Australia Australia - Marion Barter - Missing After Trip to UK - June 1997 #21

[Deleted member 249471]

The Switzerland tall tale wasnt just thrown in at the last mintute by AH during the inquest.

OMG! This evidence is new to me. When was it established that he's told the Switzerland story about marion before? Has he been caught talking about having an affair with her before the inquest? That's HUGE! Did it happen before or after police first questioned him? Oh wow. Who did he tell the story to?

 

[CuriousKat99]

The Switzerland tall tale wasnt just thrown in at the last mintute by AH during the inquest.


Remembering he does seem to string narratives from real life situations eg, books he has read, stories others have told him, people he has met, family members connections etc etc etc

There was a connection to Switzerland and soccer and a connection to Marion and soccer and 2 players in his concept for deceit.

JW and his once close friend GY , who I have no doubt did at some time meet MB.

I believe AH also ran across GY in his life early on in the piece and used a story he heard.... to redevelop a tall tail about his supposed meeting of MB and it is THAT, that he used for his BS tale of MB throwing herself at him in Switzerland.


He is full of it.

But as we have seen throughout this saga, he threads truths with his BS to puff out his grand stories.

JMO of course

There is definitely a connection to GY and him. IMO

I always suspected his tale of the Switzerland affair was originally devised to show that Marion had sought him out in Australia after all those years because he was so hot that she could never stop thinking about him ie, it was “her that initiated it, it was all her fault and she was asking for it”, classic victim blaming.

That was before he realised he couldn’t avoid being linked to the MF Remakel lonely hearts ad with the Ballina Coin phone number.

It’s very possible that while he and Marion were in their “relationship” in 1997, they would have discussed Marion’s past (he probably showed great interest in getting to know the most intimate details about his targets in order to tailor the manipulation). Marion & he could well have discussed both JW and others and discovered a mutual acquaintance (helping to build up Marion’s trust in him)

With this scaffold of truth, he padded out the tale with himself (as usual) as the irresistible and dashing romantic hero (a far cry from reality)

 

[mishy66]

OMG! This evidence is new to me. When was it established that he's told the Switzerland story about marion before? Has he been caught talking about having an affair with her before the inquest? That's HUGE! Did it happen before or after police first questioned him? Oh wow. Who did he tell the story to?

<modsnip>
Im not saying that at all.
Read the whole post.

What Im saying is IMO, he uses stories he hears, reads, etc to add fodder to his BS.

IMO JMO MOO he heard a story from someone about JW playing soccer and the Switzerland connection to introduce his BS that Marion seduced him

 

[mishy66]

I always suspected his tale of the Switzerland affair was originally devised to show that Marion had sought him out in Australia after all those years because he was so hot that she could never stop thinking about him ie, it was “her that initiated it, it was all her fault and she was asking for it”, classic victim blaming.

That was before he realised he couldn’t avoid being linked to the MF Remakel lonely hearts ad with the Ballina Coin phone number.

It’s very possible that while he and Marion were in their “relationship” in 1997, they would have discussed Marion’s past (he probably showed great interest in getting to know the most intimate details about his targets in order to tailor the manipulation). Marion & he could well have discussed both JW and others and discovered a mutual acquaintance (helping to build up Marion’s trust in him)

With this scaffold of truth, he padded out the tale with himself (as usual) as the irresistible and dashing romantic hero (a far cry from reality)

Totally


Which is what Im saying

Only IMO I think he knew JW friend

 

[CuriousKat99]

Totally


Which is what Im saying

Only IMO I think he knew JW friend

Yes and that’s why, after he reluctantly ended up having to agree that the MF Remakel ad was placed by him and that he had in fact had a “relationship” with Marion, he couldn’t give a clear answer as to how they had met, whether she had responded to his as or vice versa. That’s what happens when you are making stuff up on the run, although he tried unsuccessfully to disguise it as dementia.

 

[mishy66]

Totally .

 

[mishy66]

You can always see patterns in some peoples behaviours, especially when they seem to target people. After a while it becomes very obvious to so many.

Manipulation Bullying Control

 

[snarast]

Unfotrtunately, he is still enjoying himself. I wish there was a way to break him. But he’s probably incapable of anything but focusing on ”winning” as he careens through his life. An apex predator.

 

[CuriousKat99]

Unfotrtunately, he is still enjoying himself. I wish there was a way to break him. But he’s probably incapable of anything but focusing on ”winning” as he careens through his life. An apex predator.

The least that can be done is expose him for what he is and completely destroy his fantasy world. The more publicity this case can get, the better. If charges aren’t laid soon there is going to be an army of citizens from around the world calling for justice.

