AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - #16

[Theforeigner]

So possibly 2 new pieces of info : a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting... Also, there were calls made to LE from that address in the past? But,they don't know who made the calls,or what they were about ??? Yeah,right ...

IMO, LE is dripping out info. Bit by bit.... JMO

"a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

This was NOT a new piece of information, it was one of the journalists who asked if police knew anything about about ; "a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

And the answer was that police had NO knowledge of such a note.

PLEASE make sure not to misinform, because then we have a new rumor turn into "facts"

 

[LisaB]

We haven't come across any signs that indicate that she's not alive.

This supports my previous assertion that there was NO "cadaver" (HRD) dog hit in the home.

 

[Prof]

Just my opinion... but it seems to me that LE knows what happened.. also bet they have been meeting with the SA

(moo)


what I cannot figure out though is why there are no more searches and why the search area has not been widened... perhaps it has been.. these guys seem to play it really close to the vest (and the reporting has been bare bones... nothing else 'investigative' in nature)

I agree... They are sort of stalling with these pressers, and then leaking news that really puts the family in a bad light...
They delayed one presser a while back and it was reported LE were meeting with SA
This week they searched a wash and it was part of the Celis investigation

 

[Knox]

A Tucson police briefing today on the investigation into the disappearance of Isabel Celis was notable for questions police would not answer.

For example, while police again confirmed previous contact between the family and state Child Protective Services, Sgt. Maria Hawke said the department would not discuss the nature of the contact nor say when it occurred. The Star reported Thursday that state CPS had contact with the family in December.

Hawke said it would be inappropriate for police to discuss the state CPS case. She referred media to the state agency, which has refused to answer any questions related to the Celis family.

Hawke said police have gone to the home before, but she would not provide details or dates for the contact.

Hawke also did not answer a question from a reporter about anonymous and unconfirmed reports that investigators found a message apparently written by Isabel on her closet wall.

Hawke repeated that the police would not discuss evidence in the case, and that she was unaware of such a discovery.

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/cri...cle_22dbd07c-a068-11e1-bd01-001a4bcf887a.html

 

[callyn]

Where is the pic of the boxer mix at the Celis home?
TIA

I have kept my eye out this whole case for this. JM's FB, RC's FB, all media and every thread here. I have only seen JM's dog in JM's pics.
The old arthritic dog is the same dog seen in Patty's pic and all the media pics of the dog at the gate/door.
I don't know how I could have missed that, but anything is possible.

The old arthritic dog doesn't look like the dog seen through the front door/gate to me. If it's the same dog, then I apologize, because I sure thought they were two different dogs. To me the dog in the door looks too perky to be the old crippled dog I saw walking. Mea culpa :blushing:

 

[Eileen730]

A Tucson police briefing today on the investigation into the disappearance of Isabel Celis was notable for questions police would not answer.

For example, while police again confirmed previous contact between the family and state Child Protective Services, Sgt. Maria Hawke said the department would not discuss the nature of the contact nor say when it occurred. The Star reported Thursday that state CPS had contact with the family in December.

Hawke said it would be inappropriate for police to discuss the state CPS case. She referred media to the state agency, which has refused to answer any questions related to the Celis family.

Hawke said police have gone to the home before, but she would not provide details or dates for the contact.

Hawke also did not answer a question from a reporter about anonymous and unconfirmed reports that investigators found a message apparently written by Isabel on her closet wall.

Hawke repeated that the police would not discuss evidence in the case, and that she was unaware of such a discovery.

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/cri...cle_22dbd07c-a068-11e1-bd01-001a4bcf887a.html

A Message written by Isabel on her closet Wall?

Was she kept in a closet? Or hid in the closet

 

[Deleted member 718]

There has to be something going on with the boys, imo. LE focused on their room, along with Isa's room. Does the older boy have any issues? I guess we will never be able to discuss it, if he did.

I recall one article that really caught my eye. When her brother was very first out searching, he was so emotional that I was confused. How could he have known the gravity of the situation so soon? Really, at that point, how could he have known Isa didn't just wander away even if his Dad mentioned abduction.

"Pike’s 16-year-old son ***** helped one of Isabel’s older brother search the neighborhood when she was first noticed missing Saturday morning.

“I asked him what’s wrong and he said his sister was gone and I said ‘I’ll go help you.’ I looked around the whole neighborhood and the park,” ***** Pike said. “There was a few times when he just fell to the ground and started crying and I never really thought I’d see him cry.”



Read more: http://azstarnet.com/news/local/cri...d59-11e1-91b9-0019bb2963f4.html#ixzz1vANwCyrH

This is a cached article from the above addy.

 

[Prof]

You know what hit me today. Remember the 911 call with Sergio, saying that the older boy was in the backyard looking for his sister, and the younger one was waiting in the garage for his mother to return home? Then the other 911 call where it's the younger one that is somewhere down the street and has to be driven back home, and he's the other 911 caller? Either I heard that wrong, or the younger one that was suppose to be in the garage, ran off down the street.

Sergio said
"he's outside our property wall" regarding the 14 year old...meaning in the neighborhood somewhere... he did not know exactly where

The 14 year old was the one in the other 911 call and was driven back to the neighborhood ...

Transcripts from TPD here
http://cms3.tucsonaz.gov/files/poli..._911_audio_ref_isabel_celis_investigation.pdf

 

[LisaB]

Several weeks of investigation still left to do before they can evaluate the case for next steps.

No way. SEVERAL WEEKS? That's a LONG time for Isabel to be away from her Mom and brothers. If she turned up alive and well tomorrow, would the No Contact order between Sergio and the boys be expanded to include her (does anyone know if it already does?), or lifted?
I guess that depends on where she shows up, and under what circumstances, I suppose. But let's just say a random handyman had kidnapped her up and has dropped her off some place where she would be able to find help to reunite her with her family.
Would her Dad have to stay away?

