GUILTY AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #16

[GutFeeling!]

I like how the media is saying "police have confirmed this is an abduction" the youtube video from AP did not say that this was a confirmed abduction what they said was ISA did not leave on her own, or wonder away. That could mean that she was drugged and taken somewhere by a family member and killed, which would be a murder not an abduction. Media needs to be clear in what they post, because if I wasn;t following this case so closely I would be terrified that there is someone out there abducting kids from thier bedrooms, which I do not believe is the case. I hope someone in at the press confrence tommorrow plainly asks that question " Is this an isolated incident or should the community be worried" If LE would answer that one question it would clear up a whole lot of stuff.

AN abduction can lead to a murder, you can be charged with abducting and murdering.

 

[Theforeigner]

Does anyone have a transcript of the 14 year old son talking on the 911 call?
I really would like to know exactly what he was saying, but I just can´t understand most of it. I guess my problem is a combination of the 911 bad sound quality and the fact that english is not my first languish.

 

[pieper4]

Does anyone have a transcript of the 14 year old son talking on the 911 call?
I really would like to know exactly what he was saying, but I just can´t understand most of it. I guess my problem is a combination of the 911 bad sound quality and the fact that english is not my first languish.

I think someone somewhere posted one or a link to one. I could be wrong. Big help I am, eh? Sorry. I understood every word he said... probably because I have raised three kids well beyond their teens and I am good at deciphering teen muttering. If there's something in particular you don't grasp just holler. I suspect someone will be happy to decipher/interpret... or provide a transcript link (although personally I've found too many discrepancies in transcripts to trust 'em 100%).

 

[butterfly1978]

AN abduction can lead to a murder, you can be charged with abducting and murdering.

what I mean is te way they are making it sound is that police confirmed some stranger off the street came in the house and kidnapped her, when that is not what LE said at all, they said she didnt leave on her own/wonder off. It could very likely be a murder cover up and not an abduction at all. I hope that is not the case I am just pointing out how the media is not being clear and sounds like false information.

 

[pieper4]

BBM

I think you're right, and I think it may be the son/sons.

Just curious... what leads you to feel/believe that? I'm SOooo not dead-set on any single, exclusive theory here, so would love to hear some input. Within the ToS here, of course.

 

[pieper4]

Hey, Pax. Hope Mom's doing OK. Figured based on your earlier post that you'd be here hashing out the hash tonight.

 

[GutFeeling!]

Selective releases... re: late night "slips". Not a media pro here, but it really does seem intentional.

Hoping for an arrest/move soon.

Yeah something is going on. Azstarnet has had a few stories released just after midnight. That usually represents an embargoed story, which are as rare as hens teeth out of police departments. I am a reporter and in the past 9 years here I have had ONE story that was embargoed.

 

[pieper4]

Amen, GutFeeling. Thanks for the confirmation. ;-)

 

[carole]

Just curious... what leads you to feel/believe that? I'm SOooo not dead-set on any single, exclusive theory here, so would love to hear some input. Within the ToS here, of course.

I could be wrong, of course, but I'm thinking the boys know/saw/heard something the night Isabel disappeared and told LE or mom and she told LE. Something that led CPS to keeping dad away from the sons. They kept the "secret" as long as they could but finally had to tell someone about it.

JMHO.

 

[crystalgenie]

I am almost afraid to post on this thread because it has been so hostile.

However, I will give it a shot.
va
I find the news that CPS has had previously involvement very disturbing. There has been something going on in the house for quite some time. That means it was either a mandatory reporter that notified CPS or a "nosy" neighbor.

Now the speculation will begin. Did the investigation have to do with abuse if so what sort of abuse.

People have been very defensive of their personal theories but from what I have read all the theories have been reasonable. There has been no talk of alien abductions so I don't see a problem. I hate to watch all of us argue and time out starts.

The main problem all of us have been having is the lack of investigative reporting. Most news is just regurgated. It is like a big game of telephone where little details get changed and then it turns into a big disaster.

The reason I like websleuths is we usually can discuss theories but for some reason this case is different....

All of this has been my personal speculation, opinion, and so on and so forth.

 

[KALI]

CPS involved since December?
I So hope her Daddy did not hurt her.
But it's not looking good.
Just so sad- if he did something to her.
I pray he did not.

