AZ - Gabriel Cuen-Buitimea, allegedly shot and killed with an AK-47 by rancher George Alan Kelly, 75, Kino Springs, Jan 2023

[wary]

I can't say for sure but I would think that a bullet striking the ground would expend a lot of it's energy and become deformed before hitting a persons body.

Would a ricocheting bullet be able to go completely through the victims body? I have doubts about that. JMO.

I’d wondered about that—or at least that the bullet would tumble and make a different type of path through the body.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Wait. What? How does he qualify for a public defender?

Criteria to Qualify for a Public Defender in Arizona?

The 14th Amendment of the US Constitution guarantees the right to due process and equal protection for American citizens who meet specific criteria.

www.jacksonwhitelaw.com

In Arizona, the state will conduct a “means test” to determine if a defendant is financially unable to hire an attorney. The defendant must complete a questionnaire under oath, answering questions pertaining to disposable income and family size.

After the questionnaire is completed, a judge or court commissioner will assess the defendant’s financial ability to hire an attorney. Generally speaking, defendants who fall below the poverty line should be approved for a public defender.

If your petition is denied because your disposable income and family size places you above the poverty line, you can request reconsideration based on factors such as loss in income or other financial commitments.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

I’d wondered about that—or at least that the bullet would tumble and make a different type of path through the body.

I'm not sure about a different path but I would assume that a bullet that is sideways when it enters a body would leave a different entry wound. JMO.

 

[WingsOverTX]

Wait. What? How does he qualify for a public defender?

I don't know how he qualifies for a PD.

"Attorney Brenna Larkin, who was appointed by the court to represent Kelly, said in her request that her client “admitted to firing warning shots at the smugglers earlier in the day, but denied firing any shot at any person."

Arizona rancher denies killing Mexican shot dead by border

The lawyer for and Arizona rancher being held on $1 million bond in the fatal shooting of a Mexican on his border property says her client did not shoot and kill the man but did fire warning shots earlier in the day at some armed smugglers he encountered

abcnews.go.com

 

[WingsOverTX]

I don't know how he qualifies for a PD.

"Attorney Brenna Larkin, who was appointed by the court to represent Kelly, said in her request that her client “admitted to firing warning shots at the smugglers earlier in the day, but denied firing any shot at any person."

Arizona rancher denies killing Mexican shot dead by border

The lawyer for and Arizona rancher being held on $1 million bond in the fatal shooting of a Mexican on his border property says her client did not shoot and kill the man but did fire warning shots earlier in the day at some armed smugglers he encountered

abcnews.go.com

Maybe GK's liquid assets are minimal enough? He had to put his property up as bond collateral.

 

[everybodhi]

campaigns to pay for Kelly’s legal defense have been shut down and the money was returned to donors, the platform said last week in a statement.

“’s Terms of Service explicitly prohibit campaigns that raise money to cover the legal defense of anyone formally charged with an alleged violent crime,” it said. “Consistent with this long-standing policy, any fundraising campaigns for the legal defense of someone charged with murder are removed from our platform.”

GiveSendGo, which describes itself as a Christian fundraising platform, carries at least four campaigns collecting money for Kelly’s legal defense, including one that gathered more than $300,000 as of Wednesday.

Prosecutor: Arizona border rancher shot unarmed men, 1 died

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

I don’t pretend to know what happened that day but I just read today that we are now at 3% of cases not making a plea so the odds are against this, or anyone else, ever going to trial.
The pattern is now to over charge to force a plea agreement, they have made it not feasible to fight charges.
With a murder charge he can liquidate all his assets to pay the lawyers a million on a gamble to prove innocence, if he loses he dies in prison and his wife is left destitute and if he is acquitted he will still be broke, or he can plea to a lessor charge and possibly still have a life left to live.
It’s a travesty that our justice system has come to this, imo.

Crowd funding seems to be effective in cases such as this.

 

[WingsOverTX]

campaigns to pay for Kelly’s legal defense have been shut down and the money was returned to donors, the platform said last week in a statement.

“’s Terms of Service explicitly prohibit campaigns that raise money to cover the legal defense of anyone formally charged with an alleged violent crime,” it said. “Consistent with this long-standing policy, any fundraising campaigns for the legal defense of someone charged with murder are removed from our platform.”

GiveSendGo, which describes itself as a Christian fundraising platform, carries at least four campaigns collecting money for Kelly’s legal defense, including one that gathered more than $300,000 as of Wednesday.

Prosecutor: Arizona border rancher shot unarmed men, 1 died

That $300,000+ went toward his $1 million bond IIRC.

 

[everybodhi]

I don't know how he qualifies for a PD.

"Attorney Brenna Larkin, who was appointed by the court to represent Kelly, said in her request that her client “admitted to firing warning shots at the smugglers earlier in the day, but denied firing any shot at any person."

