AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #13

[SallyManda]

Regarding the FLorida issue:
I think a lot of people don't realize that northern Florida and the panhandle aren't the tropical palm tree places people think of as Florida. Pine trees are native. There are a lot of people without secondary education, and drug use and domestic violence appear to be a lot more common than other areas I've lived. Panama City is known as the "redneck riviera". Down towards southern Florida is a vast melting pot and like someone else said I think it would be an easy place to get away to if you want to enjoy life and blend in..

 

[Prof]

Is there anyway to find out if she ended up buying the business Tammi had to sell? She sold it to an employee/friend and this person is a close friend of tammi

I was wondering this, and I am sure there is a way--although her friend does not have the same address or phone as TS had in TN

I found an old ad for the TN business of TS posted on one of her many defunct pages

 

[Amster]

Maybe she was met in Ft. Lauderdale by "handlers".....probably supposed to lay low at the hostel but she blew it by texting or posting on her MS.....

 

[STEADFAST]

She could have met some foreign young people traveling around the U.S. by bus and just gone to the hostel with them. She would have been on the bus long enough to make friends.

 

[daisy7]

Sorry, I'm behind on this thread. Do we know for certain that she had a bus ticket to Lauderdale?

 

[panthera]

She could have met some foreign young people traveling around the U.S. by bus and just gone to the hostel with them. She would have been on the bus long enough to make friends.

While on this subject, do we know how long the bus trip from San Antonio to Ft. Lauderdale took, and how long she'd been at the hostel when arrested?

 

[Marigold]

Okay, this isn't exactly in the flow of conversation, but I just wanted to explain to the Texans here why some of us can't seem to shake the idea that San Antonio is not on the way to Miami. Maybe others have a similar mental map to mine, that puts San Antonio south of a direct route to Florida, and makes it seem like EJ went way out of her way to go to San Antonio.

When I try really hard to picture the route as it really is, I think it's possible that EJ just got tired of traveling with a baby when she got to San Antonio, and wanted either for Logan to sign the papers so she could go back to Arizona or, if he wouldn't sign, to continue traveling without Gabriel.

Thank you for both of these maps! I really appreciate the time and effort you put into them.

 

[panthera]

Sorry, I'm behind on this thread. Do we know for certain that she had a bus ticket to Lauderdale?

I'll try to find the link, or it may be in the sticky thread, but early on the ticket agent at the bus station in San Antonio said she'd bought a ticket for Ft. Lauderdale.

 

[OneLove]

While on this subject, do we know how long the bus trip from San Antonio to Ft. Lauderdale took, and how long she'd been at the hostel when arrested?

And what it is that lead to her being found there?

 

[time]

I'm not sure if anyone has mentioned this possibility for Elizabeth going to Florida. To preface it, I lived in Florida for several years, not in Miami, but I'm somewhat familiar with it.

I think it's possible Elizabeth got some lead on a job in Florida, maybe even from someone in San Antonio. Or she knew somehow there might be jobs there. Miami has a huge adult entertainment industry as far as night clubs, strippers, etc. Seemed to me rules are more lax on these things. She might also be in demand as a nanny or get easy work in a restaurant, hotel, etc. There is a lot of seasonal work in many areas due to tourism.

There are also lots of rich folk in Florida, esp near Miami.

Some rules are lax in Florida also... like on driver licenses (I think), but they are changing that. No personal income tax unless they changed that. I agree with all the things one poster said also on reasons it might be so crime ridden, plus so many illegals.

 

[trudysplace]

Wow. Good thoughts, Kamille. You're right about the agitation. And yes, this could well have been very spur of the moment, get-out-of-dodge.

Then yes, not wanting to be traced (she seems to have made several references to not wanting to be traced), she could have headed to Miami Beach and the hostel, just to cool her heels and figure out what to do/where to go next.

Good points.

But it all comes back to San Antonio, she left there without baby Gabriel. That should be our focus point...because once she boarded that bus, it was WITHOUT precious Gabriel. Who cares why she went to Florida? The point being, Gabriel was not in her arms. Just a back pack.

