Australia Australia - Marion Barter - Missing After Trip to UK - June 1997 #18

[mishy66]

Every break through on the case was dismissed by higher up the chain, most of the evidence disappeared and investigators on the case were dismissed or threatened from what I am reading.


2023
Convicted murderer and suspect in Belgium’s Brabant Killers– Robert Beijer – has been arrested inThailand.

Robert Beijer, a former state policeman, was convicted of murdering and robbing an Antwerp diamond dealer in 1995 along with Madani Bouhouche.


Beijer was sentenced to 14 years but was let out early for good behaviour and has allegedly been living on and off in Thailand since 1999. Reports say he has recently been receiving cancer treatment in Thailand.


He is a prime suspect in the infamous ‘Brabant Killers’ or ‘Nivelles Gang’ case of the 1980s, one of Belgium’s biggest and most mysterious unsolved cases.

Famous Belgian murderer Robert Beijer arrested in Pattaya, Thailand

Convicted murderer and suspect in Belgium's infamous 'Brabant Killers' case of the1980s - Robert Beijer - has been arrested in Pattaya...

thethaiger.com

 

[gymtonic]

BTW and FYI, I’ve had a look back at my notes, and when I was investigating the Brabant gang sometime last year, I did rule out AKA for Le Géant as most eye witness reports put him at 2m+ or 6’5” AND one eye witness spoke about Le Géant having a birthmark on his neck. So this did not line up with AKA. However I was convinced enough by the reports to have suspicions of some involvement or links with this gang. The timeline of being in Europe at the time, the Lebanese connection, the gendarmerie links, the locations, the French accents, the stolen (sometimes luxury) cars. There were definite inklings for me.

Who “Le Géant” does resemble though…in height and also even the facial reconstruction…is the Gentleman of Heligoland. And if he was the gang leader who ended up in the drink, then it would explain the halt in the Brabant Gang activity. IMO

 

[Newby171]

BTW and FYI, I’ve had a look back at my notes, and when I was investigating the Brabant gang sometime last year, I did rule out AKA for Le Géant as most eye witness reports put him at 2m+ or 6’5” AND one eye witness spoke about Le Géant having a birthmark on his neck. So this did not line up with AKA. However I was convinced enough by the reports to have suspicions of some involvement or links with this gang. The timeline of being in Europe at the time, the Lebanese connection, the gendarmerie links, the locations, the French accents, the stolen (sometimes luxury) cars. There were definite inklings for me.

Who “Le Géant” does resemble though…in height and also even the facial reconstruction…is the Gentleman of Heligoland. And if he was the gang leader who ended up in the drink, then it would explain the halt in the Brabant Gang activity. IMO

I read that the body found near Helgoland was found in July 1994. It was still intact, so could not have been in the water since 1986. It is also thought the body could have been washed up from UK, due to the current in the North See.

 

[gymtonic]

I read that the body found near Helgoland was found in July 1994. It was still intact, so could not have been in the water since 1986. It is also thought the body could have been washed up from UK, due to the current in the North See.

Yes, Sorry to confuse… I wasn’t suggesting an immediate link between the attacks stopping and the the Heligoland body. IMO there was so much fallout from the last attack (and Le Géant possibly injured) that the gang went into hiding for a period (possibly overseas). That an unidentified “giant” turns up in the Sea off Germany some years later is worth investigating. The ocean current studies also indicate that the body could have come from the coast off Europe (around Belgium,Netherlands or Germany) as well. Interestingly the isotope investigation indicated initially that the body spent significant time in Australia, although this has been broadened to Northern Europe now.

 

[Newby171]

Yes, Sorry to confuse… I wasn’t suggesting an immediate link between the attacks stopping and the the Heligoland body. IMO there was so much fallout from the last attack (and Le Géant possibly injured) that the gang went into hiding for a period (possibly overseas). That an unidentified “giant” turns up in the Sea off Germany some years later is worth investigating. The ocean current studies also indicate that the body could have come from the coast off Europe (around Belgium,Netherlands or Germany) as well. Interestingly the isotope investigation indicated initially that the body spent significant time in Australia, although this has been broadened to Northern Europe now.

Oh, I see what you are referring to now. Of course, a possibility.

 

[Liselle]

Oh, I see what you are referring to now. Of course, a possibility.