Arizona rancher denies killing Mexican shot dead by border

The lawyer for and Arizona rancher being held on $1 million bond in the fatal shooting of a Mexican on his border property says her client did not shoot and kill the man but did fire warning shots earlier in the day at some armed smugglers he encountered

abcnews.go.com

This is the first I’ve ever heard of a state paying for the destitute defense of someone who put up a million in assets to bail out.
Edited to add: she’s not even a public defender, she’s in private practice

Prosecutor: Arizona border rancher shot unarmed men, 1 died

Justice of the Peace Emilio G. Velasquez on Wednesday ordered that Kelly’s bond be changed from a cash to a surety bond, which would allow Kelly to put up his ranch and home rather than come up with cash and allow him to leave custody while the case plays out.

 

[worm]

Given his age I’ve thought that may play a role in his getting a defense if he only has SS income.

 

[everybodhi]

>snipped
With a murder charge he can liquidate all his assets to pay the lawyers a million on a gamble to prove innocence, if he loses he dies in prison and his wife is left destitute and if he is acquitted he will still be broke, or he can plea to a lessor charge and possibly still have a life left to live.
It’s a travesty that our justice system has come to this, imo.

I take all this back, his defense is paid by taxpayers, he’s out on a $1 mill property surety bond and I just found several sites raising money for him totaling half a million in donations within a few days.
I was wrong, a murder charge can be very profitable

Edited to add: his wife has started a private fund registered as a business but doesn’t divulge what she has collected
GEORGE ALAN KELLY LEGAL DEFENSE FUND in Nogales, AZ | Company Info

 

[everybodhi]

Given his age I’ve thought that may play a role in his getting a defense if he only has SS income.

I predict his book sales will take off now
Jmo

 

[WingsOverTX]

I take all this back, his defense is paid by taxpayers, he’s out on a $1 mill property surety bond and I just found several sites raising money for him totaling half a million in donations within a few days.
I was wrong, a murder charge can be very profitable

Where's the profit? He had to meet a means test to have a public defender. Those who donated toward his bond/defense did so willingly.

He would be sitting in jail if the ridiculously high bond was not met. I think that was the intent of the million dollar bond. Anything over $250,000 bond was simply a pre-trial punishment IMO. Not to be crude, but his chances of dying from natural causes are higher than his chances of fleeing.

JMO

 

[AZLocal]

You could be right. But I'm not convinced that Mr Kelly shot the victim. I think it is possible that one of his armed companions may have inadvertently shot him. JMO.

Is there a link to some evidence that leads you to think this is possible?

 

[WingsOverTX]

I predict his book sales will take off now
Jmo

He won't get rich off his book sales. Seriously.

Respectfully, not liking GK doesn't mean you have to attack his right to have assets.

The court appointed a public defender. Quibble with the court?!
MOO

 

[everybodhi]

Where's the profit? He had to meet a means test to have a public defender. Those who donated toward his bond/defense did so willingly.

He would be sitting in jail if the ridiculously high bond was not met. I think that was the intent of the million dollar bond. Anything over $250,000 bond was simply a pre-trial punishment IMO. Not to be crude, but his chances of dying from natural causes are higher than his chances of fleeing.

JMO

The funds being raised are all profit, he didn’t pay a dime for bail, he got a property surety bond based on property worth $1 million and his lawyer is free.

 

[everybodhi]

He won't get rich off his book sales. Seriously.

Respectfully, not liking GK doesn't mean you have to attack his right to have assets.

The court appointed a public defender. Quibble with the court?!
MOO

I never suggested he got rich off book sales, I don’t know how he acquired a million in property, I predicted his book sales will increase now and I stand by that.
I’m not attacking his right to have assets and I suspect I don’t need to “quibble with the courts”, the funds being raised for his legal defense are posted publicly, (except his wife’s fund) I think this will come to the courts attention without me.

 

[NuttMegg]

I predict his book sales will take off now
Jmo

Lol. Even I bought it.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Is there a link to some evidence that leads you to think this is possible?

The trajectory of the bullet from low in his back to an exit in the upper chest in the victims body makes me feel that it's possible someone close behind him may have fire the shot that killed him. JMO.

The autopsy report found that the bullet entered Buitimea’s body from the back lower right portion of his ribcage and exited from his left upper chest area, according to testimony from Jorge Ainza, the Santa Cruz County Sheriff's Department detective who arrested Kelly.

Case of Nogales rancher charged with murder moves to trial after witness dramatically details shooting

Witness testimony revealed new details about the case of George Alan Kelly, the Nogales rancher accused of murder.

www.azcentral.com

 

[PrairieWind]

Wait. What? How does he qualify for a public defender?

I have seen no indication that his attorney is a public defender. The fact that there are fund raising efforts would indicate his attorney is a private attorney. I can't imagine he would qualify for a PD.