We might as well give up on LE providing us or the public the much needed information we so long for. In that case, we might as well grasp our boot straps and get down to work.

The last sighting of baby Gabriel was on December 26, 2009.
Elizabeth boarded that bus on December 27th.

Leave the Smiths out of this. Let's get focused again.

Help. I beg you all.

Let's figure this out!

 

[LogicalMinds]

Months ago, I used to blog with several people who lived in FL and the more research I would do on the case we were all following, the more the mainstream FL news stuck out as outright weird, violent and beyond average compared to other large cities. Crimes there against others, (including children) just seemed more rampant, violent and bizarre than anywhere else so I asked a few of the fellow FL bloggers what the deal was with their state. The answer I usually got was that they agreed and there take on it was because not only does FL have the 3rd highest population after TX and CA, but so many of FL's population are displaced people from other states ... but even more than that, that they believed that people just tended to gravitate toward FL when they wanted to start their lives over (and/or were running away from something) for whatever their reasons. FL is basically warm also which a few of them commented on because if you're fleeing somewhere else for a new life with little to no money, no job, no housing, etc and may end up homeless for awhile, better it be somewhere nice and warm, than cold. Not to mention it seems when you're running away and starting life over, it seems FL just seems to be a haven to attract those kind of people and usually they turn out to be quite nutty as a result.

I don't know why so many odd people with issues seem to end up in FL and in the news, but their responses to me above seemed to make at least a little sense. Maybe EJ wasn't unlike any of the others before her, deciding to start over in a nice climate, new name, new identity, far away from AZ on the opposite end of the country (with help it seems). Or, maybe she really was eventually trying to flee the country altogether and make it to who knows where going through Miami. Like the Anthony case, it seems the more that comes out about this case, the more confusing it gets. :banghead:

I live here and I agree....when we watch AMW it is amazing how many times the "perp" is headed here (2nd choice seems to be California)

Transient...many motels, no tell motels, campgrounds, etc....lots of newcomers, few "natives" , nice weather (except for that one cold week)...
easy to get around...cheap airfares...no questions asked I guess

It is amazing how many people come here for some last stand or whatever.. ...a famous one was the gay serial killer guy who came here to kill Gianni Versace

Our "local" crime section always has cases where people from other states are picked up on a BOLO or stopped at traffic stop or something and they find warrants on them...many extraditions
I am sure that cops from Buffalo and Chicago etc do enjoy coming down here to pick up a prisoner haha

Century ago Key West was THE place for people who wanted to leave a spouse, a job, or escape the law, unwed moms, bigamists, deserters from the service and any other thing you can think of
and I guess it is somewhat like that today?? However, I must say that where I live feels perfectly safe, safer than many places "up north"...and the weather is usually nice (just not that one horrible cold week LOL)

 

[pghbrandi]

I was wondering this, and I am sure there is a way--although her friend does not have the same address or phone as TS had in TN

I found an old ad for the TN business of TS posted on one of her many defunct pages

I found something about the sale of the old business and it now has a new name. Sorry if you already knew that!!!

 

[Marigold]

Months ago, I used to blog with several people who lived in FL and the more research I would do on the case we were all following, the more the mainstream FL news stuck out as outright weird, violent and beyond average compared to other large cities. Crimes there against others, (including children) just seemed more rampant, violent and bizarre than anywhere else so I asked a few of the fellow FL bloggers what the deal was with their state. The answer I usually got was that they agreed and there take on it was because not only does FL have the 3rd highest population after TX and CA, but so many of FL's population are displaced people from other states ... but even more than that, that they believed that people just tended to gravitate toward FL when they wanted to start their lives over (and/or were running away from something) for whatever their reasons. FL is basically warm also which a few of them commented on because if you're fleeing somewhere else for a new life with little to no money, no job, no housing, etc and may end up homeless for awhile, better it be somewhere nice and warm, than cold. Not to mention it seems when you're running away and starting life over, it seems FL just seems to be a haven to attract those kind of people and usually they turn out to be quite nutty as a result.