But just to add to the confusion,in 2017, an article in Belgium Reporting by Pauline Declaye wrote "It has been a cold case for 30 years. But recently, a former member of the special intervention unit of the federal police confessed on his death-bed that he was “the Giant”. So many twists and turns!!

 

[Martinie]

But just to add to the confusion,in 2017, an article in Belgium Reporting by Pauline Declaye wrote "It has been a cold case for 30 years. But recently, a former member of the special intervention unit of the federal police confessed on his death-bed that he was “the Giant”. So many twists and turns!!

You think they would have checked the fingerprints...

 

[gymtonic]

You think they would have checked the fingerprints...

They did, this suspect was Christiaan Bonkoffsky (mentioned above) and there was no match with the DNA and fingerprints they had.

 

[Kie22]

Not sure this particular report is so useful. These so-called "unusual night-time habits" sound like a fairly generic nosey neighbour complaint in the English suburbs, where the neighbour is retrospectively over-thinking fairly meaningless things, perhaps egged on by a journalist. Maybe that's a bit strong, but it does seem a stretch to relate them to his known crimes and scams.

She notified the police at the time, so a bit more seriously concerned than just a nosey neighbour (although I know what you mean!). Did the police investigate? Seems a lot of people had suspicions about AKA over the years and reported it, but he avoided any real scrutiny by quickly moving on and staying one step ahead. His family must know all about his illegal activities and have been 'trained' to keep family secrets. In DdH's case even aiding and abetting at times. JMO of course.

 

[gymtonic]

Re the new post on the FB page about the events on this day 16 May 1997, I have a couple of comments and a query.

(1) The dentist‘s name was officially Raymond John Waldock (not Walduck) but always went by the name John as far as I recall (he was my dentist).

(2) The visit to the Department of Transport before going to the QTHU centre in the Valley might suggest that MB went to either the Eight Mile Plains DoT or the Greenslopes DoT centre (both on the Southside) to get the new licence. I say that because if I was driving from the Gold Coast to the QTHU in the Valley, that’s where I would stop off on the way. My bet would be the Eight Mile Plains DoT as it was bigger and easier parking. [ and incidentally Eight Mile Plains was also where the Head Office RACQ was located! So maybe MB visited there as well ?]

(3) As I previously posted, photo Driver Licences in Queensland had photos on them from July 1986 About Queensland driver licence cards so it is even more strange that the marking of the Male error was not picked up in comparison to the photo that would have been taken.

Finally…My query is that according to my notes the inquest said the passport application was done on May 20? I have that as a question mark in my notes as I thought it was the 16 May. can anyone shed a light on why I would have May 20th question mark from the inquest?

 

[mishy66]

May 16 - I am going with the Main Roads in Spring Hill. It was huge, very busy, staff unlikely to ever remember who was who and it was just near her dentist.

May 15 - the day before - SL husband was helping Marion pack up her house when Marion insisted he leave immediately without giving any reason.

I think AH was with her in Brisbane the night of May15 and BOTH of them went to get the documents together in Brisbane. I dont think the spelling of the name N or that it was ticked as Male, was just a clerical error. I think he was with Marion and was able to somehow distract her or the staff member or fill out the details himself with Marion there. She has her photo taken and he does the formalities
JMO

 

[gymtonic]

May 16 - I am going with the Main Roads in Spring Hill. It was huge, very busy, staff unlikely to ever remember who was who and it was just near her dentist.

I considered the Main Roads Building at Spring Hill, but from memory (don’t quote me) the Departments of Transport (responsible for driver licences) and Main Roads Department (responsible for construction) were separate entities until after 1997 and were located and headquartered separately (2000s was when many super Minstries were created with mergers and DoT and DoMR merged). So I’m not so sure that the Main Roads HQ would have dealt with licences at that point. I believe that licences and driving tests were issued and conducted out of the CBD area in hubs that were closer to where people lived. Certainly I remember always going to Eight Mile Plains and Greenslopes near where I lived rather than Spring Hill near where I worked and near the dentist.

Also, if AKA was with MB to get the documents then they went their separate ways before she attended La Bohème matinée with her sister….or did they…? I just had a whacky thought about him also going and sitting separately to keep the secrecy going. OK!OK! I’ll stop with the whacky thoughts !

 

[brjakj]

From MPMB FB:
Housekeeping

We have had a few msgs about the below lately so thought I'd do a quick post for all !

