ikarka]

I just want to remind everyone that while he’s been a downright atrocious liar on the stand, he was likely very good at it “in situ”. Casselden (and all of us) have the benefit of hindsight and facts that his victims would not have had. The reason he can’t lie well right now is because he has to account for decades of lies and it’s just not possible to do in the moment.

Agreed. I am not passing any judgement on his victims. I can see how and why they would believe him and the fact they were conned is a reflection on his terrible behaviour, not them in any way.

I also think this is the court process at its best... there will also be a transcript to carefully review the many inconsistencies in his story and he is being pushed hard to flesh out the problems in his story. The house of cards is crumbling.

 

[Belleandsebastian]

What about those two days after he left JO that Casselden asked him about? Did he spend it alone in east England was the question?

I wondered if Marion was murdered and buried by someone else in Sussex so he spent those two days checking up on things after he left JO.

It's plausible. The only way to prove Marion came back to Australia IMO is to access the records of her optometrist visit and see if they recorded the melanoma on her eye. I don't think they kept the records though, sadly.

 

[Passingthru]

Hey Aussie people, question for you, how much media attention is this case getting? And is it the kind that draws the “older” crowd? (Like here in my city we have one station that it seems like everyone over the age of 60 watches for their morning news?)

Because the longer I think about it the more troubling it becomes that we only have a handful of victims vs the timeframe.

 

[Seabreeze1]

To me he bought one way tickets so he could leave them there and then get back to Australia and take possession of their valuables. He was shocked to see JO back in Australia so soon.

 

[caitlincurious]

I'm a bit behind but: "did you carry your underwear in your hands?" hahahahahaha

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Maybe he didn't wear any underwear

 

[artymamma]

Hey Aussie people, question for you, how much media attention is this case getting? And is it the kind that draws the “older” crowd? (Like here in my city we have one station that it seems like everyone over the age of 60 watches for their morning news?)

Because the longer I think about it the more troubling it becomes that we only have a handful of victims vs the timeframe.

Not as much as it should IMO. We do have a Federal election coming up next month which takes up a lot of air time. The TV station associated with the podcast is airing stories every day, but I’m not sure about the others. A variety of paper and online news sources have been reporting sporadically. I think it appeals to lots of the True Crime community here which covers a myriad of ages, but in my experience mostly women in their 30s-50s.

 

[DK007]

I loved the part when the coroner asked him to explain what other luggage he had with him when he caught the ferry to the UK with JO

I'm a bit behind but: "did you carry your underwear in your hands?" hahahahahaha

 

[Seabreeze1]

He talks so much it’s worse than a low budget soap opera. You can tell he has no value for woman but sees us as things to use and gain from and then discard. I really believe there is a lot more of his victims out there or likely passed on.

 

[Passingthru]

He talks so much ******** it’s worse than a low budget soap opera. You can tell he has no value for woman but sees us as things to use and gain from and then discard. I really believe there is a lot more of his victims out there or likely passed on.

While he is undoubtably misogynistic, I think he views people in general as things to use and discard.

 

[mishy66]

August 1997 they buy the 2nd car
11 days after RB returns
and 9 days after Marions supposed return

DdeH said this was bought for her daughter to use.

There were multiple withdrawals from MB account from August onwards. And the medicare was used in this same month.

This is interesting given they never had another car prior to this time and why buy a car for daughter when she wasn't of age yet to drive? Think she was 16 at the time ???

My point in my post earlier was regardless of exactly what age she was, or establishing if she even went for her license (some people dont go for theirs straight away - I was 19 for example) BUT

They claimed to have no money, living on the smell of an oily rag yet decide to buy a car for her just as she reaches 16 yrs of age ????
Convenient is it not that this happens in the month of August when action starts happening around Marion's accounts.?

 

[Behrnsy]

If it went to court. Would Casseldon be the prosecutor. It would make sense to me. As he knows it inside and out more than anyone