 

[Deleted member 83851]

“He loves only money.” That is from MC. She would know.

So. That’s where it will hurt. Maybe the Australian Government would be interested in clawing back funds as a result of tax fraud. If there are millions of dollars involved it could be a popular move. It’s not Justice for the victims though.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

“He loves only money.” That is from MC. She would know.

So. That’s where it will hurt. Maybe the Australian Government would be interested in clawing back funds as a result of tax fraud. If there are millions of dollars involved it could be a popular move. It’s not Justice for the victims though.

I wonder what the local politicians in the area he lives have to say on this matter? After all, it has probably been their localised offices and regional processing centres dealing with his claims as well as him earning untaxed income etc.

 

[charliethecat]

I have watched the interview with the bank manager at Byron Bay. I've just come recently to looking at this sad case.

Somewhere, I think it was the Police reaction (MP) that said that a bank employee had confirmed MB was 'safe and well' and was not wanting to contact her family again. Was this bank teller interviewed at the Coroner's hearing?

I did not get from the BM that she was the source of this comment at the time ie to the police. I was a bit astounded with her (and AKA) in the casual slighting of MB. 'We thought she was a bit of a flip' This slang is not common in NZ but I gather that it might mean slightly crazy, nutty. is that correct or has it a more definite meaning?

The hibiscus reference is also puzzling me. Is the white hibiscus common around BB? Might it be a street planting? Some of the refs I have seen say that white hibicuses are quite rare but white going to pink, not so much. I also am puzzled that it seemed to be a source of thought that she was a bit peculiar. Again might be differing countries but in a touristy towns here (NZ) where there are flowering street plants or where Pasifika people have their homes it is not uncommon for tourists/holiday makers to be wearing flowers. BB I thought was a bit of a festival town.

Hopefully at the very least this will be a wake-up call for all Police jurisdictions that THEY must sight and confirm that a reported missing person is safe & well. ie they must not rely on the say so of others. And that until they can confirm this themselves that the MP is still classed as a MP.

Sorry if I am going over old ground.

 

[charliethecat]

I wonder what the local politicians in the area he lives have to say on this matter? After all, it has probably been their localised offices and regional processing centres dealing with his claims as well as him earning untaxed income etc.

Yes he is a financial 'crook'/defrauder of the Govt/people of Aus as well as the many other suspicions about finances.

I think we have been exposed to the workings of the mind of a sociopath/psychopath. particularly in the idea of writing romantic letters and then scoffing that this meant they were seeking a romantic relationship. It was clearly just a means to an end and he did not seem to worry who saw that in the courtroom.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Yes he is a financial 'crook'/defrauder of the Govt/people of Aus as well as the many other suspicions about finances.

I think we have been exposed to the workings of the mind of a sociopath/psychopath. particularly in the idea of writing romantic letters and then scoffing that this meant they were seeking a romantic relationship. It was clearly just a means to an end and he did not seem to worry who saw that in the courtroom.

I agree - obviously we are not psychiatrists and cannot diagnose people we've never met but wow he's ticking all the boxes that take a Cluster B personality disorder beyond Narcissistic PD and into the realms of Antisocial Personality Disorder = sociopathy.

I think his repeat offending, habitual lying, countless deceptions, and callous disregard for the hurt / harm to other humans and his entitlement to other people's hard earned property plus the fact that he has also been imprisoned for fraud in the past would certainly put him up right up there were he to be formally diagnosed, which in my opinion he should be.

No doubt his grandiosity facilitates him to think of himself as some type of lethario master criminal chancer who can float around the world mesmerising others into his scams.

 

[CuriousKat99]

Somewhere, I think it was the Police reaction (MP) that said that a bank employee had confirmed MB was 'safe and well' and was not wanting to contact her family again. Was this bank teller interviewed at the Coroner's hearing?

I did not get from the BM that she was the source of this comment at the time ie to the police. I was a bit astounded with her (and AKA) in the casual slighting of MB. 'We thought she was a bit of a flip' This slang is not common in NZ but I gather that it might mean slightly crazy, nutty. is that correct or has it a more definite meaning?

As far as I am aware, the bank teller has not been located.

Description of Marion at the BB bank as a “bit of a flip” possibly indicates:
1. The person wasn’t Marion but someone else impersonating her
2. The person was Marion but under the influence of a mind altering substance.

 

[snarast]

As far as I am aware, the bank teller has not been located.

Description of Marion at the BB bank as a “bit of a flip” possibly indicates:
1. The person wasn’t Marion but someone else impersonating her
2. The person was Marion but under the influence of a mind altering substance.