Firstly, next sitting days are 31st May - 2nd June at Lismore Court House, 9/11 Zadoc St, Lismore NSW 2480. We assume that it will be live streamed on the NSW State Coroners YouTube channel and will be available there to catch up also. Times are usually 10am-4pm. https://youtube.com/@coronerscourtofnewsouthwal5253

Secondly, confirming also that there were hearings held prior to them being live streamed. These are not available to view. These included Marion's family, friends, work colleagues, NSW Police, witnesses that interacted with Marion just prior or after the disappearance and bank employees. As June has said on here, some of this content has been covered on The Lady Vanishes podcast series, but not all. So, dont think you've missed something when you haven't had the opportunity to hear it !

Thirdly, we have had a number of msgs from supporters lately who have been contacted by others claiming to have inside knowledge, representing Sally/the case & wanting to discuss theories etc. It is making some feel very uncomfortable. Please consider the other person before you are reach out to them in an unsolicited way or when not being honest about your connections. Also, don't hesitate to ignore or block if you are on the receiving end & do not want to engage. There isn't much more we can do about this.

Thanks for reading !

Joni

 

[KiwiNZ]

Today, Saturday 17th May, Marion was at her parents home in Caloundra in Queensland to celebrate her fathers birthday.
According to the statement of Bronwen, Marion's sister, they were walking together on the beach and Marion told her about her resignation from TSS. She was upset and crying and said that someone has betrayed her at the school. She felt that the person should be reported.
At dinner that night, Marion was telling her family about the impending trip to Europe, and her mother said that she thought it was a "waste of time, money and effort". She apparently said "You might learn to enjoy life more Marion if you drank"...
I again think of how in the preceeding week, Marion had created a new identity, but according to her family, no-one knew. I wonder what she was thinking this weekend as she spent time with her parents and sisters in the family home. Was that the real reason she was upset on the beach ? What effect did her mother's judgmental comments have on her ?
We are strangers in this family dynamic of course. It is not for us to judge. But, it appears this weekend was not one that Marion would look on fondly.
Joni

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Firstly, next sitting days are 31st May - 2nd June at Lismore Court House, 9/11 Zadoc St, Lismore NSW 2480. We assume that it will be live streamed on the NSW State Coroners YouTube channel and will be available there to catch up also. Times are usually 10am-4pm. https://youtube.com/@coronerscourtofnewsouthwal5253

I'm keeping those dates clear. I've set up alarms on my phone for those three days.

 

[gymtonic]

Today, Saturday 17th May, Marion was at her parents home in Caloundra in Queensland to celebrate her fathers birthday.
According to the statement of Bronwen, Marion's sister, they were walking together on the beach and Marion told her about her resignation from TSS. She was upset and crying and said that someone has betrayed her at the school. She felt that the person should be reported.
At dinner that night, Marion was telling her family about the impending trip to Europe, and her mother said that she thought it was a "waste of time, money and effort". She apparently said "You might learn to enjoy life more Marion if you drank"...
I again think of how in the preceeding week, Marion had created a new identity, but according to her family, no-one knew. I wonder what she was thinking this weekend as she spent time with her parents and sisters in the family home. Was that the real reason she was upset on the beach ? What effect did her mother's judgmental comments have on her ?
We are strangers in this family dynamic of course. It is not for us to judge. But, it appears this weekend was not one that Marion would look on fondly.
Joni

These posts of Joni’s have been useful in telling a story of this month. I have a spreadsheet but it has become clearer to me about the days of the 16 and 17 May. MB was expected at her father’s birthday on the Sunshine Coast so it would make sense to go from the Gold Coast via Brisbane and stop off at the Dentist at the QTHU Centre in Brisbane and catch a show (La Boheme) at the Lyric (not much of that level of show at the Goldy or Sunny Coast in those days!). So it also makes sense that she would do her secret business at a convenient Brisbane DoT Centre too. For those interstate or overseas I can see the trip clearly. GC to Brisbane in the morning. Brisbane business and a show in the arvo and then drive to the SC to stay with parents overnight. There have been comments that MB must have stayed with AKA in Brisbane on the night of the 16 May….but not necessarily as GC to Brisbane to Caloundra is doable. It’s a long day and the roads weren’t as good then as they are now, but it is definitely doable.

