AZ - Isabel Mercedes Celis, 6, Tucson, 20 April 2012 - # 4

[CharlestonGal]

I still can't shake the idea that this child was taken by someone who had an eye on her, was known to both her and her family, no matter how peripherally.

I also remain stuck with my initial reaction that the perp is a young male, teen or just past teens. I really hate when my impression about a case comes so quickly and immediately and then can't be shaken. Even when whatever caused me to arrive at that impression is so amorphous as to nearly nonexistent.

I always worry that I am seeing more than is there or not seeing what I should be once that impression has settled in for me. Am I missing things because they don't fit my notion? Am I reading too much into things elsewhere because they tend to lend credence to my notion? Sigh.

No, you're dead on I would think. I formed the same impression days ago and nothing that has happened since has shaken me from it. I think this is going to be a Westerfield/Couey type deal. And I think the offender is someone close by who has been planning this for a while.

 

[gitana1]

Do we know if the parents are immigrants? If so, what country? I know they're hispanic but just curious from where.

This case is another heartbreaking one. Why harm our children? They're so innocent. Please let her come home. :tears:

Most Hispanics in AZ, are of Mexican descent. It appears clear that this family has a lot of family around them, so that increases the odds they are of Mexican heritage.

In the Southwest, particularly Texas, New Mexico, Arizona and Colorado, there are a lot of Mexican families who have been in the area for generations. This family somewhat strikes me as that kind, although they do speak Spanish very well which tends to disappear over the generations. In any event, they seem very Tusconian to me (is that a word?) My godparents are Mexican-Americans from Tuscon so I fancy myself familiar with the "type"! I would bet dollars to donuts that the parents were born here.

 

[Patty G]

OT but I dearly need help!!

Where is a MOD who is online (nurse is gone...?) who I can PM as soon as possible???

Got a few things to express to them.................

Thanks!!!

Just hit the alert button and share what you need to share. All mods in this forum will receive the alert. Alert = red triangle

 

[Crosby87]

A child that age may need to be woken up to go to the bathroom if they are an especially sound sleeper or have a small bladder. It is not that unusual for a child that age to still have night time accidents. Between 10 and 15 percent of 6 year olds will still have the occasional bed-wetting incident.

If Isabel's parents took her to the bathroom during the night or before they went to sleep while she was being weaned off of diapers, I think she would be comfortable with anyone who came into her room during the night, picked her up and moved her. jmo

 

[Anita Richman]

I agree, the area around the house needed to be searched immediately. But desert is about a few miles away from where she lives. They live around Broadway and Craycroft. There is alot of desert all around aviation highway which is about 5 miles away, and then on (dam i cant think of the highway) around the base, there is alot of desert. Which is about 3 major crossroads from them. really there is desert all over there. Maybe they did search all around there, they did say it was a 3-mile radius, which probably included some of the desert. Im thinking if she is hidden anywhere, it just might be in the desert. The caves Im talking about are farther away, around Vail. and then in Sabino Canyon. BUt from that side of town, they are easy to get to. Im from the far south/west side near Kinney and Old Tucson. We have alot more desert out here, so maybe that is why im thinking the desert so much.

The highway around the base? Kolb/Valencia? I agree about the desert, the washes being places that need to be searched.

 

[Anita Richman]

Most Hispanics in AZ, are of Mexican descent. It appears clear that this family has a lot of family around them, so that increases the odds they are of Mexican heritage.

In the Southwest, particularly Texas, New Mexico, Arizona and Colorado, there are a lot of Mexican families who have been in the area for generations. This family somewhat strikes me as that kind, although they do speak Spanish very well which tends to disappear over the generations. In any event, they seem very Tusconian to me (is that a word?) My godparents are Mexican-Americans from Tuscon so I fancy myself familiar with the "type"! I would bet dollars to donuts that the parents were born here."

BBM ME TOO!! Gitana, you do a great job of explaining "Tucson". Thank you!!

 

[Aura]

Kolb and Valencia is a good area to be searched too, im thinking like Swan/Craycroft/Wilmot area and then the base runs along this stretch. UGHHH I cant think of the name at all, starts with a G I think ... My mind is just blank LOL

I just looked, GOLFLINKS> LOL That area, before you get to the base, on the north side of golf links, there is desert.

 

[Anita Richman]

Do any Tucson locals know the type of patients they take care of at Palo Verde (mental health services) at Tucson Medical Center? That's where Becky Celis works. Is it outpatient or inpatient mental health services?

 

[Anita Richman]

Kolb and Valencia is a good area to be searched too, im thinking like Swan/Craycroft/Wilmot area and then the base runs along this stretch. UGHHH I cant think of the name at all, starts with a G I think ... My mind is just blank LOL

I just looked, GOLFLINKS> LOL That area, before you get to the base, on the north side of golf links, there is desert.

Yes! I think a bike path runs through there, but you're right, there are big patches of desert all around DM.

