Found Deceased Australia - Russell Hill, 74, & Carol Clay, 72, Wonnangatta Valley, 20 March 2020

[TootsieFootsie]

Mystery of missing elderly pair deepens as police explore reports of sightings

As hopes of finding the pair diminished, police have appealed for information to confirm three potential sightings that may have occurred days after the last radio contact with the couple.

Three sightings have been reported from March 22 and police are seeking to establish if they were indeed sightings of the pair. The sightings, detailed by police, include:

A sighting of an older lady at the long drop toilet at Black Snake Creek on March 22;

A sighting of an older couple driving out from Black Snake Creek Hut on March 22 where the female was wearing lipstick and looked out of place; and

A sighting of an older couple near the Eaglevale River crossing and campsite on March 22.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/...ore-reports-of-sightings-20200526-p54wp1.html

 

[Ramjet]

I might rethink whether I need to buy one

 

[Ramjet]

I might rethink whether I need to buy one

 

[TootsieFootsie]

The examination of the fire scene by arson chemists was inconclusive and police would still like to speak to anyone who saw this fire or the smoke from it.

They are also keen to speak to anyone who may have smelled what has been described as a burning plastic smell in the area on 20 or 21 March.
It is still yet to be determined whether their disappearance is suspicious.

Anyone who sights Russell or Carol is urged to contact triple zero (000) immediately.

Again, police would like to speak to anyone who was in these areas at the time so they can be accounted for as part of this investigation and eliminated accordingly.

Anyone with any other information regarding their disappearance or who has any CCTV or dashcam footage is urged to contact Crime Stoppers on 1800 333 000 or log onto www.crimestoppersvic.com.au


Appeal for visitors to Wonnangatta area to contact police as investigation into missing campers continues

 

[PingTheRouter]

They are also keen to speak to anyone who may have smelled what has been described as a burning plastic smell in the area on 20 or 21 March.
It is still yet to be determined whether their disappearance is suspicious.

yeah thats interesting the 20th or 21st they may have been gone by then

i mean what if some local youths came by thinking it was abadoned or something and did something silly and set it alight

they've now muddied a missing persons investigation, you'd hope they would come forward to at least clear things up if that is what happened

or it happened from the charger OR whoever made them disappear did it

 

[TootsieFootsie]

The man who was the last person to speak with Mr Hill, his radio friend Robbie Ashlin, said there was "no way" the 74-year-old would leave his kitted-out white Toyota Landcruiser behind.

"Russell always looked after his equipment," Mr Ashlin said.

"The last thing he said to me was his call sign, VK 3ZP… Wonnangatta Station and that's how he signed off, and that's the last time I spoke to Russell [Hill] and that was on the Friday night.

"Wasn't too alarming to miss one night, but then he missed Sunday night and Monday night," Mr Ashlin added.

Mr Hill's car was returned to the home he shared with his wife of 50 years, before it was seized again by police for further forensic testing.

'Oddball' bushman known as 'Button Man' among those questioned after sightings of missing Victorian campers

 

[tmar]

Waiting for more: ? sightings!

 

[TootsieFootsie]

High Country mystery deepens as police investigate 'new sightings' of missing campers

Detectives have confirmed Mr Hill made two trips to the remote area in the space of a week — travelling there alone to Bluff Track and King Billy with his drone on March 11-13, the week before he took Ms Clay camping.

Plea for people to come forward

Four-wheel drivers, hunters, fishing groups or trail-bike riders who were in the Wonnangatta area in March are urged to contact police, even if they do not believe they saw or heard anything suspicious.

"This is so we can eliminate people and vehicles from the investigation," a police spokeswoman said.

Detectives are also keen to speak to anyone who was in the area of Howitt Plains and Zeka Spur Track on March 19 or 20 and Wonnangatta Station between March 20-24.

 

[TootsieFootsie]

Police say drone could hold vital clues about disappearance of elderly campers

Missing man Russell Hill a 'meticulous camper' with medical conditions, police say.

Police said Mr Hill, a former logger who knew the area well, suffered from various medical ailments, including heart and skin conditions.

"We know that he had spent quite a bit of time up here and he was described to us as being quite meticulous when camping," Acting Inspector Dave Fyfe said.

"With that in mind we don't believe he would have come up here unprepared."

Some of the old mine shafts in the area have been checked as part of the investigation, which has been taken over by Missing Persons Squad detectives.
Mr Hill's wife and Ms Clay's family thought each of them was camping alone, but police declined to speculate further about the nature of their relationship.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

No coincidences. Remember that....