 

[mishy66]

15 May 1997 –
Sally’s husband was helping Marion pack up her house when Marion insisted he leave immediately without giving any reason. IMO MB PICKS UP AKA and calls in to get fuel for their trip into Brisbane that night. Neither of them would be staying at her house - too risky
Sally sees Marion at McDonalds with an unknown man in the passenger seat.


Friday 16th May Brisbane - Marion ticks two major items off her list.
Firstly, she goes to Queensland Department of Transport and Main Roads
She then goes to see her dentist to get her passport application signed.
To end the day, she meets up with her sister to attend the afternoon session of the opera La Boheme


AKA heads back home on the bus or spends another night with MB


Saturday 17th May - 1997
Marion is at her parents home in Caloundra in Queensland to celebrate her fathers birthday.

 

[gymtonic]

15 May 1997 –
Sally’s husband was helping Marion pack up her house when Marion insisted he leave immediately without giving any reason. IMO MB PICKS UP AKA and calls in to get fuel for their trip into Brisbane that night. Neither of them would be staying at her house - too risky
Sally sees Marion at McDonalds with an unknown man in the passenger seat.

Do we know for sure that it was May 15 that SL sees MB at the Maccas Drive thru? I thought it was just noted at the inquest as sometime in May, exact date unknown? This info for May 15 doesn’t appear for that date on the current FB timeline and I would have thought it would be important enough to note?

 

[gymtonic]

Curious…something that has occurred to me…
…according to the FB timeline being posted, MB apparently drives to Brisbane twice in one week in the middle of a school term, before her effective resignation date (the last day of term)?

According to the FB posts, she drives up on Tuesday May 13 (Name change by deed poll at the Brisbane Public Trustee’s Office) and then 3 days later on Friday 16 May (for DL, witness new passport application and La Boheme) on the way to Caloundra for father’s birthday celebration.

It would appear from the FB posts that she is still teaching at this point as there is a post about May 8 being a « normal day of school » and she is upset about her decision to resign whilst walking on the beach with her sister on the Saturday.

Why is this curious? Well teaching is not like any other job where you can apply for rec leave anytime…leave entitlements are built into the long school summer break in December and January. Taking extra leave during a school term is rarely granted as it involves finding a stand in (or supply) teacher. Sick leave is granted but usually required a doctor’s certificate for multiple days in a week. As far as I remember May is (and was historically) in the middle of School Term 2 in Queensland, with the school holidays being around the Easter public holiday. TSS is not part of the state school system but the Independent School system normally follows the state system with holidays (apart from an extra week in the summer). So…how did MB manage to get away from teaching to drive to Brisbane on 2 school days in May?

 

[CavKinsk]

Curious…something that has occurred to me…
…according to the FB timeline being posted, MB apparently drives to Brisbane twice in one week in the middle of a school term, before her effective resignation date (the last day of term)?

According to the FB posts, she drives up on Tuesday May 13 (Name change by deed poll at the Brisbane Public Trustee’s Office) and then 3 days later on Friday 16 May (for DL, witness new passport application and La Boheme) on the way to Caloundra for father’s birthday celebration.

It would appear from the FB posts that she is still teaching at this point as there is a post about May 8 being a « normal day of school » and she is upset about her decision to resign whilst walking on the beach with her sister on the Saturday.

Why is this curious? Well teaching is not like any other job where you can apply for rec leave anytime…leave entitlements are built into the long school summer break in December and January. Taking extra leave during a school term is rarely granted as it involves finding a stand in (or supply) teacher. Sick leave is granted but usually required a doctor’s certificate for multiple days in a week. As far as I remember May is (and was historically) in the middle of School Term 2 in Queensland, with the school holidays being around the Easter public holiday. TSS is not part of the state school system but the Independent School system normally follows the state system with holidays (apart from an extra week in the summer). So…how did MB manage to get away from teaching to drive to Brisbane on 2 school days in May?

It's interesting- of course the offices would probably close at about 5pm, or even 4.30pm. The drive appears to be 1-1.5hrs now. I don't know how the roads have changed but we can imagine that it would take a bit longer and if she left after 3pm/3.30pm that would be getting into peak traffic.
My children sometimes have "special" classes where they finish they afternoon with a music or language class with a different teacher.
I wouldn't risk driving all that way to a possibly shut office.