 

[PAXIMUS]

I heard today that the police were now going to be searching the desert and drainage ditches... Im wondering, why wait so long to search the desert. Desert is ALL OVER here, that wouldve been on the list of the first place to look. There is alot of desert near where the parents live, Hell there is just alot of desert all around us, and when a child has been taken before, that is usually where they found them. Also, about 15-25 min away at the most, there is are caves in the desert where she could be. Why wait to search these areas?

I dont think they waited to search those areas per se, there is only so much man power to work with, first they search the immediate area which they nailed down to a 3 mile radius, then they went with all the sex offenders in the area followed by a land fill search and now the will expand that search to incluide surrounding desert areas. I dont think they can do all of that at once, they dont have that sort of man power at their disposal.

 

[LisaB]

I was surprised by the plea to know their demands. I don't know if that's wishful thinking on the part of Isabel's parents, that she may have been kidnapped for ransom, or what.

I don't think I have ever heard that before... It is COMPLETELY in line with their believing, within the first few minutes of discovering her missing, that she had been kidnapped. It is also completely in line with a parent who had nothing at all to do with his child's disappearance. How awful for them. I am sure the reason they did not speak out sooner was waiting for the BAU, and possibly because they were just too distraught, and feared they would just blubber incoherently. They absolutely seem wracked with grief, but hopeful for her return.

 

[imjustinterested]

Do any Tucson locals know the type of patients they take care of at Palo Verde (mental health services) at Tucson Medical Center? That's where Becky Celis works. Is it outpatient or inpatient mental health services?

I think they do drug and alcohol rehab there. I thought Becky Celis was a pediatric nurse?

 

[gitana1]

Most Hispanics in AZ, are of Mexican descent. It appears clear that this family has a lot of family around them, so that increases the odds they are of Mexican heritage.

In the Southwest, particularly Texas, New Mexico, Arizona and Colorado, there are a lot of Mexican families who have been in the area for generations. This family somewhat strikes me as that kind, although they do speak Spanish very well which tends to disappear over the generations. In any event, they seem very Tusconian to me (is that a word?) My godparents are Mexican-Americans from Tuscon so I fancy myself familiar with the "type"! I would bet dollars to donuts that the parents were born here."

BBM ME TOO!! Gitana, you do a great job of explaining "Tucson". Thank you!!

I love em'. They have a very, very large, extended family and love food, family, friends and a good time. The whole lot of them love sports and kids and their community. I see them when I see this family and it hurts to watch. The Celis family reminds me of my godparents' family.

 

[dimples37398]

She is a pediatric nurse at TMC's pediatric emergency room, I was up there the other day with my daughter and 3 of those people in the statement release by the parents are nurses that took care of my daughter the other day. They told me that is Becky's daughter on the flyer who works with them in the pediatric ER at TMC

 

[Crosby87]

Wow, that is awesome! Isabel's mom, being a nurse, probably has to use up her vacation and sick time and that's it! I'm a nurse, that's how it works.

ETA: I went back to work 5 days after my son's death. I don't remember much of the next two or three years after that, and don't remember anything really significant, except births of grandchildren for the last 8+ years.

Isabelle, I am deeply sorry to hear you lost your son.

Isabel's father likely has to use his vacation and sick time too.

This new Canadian law is a step in the right direction.

 

[Anita Richman]

I think they do drug and alcohol rehab there. I thought Becky Celis was a pediatric nurse?

Yes, Becky is a peds nurse, but TCM and Palo Verde BHS are on the same campus.

 

[KnicksFan]

We are not in Mexico though. Rich kids there are kidnapped. Here, there has only been one kidnapping of a child by a cartel and the child's family was involved in the drug trade.

Isabel's family looks solidly middle class. In Mexico, lots of things are resolved with money. The cartels know that's not the way things work here and I think they would have picked a different target if it was.

But, it is interesting that the father mentioned "demands". Perhaps the family is thinking along your lines as well.



And the dad mentioning "demands" was the reason I posted this. (Dear Lord, growing up my mom drove me nuts watching me walk to the bus stop, making sure I called her when I got to a friend's house...it made me so mad. Funny how once we become parents, we finally understand some of the stuff we thought was crazy that our parents did.)

So..my point is, after watching the parents pour their hearts out, I would eat my keyboard and any assorted minutia on my desk if they themselves had any part in this. But...my (totally opinion) concerns are the verifiable fact that losing their house(s) was an issue over the last year or so. Money problems can cause other wise smart, kind people to do some things that are not smart. I'll leave it at that.

Or one of the numerous RSO's in the neighborhood decided to repeat offend.

Or a extended family member or friend of the family is a disgusting example of humanity.

Just my thoughts...that's why I signed up here, to share them and discuss.

 

[Dr. Know?]

It's inpatient alcohol/drug rehab. They don't mingle. It's a lockdown type treatment. I think it's in the back of TMC. Palo Verde Rehab?

 

[StrayKat]

From my experience of reading, following, etc... a neighbor. JMO!

 

[dimples37398]

I watched the parents and I really don't know what to think now. I just can't see how someone could come through her window, all the while making sure she stays asleep/doesn't kick/scream/knock stuff over while they are getting her out the window, get her out the window without knocking or hitting something themselves, and not make a noise that was loud enough or unusual enough to alert someone or a household animal.