I don't know why so many odd people with issues seem to end up in FL and in the news, but their responses to me above seemed to make at least a little sense. Maybe EJ wasn't unlike any of the others before her, deciding to start over in a nice climate, new name, new identity, far away from AZ on the opposite end of the country (with help it seems). Or, maybe she really was eventually trying to flee the country altogether and make it to who knows where going through Miami. Like the Anthony case, it seems the more that comes out about this case, the more confusing it gets. :banghead:

Bolding mine
Arizona is also a haven for people seeking a second chance for their life, so maybe she went to FL because it would feel similar to AZ? (I think the statistics for AZ are something like for every five people that move here, three people move out within two years , but don't quote me on this.) I also think that the weather may have been a factor, she probably wanted to go someplace far away but also had similar weather to AZ. (I know there's differences, but FL weather is closer to AZ weather than someplace like AK or MA.)

 

[time]

But it all comes back to San Antonio, she left there without baby Gabriel. That should be our focus point...because once she boarded that bus, it was WITHOUT precious Gabriel. Who cares why she went to Florida? The point being, Gabriel was not in her arms. Just a back pack.

We might as well give up on LE providing us or the public the much needed information we so long for. In that case, we might as well grasp our boot straps and get down to work.

The last sighting of baby Gabriel was on December 26, 2009.
Elizabeth boarded that bus on December 27th.

Leave the Smiths out of this. Let's get focused again.

Help. I beg you all.

Let's figure this out!

There's no reason to act like those of use who think the Smith's are involved are not focused.

 

[Gypsy Road]

Regarding the FLorida issue:
I think a lot of people don't realize that northern Florida and the panhandle aren't the tropical palm tree places people think of as Florida. Pine trees are native. There are a lot of people without secondary education, and drug use and domestic violence appear to be a lot more common than other areas I've lived. Panama City is known as the "redneck riviera". Down towards southern Florida is a vast melting pot and like someone else said I think it would be an easy place to get away to if you want to enjoy life and blend in..

This is so true. North and South Florida are really two seperate worlds as far as demographics, climate, etc go. I live in North Florida and we often call this area L.A. (Lower Alabama).:crazy:

Like SallyManda said, Miami is a huge melting pot. I think EJ could have easily blended in there and perhaps not recognized as easily. To be honest I think I would have a hard time recognizing her. She looks so different in each and every photo that has been released. Her mug shots look nothing like the other pictures I've seen of her when she is all made up.

 

[OneLove]

She could have met some foreign young people traveling around the U.S. by bus and just gone to the hostel with them. She would have been on the bus long enough to make friends.

Also, as much as I really hate to bring this up, south Florida is rampant with recreational drug use among young folk. Many internationals come from countries where the laws are much more liberal also. Many young internationals come there to party hardy, kwim?

I suspect Gabriel had more than one parent that had experience with drugs. It seems this was not made into an issue by EJ until she was mad that he was not pursuing HER anymore while at the same time he WAS insuring his legal parental rights.

 

[panthera]

And what it is that lead to her being found there?

I believe it was Logan who contacted LE. IP address traced after she posted on myspace.

 

[pghbrandi]

But it all comes back to San Antonio, she left there without baby Gabriel. That should be our focus point...because once she boarded that bus, it was WITHOUT precious Gabriel. Who cares why she went to Florida? The point being, Gabriel was not in her arms. Just a back pack.

We might as well give up on LE providing us or the public the much needed information we so long for. In that case, we might as well grasp our boot straps and get down to work.

The last sighting of baby Gabriel was on December 26, 2009.
Elizabeth boarded that bus on December 27th.

Leave the Smiths out of this. Let's get focused again.

Help. I beg you all.

I am not attacking you, not trying to argue either. The Smiths are a HUGE part of this if you want to believe it or not. They can't seem to shut their mouths either. More TS than JS lately. TS forged her cousin's sig, put his name on court docs, lies, etc. etc. How can we possibly leave them out of this when I am almost certain they hold that key to where Gabriel is!

 

[Gypsy Road]

OMG...NG's on! The show is so lame! It's about the FLorida beauty who tried to hire a hitman to kill her hubby. This show has been on 100 times already! GRR!!!