Australia Australia - William Tyrrell, 3, Kendall, NSW, 12 Sept 2014 - #25

[deugirtni]

It is okay by me .... considering that the proof was all there many years ago - medical reports, police investigation, detailed accounts from the young girls - and it was decided not to prosecute to avoid putting the girls through that trauma. Now the girls are old enough to insist on the prosecution themselves, and testify themselves.

Nobody 'just accused' Spedding. Serious charges have been laid.


Police have been informed the offences … were not pursued formally by police at the time of disclosure due to concerns as to the welfare of the victims, given their tender age,” a fact sheet said.
http://www.news.com.au/national/cri...g/news-story/2a8a51819720492213582b8d70dc61da

If the proof was all there many years ago, there is not a chance they would have just let him go, 'to avoid putting the girls through that trauma'. Otherwise all perps of young children would be roaming our streets so none would have to be put through it. Please recall what the judge commented about those historical charges.

Bill Spedding was granted bail for historical child sex offences on Friday after a court heard there was a possibility his alleged victims had been "coached" or "cajoled" into naming him as their attacker.

During Friday's bail application, NSW Supreme Court Justice Geoffrey Bellow said there were many "substantive issues" with the case against Mr Spedding.

"[There is a] real issue that either or both victims have been coached or cajoled into making the allegations that they make," Justice Bellow said.


"It is difficult to accept the Crown case is strong in circumstances where, as I have pointed out, that one of the victims has no recollection at all about the incident," Justice Bellow said.


Police have obtained statements from the two victims and obtained evidence that one victim at the time allegedly said: "Bill did it."


Justice Bellow said that, while the allegations were serious and there was medical evidence to support the victims' injury claims, there was still a question as to who attacked the girls.
....

"[The defence] highlighted there remained a real issue as to who was responsible," Justice Bellow said.


As part of the bail application, Mr Spedding's lawyers argued that his alleged victims had come into contact with Hillsley.


The court heard Mr Spedding had already been the subject of a police investigation for the same offences 28 years ago at which point a decision was made not to press charges.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/bill-sped...-over-child-sex-offences-20150618-ghry1m.html

 

[Bohemian]

Reward boosts Strike Force Rosann investigations

http://www.camdencourier.com.au/story/4249489/tyrrell-reward-boosts-strike-force-response/

Thanks for the link Morrisa x

 

[JLZ]

For the nonce let's allow that the police were right in saying that none of William's family was involved in his abduction. Let's also allow that the profiler was right in saying that the abductor was experienced in the type of offence. Let's also accept the early hint that the motive was child sexual abuse.

It seems to me that a quite short shortlist of most likely culprits could be created. Those who've been convicted of the sexual assault especially with kidnapping of very young boys not previously known to them through family. Once you exclude child sex offenders who prefer girls, older children, and those who prey on family and family friends, you drastically filter the historical list.

There's at least one on Hinch's list (http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/re...e/news-story/3b04eb8d5f81c7e315e869722d3cbc21) who looks like a candidate. I would really like to know his movements in September 2014.

 

[deugirtni]

Who asks for a declaration that they did not sexually abuse someone? Innocent or guilty.
imo

That isn't exactly what happened. Obviously BS and his wife had a current ongoing relationship with the one female, and she was asked, among others, to provide a character reference. MS later texted her in disbelief that she was involved in reigniting the historical charges.

Mr Spedding was refused bail at Port Macquarie Local Court in April after the magistrate read court documents alleging he had tried to contact one of his alleged victims and asked them to write a character reference for him.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/bill-sped...dering-rapist-court-told-20150614-ghnx8h.html

Police allege that, since Spedding became aware they were making inquiries with him in relation to the disappearance of William Tyrrell, he had contacted people he knows in the hope of obtaining character references.


They allege his wife Margaret contacted one of the alleged victims by text shortly after he was arrested and said: “It really saddens me you’re involved in this.”

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...k=277c872ba30ff2f36f0f1c3519df9e25-1477386705

 

[sosocurious]

That isn't exactly what happened. Obviously BS and his wife had a current ongoing relationship with the one female, and she was asked, among others, to provide a character reference. MS later texted her in disbelief that she was involved in reigniting the historical charges.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/bill-sped...dering-rapist-court-told-20150614-ghnx8h.html

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/ne...k=277c872ba30ff2f36f0f1c3519df9e25-1477386705

He contacted one of his alleged victims, who is now an adult, “directly lobbying” her to declare he did not sexually abuse her when she was a child, according to police facts tendered in court.

The alleged victim refused and reported his request to police.

http://www.news.com.au/national/cri...g/news-story/2a8a51819720492213582b8d70dc61da

 

[sosocurious]

One alleged victim told police “the accused has directly lobbied her for a declaration that states he did not sexually abuse her or similar when she was a child”.