 

[Ramjet]

Police say drone could hold vital clues about disappearance of elderly campers

Missing man Russell Hill a 'meticulous camper' with medical conditions, police say.

Police said Mr Hill, a former logger who knew the area well, suffered from various medical ailments, including heart and skin conditions.

"We know that he had spent quite a bit of time up here and he was described to us as being quite meticulous when camping," Acting Inspector Dave Fyfe said.

"With that in mind we don't believe he would have come up here unprepared."

Some of the old mine shafts in the area have been checked as part of the investigation, which has been taken over by Missing Persons Squad detectives.
Mr Hill's wife and Ms Clay's family thought each of them was camping alone, but police declined to speculate further about the nature of their relationship.

VicPol at their pragmatic best. Never leave a stone unturned. ( any ufo sightings ?)
I really hope they are searching in the right places... places where the drone is likely to go missing.
Obviously the hill side and ridges /valleys close to the camp site.
Any further afield Russell would have driven the car.. so it means he launched the craft from the camp site.
An experienced drone pilot will tell you that this limits the search areas.
You just have to go search.

 

[Ramjet]

Best place to be if you want to be found.. on the top of a ridge line.
Best place to be if you want to survive the night.. in the bottom of a valley.
The drone probably did a forced RTH (return to home) and crashed / forced landing after losing comms.
These drones need line of sight back to the controller for comms to be reliable.
Although the drone will automatically *try* to RTH it's a common mistake to set the RTH height too low (insufficient to clear ridge top) for obstacle avoidance and consequently the craft will do a forced landing when battery runs out.
Looking at the topography within a 3Km range this leaves a few possibilities.. but the area to search is huge.
Combined with the adverse weather and remoteness it is a daunting task.
Unfortunately the desire to recover your expensive drone becomes a challenge too far... the temptation to push your limits just for an expensive toy.
I am now reluctant to ever get involved in this recreation after my research shows so many very bad outcomes.
I would say it would be an enticing 'sport' if you are either rich ..or very fit.

 

[Paul_Pry]

The comments on this facebook post were quite strange.
They discuss how a Carol Clay commented on a previous post about her missing saying she was fine but the post has since gone missing.

Log into Facebook | Facebook

 

[The Odd Sock]

Best place to be if you want to be found.. on the top of a ridge line.
Best place to be if you want to survive the night.. in the bottom of a valley.
The drone probably did a forced RTH (return to home) and crashed / forced landing after losing comms.
These drones need line of sight back to the controller for comms to be reliable.
Although the drone will automatically *try* to RTH it's a common mistake to set the RTH height too low (insufficient to clear ridge top) for obstacle avoidance and consequently the craft will do a forced landing when battery runs out.
Looking at the topography within a 3Km range this leaves a few possibilities.. but the area to search is huge.
Combined with the adverse weather and remoteness it is a daunting task.
Unfortunately the desire to recover your expensive drone becomes a challenge too far... the temptation to push your limits just for an expensive toy.
I am now reluctant to ever get involved in this recreation after my research shows so many very bad outcomes.
I would say it would be an enticing 'sport' if you are either rich ..or very fit.

Best place to be if you want to be found.. on the top of a ridge line.
Best place to be if you want to survive the night.. in the bottom of a valley.


Yet only a day or two ago you flogging the adverts for drones.

The drone probably did a forced RTH (return to home) and crashed / forced landing after losing comms.
These drones need line of sight back to the controller for comms to be reliable.
Although the drone will automatically *try* to RTH it's a common mistake to set the RTH height too low (insufficient to clear ridge top) for obstacle avoidance and consequently the craft will do a forced landing when battery runs out.
Looking at the topography within a 3Km range this leaves a few possibilities.. but the area to search is huge.
Combined with the adverse weather and remoteness it is a daunting task.
Unfortunately the desire to recover your expensive drone becomes a challenge too far... the temptation to push your limits just for an expensive toy.
I am now reluctant to ever get involved in this recreation after my research shows so many very bad outcomes.
I would say it would be an enticing 'sport' if you are either rich ..or very fit.

 

[Ramjet]

The comments on this facebook post were quite strange.
They discuss how a Carol Clay commented on a previous post about her missing saying she was fine but the post has since gone missing.

Log into Facebook | Facebook

Yes it must be awkward for all those other Carol Clays out there.. And there are also a few Russell Hills.

 

[Ramjet]

And the point that you wish to make is ?