 

[Prof]

"a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

This was NOT a new piece of information, it was one of the journalists who asked if police knew anything about about ; "a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

And the answer was that police had NO knowledge of such a note.

PLEASE make sure not to misinform, because then we have a new rumor turn into "facts"

Thank you!
This is so important!

 

[liz b.]

"a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

This was NOT a new piece of information, it was one of the journalists who asked if police knew anything about about ; "a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

And the answer was that police had NO knowledge of such a note.

PLEASE make sure not to misinform, because then we have a new rumor turn into "facts"

Okay, I certainly do not want to run with a rumor. IMO, though, this was leaked to the reporter. For a reason... Because it is very specific information. LE is under no obligation to verify a reporter's question about anything in the investigation. True or not,they do not have to say.Just that this nugget of info is now out of the bag... This is MOO, and I do take your point, thanks for pulling my coat on this...MOO

 

[Knox]

A Message written by Isabel on her closet Wall?

Was she kept in a closet? Or hid in the closet

Looking to see if I can find another media statement that says something about a message written on the closet wall.

I assumed it was a handwritten "note", like on paper (found in her closet). Confused ...

 

[mamamia54]

Well, it's my HO that just because Hawke said she doesn't know of anything such as a handwritten note found inside Isa's closet doesn't mean that it doesn't exist, so I'll just sit back and see what happens, because time will tell.

 

[Lava]

"a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

This was NOT a new piece of information, it was one of the journalists who asked if police knew anything about about ; "a note in Isabel's closet, supposedly in her handwriting"

And the answer was that police had NO knowledge of such a note.

PLEASE make sure not to misinform, because then we have a new rumor turn into "facts"

What that really the answer, or was the answer that they weren't going to comment about anything relating to the case? There is a big difference.


Anyone have a link to the presser?

 

[Eileen730]

Looking to see if I can find another media statement that says something about a message written on the closet wall.

I assumed it was a handwritten "note", like on paper (found in her closet). Confused ...

LOL join the club!

 

[katydid23]

Looking to see if I can find another media statement that says something about a message written on the closet wall.

I assumed it was a handwritten "note", like on paper (found in her closet). Confused ...

My DD wrote stuff on her bedroom walls, inside the little walk in closet when she was about 5. She drew pictures and wrote phonetically, little messages on the wall. I think a lot of kids have done that. I am not sure it means anything in terms of this case.

 

[Whisperer]

This supports my previous assertion that there was NO "cadaver" (HRD) dog hit in the home.

There are no signs she is not alive
There are no signs she is alive.

Cadaver dog could still have hit. It hits on deceased people's scent who was in a place for a little while. It doesn't identify the victim. LE would never base their case and say it is definitely Isa on a cadaver hit w/o evidence of DNA, her fluids, blood, etc

The cadave dog (if it hit) cannot be ruled out because LE was saying they have no signs of her LE being deceased. LE tends to go with the hope of a victim being alive for as long as they can....at least as far as the media goes.

 

[LisaB]

As I've thought for some time based on LE's approach, this would seem to suggest that the dog hit was NOT from a cadaver dog. I don't think he would say there are NO signs that indicate that she's not alive if they had a cadaver dog hit (especially since he wasn't asked anything directly that would have forced him to make this sort of comment).

Assuming for a minute that there was no cadaver dog hit... That changes things a bit for me. For one thing, I think there's next to no chance of an accident (likelihood that Isa was accidentally killed and SC -- or whoever -- had the presence of mind to get her out of the home fast enough to avoid a cadaver dog hit is pretty slim in my mind). In fact, even an intentional but unplanned killing in the home (e.g., if she suddenly claimed she would report someone for abuse) becomes much less likely under this scenario for the same reason... and even a planned killing in the home (especially without another person/vehicle involved) is somewhat less likely because a cadaver hit in the home would still be possible and you'd expect one in the vehicle used to transport her). I think this means this makes the a scenario in which she left the house alive most likely.

I wonder if the "unexpected" dog hit that led to further investigation was that Isa's scent could only be tracked out the front door NOT out of the screenless window and that's when LE started thinking inside job/staged scene.

ETA: This also makes the likelihood that RC was involved in an accident/unplanned killing scenario virtually nil because her first instinct as a pediatric nurse would have been to try to revive Isa. Almost certainly she would have tried (particularly as a traumatized parent) well longer than the point at which death actually occured... making the lack of a cadaver hit virtually impossible.

It sounds like the odds of it being an outsider increased a little bit... If the parents had killed her, they would not have taken her someplace and done it, it would either have been spontaneous, and therefore most likely in the home (or the car they came home from the ball game in - which would mean the whole family lied). It sounds more like she was straight-up kidnapped, alive, and if not by a stranger, how and where are the parents concealing her?

 

[mamamia54]

Hawke also did not answer a question from a reporter about anonymous and unconfirmed reports that investigators found a message apparently written by Isabel on her closet wall.

Hawke repeated that the police would not discuss evidence in the case, and that she was unaware of such a discovery.

“The integrity of the investigation is paramount,” Hawke said in explaining why the department continues to withhold case details.
http://azstarnet.com/news/local/cri...cle_22dbd07c-a068-11e1-bd01-001a4bcf887a.html

 

[Knox]

When I was home at Easter, my six year old nephew wrote my sister a letter. He had been chastised for something earlier in the day. Evidently it bothered him quite a bit, he wrote her a letter telling her why she should not be upset with him and taped it to her bedroom door.

The way he expressed his feelings was priceless. She wrote the date on it and saved it. My point being, he expressed some fairly complicated feelings. Isa would surely be capable of doing the same.