After his arrest on Wednesday, this alleged victim received calls and a text message from a “third party” known to Mr Spedding, which read, “It really saddens me you’re involved in this”, the documents allege.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...d/news-story/60e517cfba665cfb3adc60b763b674d4

 

[deugirtni]

He contacted one of his alleged victims, who is now an adult, “directly lobbying” her to declare he did not sexually abuse her when she was a child, according to police facts tendered in court.

The alleged victim refused and reported his request to police.

http://www.news.com.au/national/cri...g/news-story/2a8a51819720492213582b8d70dc61da

The first sentence, which was omitted in the quote above, appears to contain the gist of what was in the court documents and what was reported by other MSM. The second sentence may be editorial embellishment as i cannot find reference to that part in other publications. jmo.

According to court documents, Mr Spedding asked an alleged victim to sign a declaration about his “good character” after learning police were investigating him over William’s disappearance.


He contacted one of his alleged victims, who is now an adult, “directly lobbying” her to declare he did not sexually abuse her when she was a child, according to police facts tendered in court.


The alleged victim refused and reported his request to police.

 

[Bohemian]

For the nonce let's allow that the police were right in saying that none of William's family was involved in his abduction. Let's also allow that the profiler was right in saying that the abductor was experienced in the type of offence. Let's also accept the early hint that the motive was child sexual abuse.

It seems to me that a quite short shortlist of most likely culprits could be created. Those who've been convicted of the sexual assault especially with kidnapping of very young boys not previously known to them through family. Once you exclude child sex offenders who prefer girls, older children, and those who prey on family and family friends, you drastically filter the historical list.

There's at least one on Hinch's list (http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/re...e/news-story/3b04eb8d5f81c7e315e869722d3cbc21) who looks like a candidate. I would really like to know his movements in September 2014.

I agree. Did you have to post that at night-time? <modsnip>

 

[deugirtni]

I agree. Did you have to post that at night-time? <modsnip>

It's amazing how unattractive they all are, for the most part. <modsnip>

 

[Bohemian]

It's amazing how unattractive they all are, for the most part. <modsnip>

I've read the article before but the first photo never fails to cause me to gasp and screw up my eyes *shudders*

 

[deugirtni]

One alleged victim told police &#8220;the accused has directly lobbied her for a declaration that states he did not sexually abuse her or similar when she was a child&#8221;.

After his arrest on Wednesday, this alleged victim received calls and a text message from a &#8220;third party&#8221; known to Mr Spedding, which read, &#8220;It really saddens me you&#8217;re involved in this&#8221;, the documents allege.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...d/news-story/60e517cfba665cfb3adc60b763b674d4

Okay, so there are two.. but those 2 (and others) seem to be related publications (probably duplicating stories by changing a few words). Not saying it's not true, since it is in quotes. BS seems, over all this time, imho, to have taken all of the bait laid out for him, and also seemed to do whatever he could think of doing, to try to clear his name.. sometimes (or even often) to his detriment. I'm not sure, but more experienced people might have just laid low and remained silent, which also would have garnered suspicion. I guess none of us can really say how we'd react if we were publicly blasted all over the country's media as being potentially involved in a high profile child disappearance case such as this with undertones of pedophile involvement. I was always told... don't judge until you've walked the road, and I try my best to live up to that. I also try really hard not to be swayed by media 'takes' on whatever situations, and wait for facts. Again jmo.

 

[bearbear]

interesting american article on the use of the term person of interest......
http://www.apmreports.org/story/2016/09/27/what-it-means-to-be-a-person-of-interest

 

[crabstick]

So POI has no legal definition which avoids litigation of the prosecutor and police

"Person of interest" is a term widely used by the police, but it's relatively new, having emerged in the mid-1990s. In most cases, it appears to be a euphemism for "suspect," with enough vagueness thrown in to temper expectations and afford legal protection

interesting american article on the use of the term person of interest......
http://www.apmreports.org/story/2016/09/27/what-it-means-to-be-a-person-of-interest

 

[Deleted member 102539]

One alleged victim told police &#8220;the accused has directly lobbied her for a declaration that states he did not sexually abuse her or similar when she was a child&#8221;.

After his arrest on Wednesday, this alleged victim received calls and a text message from a &#8220;third party&#8221; known to Mr Spedding, which read, &#8220;It really saddens me you&#8217;re involved in this&#8221;, the documents allege.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...d/news-story/60e517cfba665cfb3adc60b763b674d4

bbm red

Lovely "lion mother" MS.