It is probably mindaltering to be in the process of being gaslighted to this extent.

 

[charliethecat]

It is probably mindaltering to be in the process of being gaslighted to this extent.

Yes I was shocked that someone would say something like this in a formal legal process. Interesting that the BM did not seem to have tried to remember the names of the staff there at the time, she was vague on this point. She did remember that some were full timers and some were part time. I don't know what to think about her.

I was less than impressed by the police officers dealing with missing persons as well. All a bit muddled process-wise and not sure we have the full story on the links with the Salvation Army tracing services either. I guess if bank staff were going around bad mouthing a customer, possibly Marion, this may have had an influence on the response of the Police though, we do or should have expected better. Sort of casually denigrating Marion.

I guess all we know is that money was withdrawn from a bank account owned by MB and that is about the extent of it. Whether this was an impersonator or a deceived Marion I am not sure.

 

[Deleted member 249471]

Something that stuck with me, is that when the Byron Bay bank manager was brought in as a last minute witness to the inquest, Casselden specifically asked her if seeing she was married to a Byron Bay police officer, could her *new* memory of Marion (being flip, withdrawing her money to move to Bali, wanting to start a new life, etc) might be something she heard at home from her husband? Or if she follows the podcast? She said no. But (IMO) it does put the reliability of her statement into question, particularly as she was questioned by police several times over the years, and always said she couldn't remember anything about Marion or those withdrawals.

For context:
Sally claims she went to police 20 Oct 1997.

Byron Bay police claim Sally went to police 22 Oct, 1:15pm.

Later that day at 2.52pm, a warning was put on the file that there were fears for person's welfare/safety, yet it was marked as an occurrence not a missing person.

13 hours later at 4:13am 23 Oct, file changed to 'no further action until person is reported missing'.

Never, in any of the police notes does it say the police saw/located Marion, or the bank saw/located Marion.
And by their own notes, they made no investigation because despite 'fears for welfare' there was 'no further action' required.

Yet about a week after visiting the police, Sally recalls Byron Bay police calling her to say they found Marion and she didn't want anyone to know where she was. Which, of course, Byron Bay cannot remember doing.

IMO, the unsubstantiated rumor that Marion was seen somehow spread so far, the Salvation Army repeated it to Marion's family.

Salvation Army claim they got their info from AFP Missing Persons.
AFP Missing Persons claim they got their info from 'Security' at Colonial Ashmore who told them it was definitely Marion who withdrew $80k and she spoke of 'starting a new life'.
However, Ashmore bank manager claims they never had a Security Officer (back then or ever).
Moreso, Ashmore bank manager doesn't remember the police or Salvation Army ever calling him about Marion.

And it gets worse. In 2007, AFP Missing Persons found NO evidence that Marion had been sighted, so they changed the ‘occurrence’ to ‘missing person’ and sent Marion's file back to Byron Bay to investigate. But AFP Missing Persons don't think anyone at Byron Bay was ever allocated the case.

Then the case was officially shut down again with Sally/Marion being removed from 'the face of missing persons' campaign. Sally remembers being told it was because her mother was not a missing person as she'd been located and didn’t want to be found.

However, in a police email exchange, the reason given is that the case had "challenges". At inquest, a police officer said those "challenges" might simply mean that nothing had been done for 10 years and highlighting Marion's case for the campaign could bring the police embarrassment.

For years the Byron Bay bank manager (who was married to a Byron Bay police officer) said she didn't recall Marion or those withdrawals.

So to have her turn around and suddenly remember Marion... hahahaha... oh my.

One has to ask... who does it benefit?

The main inconsistency in all this is, in my opinion, is that after Marion's accounts were drained, she disappeared with no proof of life after October 1997. Records indicate she never went overseas to Europe or Bali to start a new life. So where is she, what happened to her an where is her money?

Coincidentally, her last known boyfriend/lover opened a bank safety envelope the day before her last withdrawal/proof of life. He is someone with a long criminal past of forgery and theft.

It just boggles the mind how this case didn't have arrests made within the first month of being reported.

 

[Deleted member 249471]

I'm sorry for the long post. Every day that goes by without arrests makes me madder and rantier.

Happy holidays everyone. Let 2024 be the year we find Marion and she gets justice.

 

[Brown Alleycat]

I'm sorry for the long post. Every day that goes by without arrests makes me madder and rantier.

Happy holidays everyone. Let 2024 be the year we find Marion and she gets justice.

No need to apologise Peralta. You set it out so well and spells out such gross negligence by the authorities that should have acted immediately Sally voiced her concerns.

Happy & safe holidays to you and our fellow sleuths and let's hope justice prevails.