 

[BrownRice]

With the new release of CPS' involvement back in December, to me it looks like this "abduction" has to be an inside job, not necessarily the parents (but...), at least someone close to the family. Sure, it could have been a coincidence (CPS came out there 1x based on something, found nothing, no big deal). But, to me, these cannot continue to be coincidences. They mean something.

Regarding the "disabled" car. Was this ever CONFIRMED? The only time I heard this was on NG. I could have sworn in the beginning, this red car (?) was parked in the driveway and then when I saw it later, it was to the side of the house in the gravel? Am I mistaken?

 

[Curious Me]

Pondering this new iffy info. It's possible that whatever happened with CPS involvement in December, if a true occurrence, is something RC was confident would not happen again like something she didn't want to believe or face about a domestic problem, and now with Isabel missing... Oh, I don 't know! fftobed:

 

[BrownRice]

Yeah something is going on. Azstarnet has had a few stories released just after midnight. That usually represents an embargoed story, which are as rare as hens teeth out of police departments. I am a reporter and in the past 9 years here I have had ONE story that was embargoed.

WTH does that mean? Never heard that term.

 

[carole]

WTH does that mean? Never heard that term.

It's a request from a source that a story/news not be reported until a certain date/time.

News embargo - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Donjeta]

Does anyone have a transcript of the 14 year old son talking on the 911 call?
I really would like to know exactly what he was saying, but I just can´t understand most of it. I guess my problem is a combination of the 911 bad sound quality and the fact that english is not my first languish.

http://cms3.tucsonaz.gov/files/poli..._911_audio_ref_isabel_celis_investigation.pdf

 

[~n/t~]

It sounds like it happened more than once, imo

"The earlier case, we are aware of that," Pacheco said. "I don't know if they were open or closed, but there were previous CPS contacts."

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/8a0e22a3-f9a3-5df6-a4f1-163f280fad8f.html


Very disturbing information. What happened to this poor little girl?

 

[Eileen730]

BBM

My goodness, that is a sad looking dog!!

I know i said that earlier!
Im surprised animal services hasnt been called!

 

[LisaB]

ok, have to ask - has the neighbor that "heard the male voices" been backed up by anyone else? Have there been any other neighbors that heard the barking dogs?

From the google shot - looks like there are 4 houses pretty close together. I can hear dogs barking WAAAYYYYY down the street from me and pretty much pick out which house it's coming from during the night when it's quiet. Do we have any other neighbor corroboration on the male voices or dogs barking other than the neighbor who seems to know all about the Celis'?

It concerns me that the majority of theories here are based on statements from 1 neighbor who seems to be really interested in getting her 15 min of fame. Correct me/forgive me if I'm wrong and there is corroboration, on screen or off from someone else to support all these. It'd make me feel better about things.

What if there were no male voices, no barking dogs, no speculation of cartels? Where would we start our theories?? Could be we're not getting anywhere because we've veered way off course by going the way some lady pointed down the road instead of reading the signs...

:couch:

just looking for Isabel lease:

I have never put much stock into what she said. At a MINIMUM I think her times are off, and it's possible she dreamed something that seemed real to her later when she heard about Isabel. I do not consider her a suspect by ANY means, but wonder why she would tell such a story if it wasn't true. As you pointed out, she IS the only source of this information, concerning men talking inside the Celis' fenced yard. Why would they be talking softly if the dogs were all over them. How could they talk softly and still hear one another with all the dogs going crazy?

Her account makes it sound like these guys were just hanging out talking with no particular urgency, and she did not hear Isabel. If the 6:30 voices represent the abductors, AS is correct in saying she went willingly, as two men talking just loudly enough to be heard through/over that massive wall, while dogs barked would have to have awakened her.

 

[Eileen730]

It sounds like it happened more than once, imo



http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/8a0e22a3-f9a3-5df6-a4f1-163f280fad8f.html


Very disturbing information. What happened to this poor little girl?

I believe if it was something in the sexual nature the children would have been removed before this...
Now if its neglect (like the dog) maybe they have a cps worker there every week or so.

Maybe younger kids were left alone alot!
Neighbors could have reported them for something or the school.

We can sit here and guess and guess till the cows come home.

I do think it will eventually come out!