 

[deugirtni]

So POI has no legal definition which avoids litigation of the prosecutor and police

"Person of interest" is a term widely used by the police, but it's relatively new, having emerged in the mid-1990s. In most cases, it appears to be a euphemism for "suspect," with enough vagueness thrown in to temper expectations and afford legal protection

It seems that at least in the USA, there is recourse for being convicted in the media. If it should so turn out that BS is not involved, I hope he can make up for his financial losses through suing the media. Police aren't always correct in the directions they take.

The term apparently arose after the case of Richard Jewell, the security guard who found a backpack containing a bomb on the grounds of the 1996 summer Olympics in Atlanta. He alerted the police and helped evacuate people before the bomb exploded. At first hailed a hero, Jewell came to be regarded as a suspect. The FBI publicly searched his home and he was essentially convicted in the media, who attacked him, he said, like "piranha on a bleeding cow." His life was upended before he was eventually cleared. Jewell won lawsuits against various media organizations, and the attorney general at the time, Janet Reno, formally apologized.

This is an interesting article on one of the people from the linked article above who was seen as a person of interest for 27 years. It was eventually a member of the media who delved into the details and got the ball rolling to find the actual perp: "But she just didn’t give up. She got in touch with Jared. She went to all these old newspaper clippings. I just can stop bragging her up"

http://wjon.com/dan-rassier-speaks-out-after-being-cleared-in-jacob-wetterling-abduction-video/

 

[Sillybilly]

Have all of the BS alleged victims been female so far?

IF your question is relation to pedophilia and previous victims, just wanted to point out that pedophilia is an attraction to prepubescent children and doesn't necessarily involve a specific gender.

from:
The Psychology of Pedophilia

Pedophilia is a paraphilia that can be described as an unnatural attraction towards prepubescent children. A person suffering from this psychosexual disorder exhibits an abnormal sexual attraction towards children of either sex.

My apology if your question was related to something else, but thought I'd throw it in.

 

[Bohemian]

IF your question is relation to pedophilia and previous victims, just wanted to point out that pedophilia is an attraction to prepubescent children and doesn't necessarily involve a specific gender.

from:
The Psychology of Pedophilia

My apology if your question was related to something else, but thought I'd throw it in.

Thanks for the link, sillybilly. I feel it's going to come in very handy.

OT.

A prime example of the above term, recently sentenced to 15 years' jail in Indonesia:

Robert Ellis

 

[SouthAussie]

It seems that at least in the USA, there is recourse for being convicted in the media. If it should so turn out that BS is not involved, I hope he can make up for his financial losses through suing the media. Police aren't always correct in the directions they take.

Spedding has already tried official complaints, via his legal rep .... unsuccessful. As ruled by the Press Council and by a Magistrate, who both know the laws in this regard very well.
As long as the media do not point the finger only at him, seems they will be fine.


The Sydney Morning Herald has been found not to have breached the Press Council’s privacy standards over reporting of the police investigation into missing NSW toddler William Tyrrell.
A complaint was brought against the newspaper after print and online articles appeared on January 22, 2015, which covered the police search of William Harrie Spedding’s property.
https://mumbrella.com.au/smh-cleare...s-in-reporting-of-william-tyrrell-case-310476


Mr O'Brien argued in the age of social media publication of the details of the Victorian charges against Spedding would lead to "perverse, unusual and bizarre results".
Magistrate Mark Stratmann refused the suppression order application, ruling properly directed jurors could be trusted to judge evidence on its own merit, regardless of media reports.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-...l-spedding-will-try-to-stop-nsw-trial/7669984

 

[SouthAussie]

IF your question is relation to pedophilia and previous victims, just wanted to point out that pedophilia is an attraction to prepubescent children and doesn't necessarily involve a specific gender.

from:
The Psychology of Pedophilia

My apology if your question was related to something else, but thought I'd throw it in.

Yes, I have read a lot of articles that say that it very frequently/usually is not about the sex of the child, but more about the child's stage of development.
Lots of links out there about it, here are a couple.

.... child sex offenders who have a preference for a particular ‘age group’ are likely to be attracted to the typical body type of that age group ....
http://aic.gov.au/publications/current series/tandi/421-440/tandi429.html

A large percentage of male pedophiles are homosexual or bisexual in orientation to children, meaning they are attracted to male children or both male and female children (Schiffer, 2008).
https://neuroanthropology.net/2010/05/10/inside-the-mind-of-a-pedophile/

 

[deugirtni]

IF your question is relation to pedophilia and previous victims, just wanted to point out that pedophilia is an attraction to prepubescent children and doesn't necessarily involve a specific gender.

from:
The Psychology of Pedophilia



My apology if your question was related to something else, but thought I'd throw it in.

I had understood that to be the case as well, however at the same time, doesn't it seem that most that we hear about seem to be attracted to the same type in most cases, ie a certain age group, a certain sex, even though prepubescent?