 

[PrimeSuspect]

VicPol at their pragmatic best. Never leave a stone unturned. ( any ufo sightings ?)
I really hope they are searching in the right places... places where the drone is likely to go missing.
Obviously the hill side and ridges /valleys close to the camp site.
Any further afield Russell would have driven the car.. so it means he launched the craft from the camp site.
An experienced drone pilot will tell you that this limits the search areas.
You just have to go search.

It's easy to criticise from the comfort of our homes, they've searched high and low and can't find them. It's like, idk, they're hidden... and why would that be?

 

[PrimeSuspect]

The more I think about it, foul play seems to be the answer unless they're voluntarily gone missing, but by family and friend's accounts, it doesn't seem likely. Russell and Carol have known each other for many years (40?), they've gone camping together before. It didn't appear to upset the routine of his marriage, his wife either wasn't aware or didn't care. It just doesn't seem viable they'd run off together.

If someone has harmed them, it'd be hard to move 2 dead bodies any kind of distance. If they were escorted by a person/s carrying a rifle/shotgun, it'd be far easier. They could be taken to a mine shaft or were shot and semi-buried under logs and debris.
The fire was extensive, nothing remained. Why would anyone coming across an empty tent burn it to the ground, the owners could return at any time. If the arsonist has harmed Russell and Carol, that does seem more likely. If a charger was the culprit, it wouldn't have happened when Russell was there because why would he then go off to fly his drone?!

If nothing untoward has happened re: a third party, I don't think Carol would've gone searching for the drone with Russell. If he went off to fly the drone and never returned because he'd been injured or suffered a heart attack, she'd be panicking. Would she go seek help from strangers, risking their affair being exposed to Russell's wife, her friend, or would she try to find him, herself? Carol wasn't an experience bush walker, she wasn't 'into' the outdoors, she wasn't used to roughing it, she would have ordinarily stuck to the camp sites and open field areas which were plenty in the area they camped. If she's gone into the thick bush searching for Russell, she could have collapsed from stress and exhaustion and died.
But it doesn't makes sense why neither have been found by searchers or their bodies detected by drones. Why would coincidently, both be well hidden in the bush?

 

[Ramjet]

The more I think about it, foul play seems to be the answer unless they're voluntarily gone missing, but by family and friend's accounts, it doesn't seem likely. Russell and Carol have known each other for many years (40?), they've gone camping together before. It didn't appear to upset the routine of his marriage, his wife either wasn't aware or didn't care. It just doesn't seem viable they'd run off together.

If someone has harmed them, it'd be hard to move 2 dead bodies any kind of distance. If they were escorted by a person/s carrying a rifle/shotgun, it'd be far easier. They could be taken to a mine shaft or were shot and semi-buried under logs and debris.
The fire was extensive, nothing remained. Why would anyone coming across an empty tent burn it to the ground, the owners could return at any time. If the arsonist has harmed Russell and Carol, that does seem more likely. If a charger was the culprit, it wouldn't have happened when Russell was there because why would he then go off to fly his drone?!

If nothing untoward has happened re: a third party, I don't think Carol would've gone searching for the drone with Russell. If he went off to fly the drone and never returned because he'd been injured or suffered a heart attack, she'd be panicking. Would she go seek help from strangers, risking their affair being exposed to Russell's wife, her friend, or would she try to find him, herself? Carol wasn't an experience bush walker, she wasn't 'into' the outdoors, she wasn't used to roughing it, she would have ordinarily stuck to the camp sites and open field areas which were plenty in the area they camped. If she's gone into the thick bush searching for Russell, she could have collapsed from stress and exhaustion and died.
But it doesn't makes sense why neither have been found by searchers or their bodies detected by drones. Why would coincidently, both be well hidden in the bush?

Initial search began ~ 6 days after disappearance... too late for any meaningful forensics.
And .. as it turned out.. inadequate resources due to logistics (weather / covid / remoteness)
Only after a long time delay was the drone factored into the disappearance.
Subsequent search included denser bushland but still negative.
Unfortunately no others in the vicinity to respond to any calls for help on UHF CB .. which he almost certainly would have carried.
So .. when there is nobody around to help you when you get into trouble .. and no alarm raised for many days .. it is no big surprise to me that they met there demise chasing a lost drone.
The area to cover is simply too large.
And remember.. these are country folk .. probably quite tough and stubborn enough to go push their limits.
Unless the drone turns up somewhere it is safe to assume that this is the likely culprit.

 

[Paul_Pry]

VicPol at their pragmatic best. Never leave a stone unturned. ( any ufo sightings ?)

VUFORS - Wonnangatta Sighting - 8th of June, 1996
A UFO was sighted in 1996 at the Wonnangatta station by a four weel drive club, there were 50 adults and 20 to 30 children there at the time.