Bosma Murder Trial 04.05.16 - Day 30

[paris_paris]

It they both had guns, they both probably wanted to use them. I think they each shot Tim. One, maybe DM, took the first shot, and even if Tim was already dead, I can see MS taking a second shot with his gun. That way they are equally obligated to cover for the other, and I think it is quite possible that both of them wanted the sick thrill. DM likely got rid of his own gun, and MS got rid of his. IMO

That might explain why DM gave the gun to someone to hold onto.

 

[Claroon]

Wondering if the plan was to car jack TB's truck at gun point. Leave TB by the side of the road, and squeal off in his truck. Since gun safety doesn't seem like a priority to either of these two, maybe MS pulled the trigger by accident. Still doesn't explain the incinerator.

I thought the same thing mostly because of the "I F--- up..." That makes it sound like something went down that wasn't intended. But ya, the incinerator? Or, maybe DM yelled "shoot him" because he needed another kill to please his blood lust. Then, the F--- up was listening to him, being pressured into it.

But my real conspiracy theory is they both shot him with one gun or two--took turns. No proof but no proof otherwise either. ONLY MY OPINION

 

[Inspector_North]

It they both had guns, they both probably wanted to use them. I think they each shot Tim. One, maybe DM, took the first shot, and even if Tim was already dead, I can see MS taking a second shot with his gun. That way they are equally obligated to cover for the other, and I think it is quite possible that both of them wanted the sick thrill. DM likely got rid of his own gun, and MS got rid of his. IMO

For that to happen, it would need to be somewhere that the sound isn't a concern. I know from hunting that it is difficult to determine the location of a single shot, but much easier with each additional shot. A .380 out a short barrel is very loud. In fact, I would say discharging a PPK inside a vehicle with the windows up would light up the cab at night like a flashbulb, and the sound would cause the ears to ring for some time.

 

[Claroon]

Seems like true remorse IMO, the reason I say this is because of the way he reacted to having the gun in the house. Without finding the actual tweet it was something like "He couldn't stay in the same house, knowing the gun was there too."

It was haunting him already..

Naaa, I took that as didn't want evidence found in same location as he was.

 

[Claroon]

So we hear today, the gun that needed to disappear was in the toolbox neatly tucked away in mom's washing machine. Because, who in the world would think to look in mom's washing machine? Ugh. So at what point did MS retrieve it and bury it in the forest, as he told MM?

As for him saying he effed up over and over again, it's hard to know how to take that. He could have been talking about going with DM in the first place that night, shooting Tim (if he's the one who did it), killing Tim if it wasn't intended to be a kill shot, letting DM use his gun (if DM is the one who shot Tim), assisting DM with the incinerator horror, etc. He could have meant ALL of it, or some of it. The fact that we're hearing how messed up he was about it means he did actually feel some kind of regret or remorse or guilt about what he was involved with that night. Contrast that to DM sitting there smugly in court, smiling and waving as witnesses come in. HUGE difference.

We hope so, but some people who commit crimes are only sorry they got caught. Could be messed up from no sleep, witness to something very traumatic, etc. They call it PTSD.

 

[qdm]

..he didn't notice a change in mark until after dellens arrest... another words he had little concern for himself or bosma until "dell" was caught, the heat was on him and then he said "i fd up man" these guys don't mess around, they are going to find me? Nice work Hamilton PD!

I will never forget the video image of those two in the hanger looking around casually. They didn't seem too disturbed by the events that night

imo

 

[Inspector_North]

..he didn't notice a change in mark until after dellens arrest... another words he had little concern for himself or bosma until "dell" was caught, the heat was on him and then he said "i fd up man" these guys don't mess around, they are going to find me? Nice work Hamilton PD!

I will never forget the video image of those two in the hanger looking around casually. They didn't seem too disturbed by the events that night

imo

DM seemed to be leading in that video, just like he always is.

 

[Claroon]

The 'I f****d up' comments came after DM was arrested, and don't necessarily refer to the sequence of events on May 6, IMHO, but could have meant "I did the Bosma murder with DM stupidly thinking we'd get away with it, and now I've ruined my and my families lives"

If MS didn't "change" until DM was arrested, maybe the "f----d up" referred to throwing TB phone out the window. That was key. The news report of finding the phone came out May 10 prior to DM arrest. http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...y_hold_out_hope_for_hamilton_mans_return.html
:noooo:

 

[Just4TB]

With the crown nearing the end of it's witnesses, I assume that the defense can call it's own witnesses, to be cross examined by the crown.
Is this correct, and if so, is there advance disclosure to the crown of who will be called by the defense?

 

[Sphinx]

For that to happen, it would need to be somewhere that the sound isn't a concern. I know from hunting that it is difficult to determine the location of a single shot, but much easier with each additional shot. A .380 out a short barrel is very loud. In fact, I would say discharging a PPK inside a vehicle with the windows up would light up the cab at night like a flashbulb, and the sound would cause the ears to ring for some time.

My theory is that DM and MS exited the truck when it was parked in the field, behind the haybales, probably saying they needed a moment to relieve themselves after the long drive. DM left his window down on the driver's side. When they came back DM shot an unsuspecting TB suddenly through the open window, or he opened the driver's side door and shot while still outside the truck, then MS took his shot from outside, on the driver's side as well. He may have waited to make sure TB did not get out of the passenger side door, then had his turn. This way they were both outside the truck and safe from bullets bouncing off metal inside the truck, and also safe from a possible struggle with poor TB, or having so much ringing in the ears from being in an enclosed small space while shooting. They may also have used some kind of silencer that we do not know about. To murder him this way, and not put themselves at risk, made it necessary for them to be willing to cause damage to one window, and have blood inside the truck, which they thought they could clean up later. When a shooter reached inside the truck to shoot, the bullet casing could eject into the back of the truck easily, where one was found. This is the way cowardly criminal psychopaths operate.

IMO

 

[Gibson67]

Naaa, I took that as didn't want evidence found in same location as he was.

I think it was Daly that didn't want to be in the same house with the gun

molly hayes ‏@mollyhayes 2m2 minutes ago
He had concerns about being in same place as it, which he thinks he relayed to Smich. #Bosma

 

[billandrew]

The "two gun" theory isn't holding up for me. I'm not disputing the testimony today, but the Crown's opening statements claim that DM dropped off the toolbox to a friend, and then after his arrest this toolbox was obtained by Smich. If there were two guns, whose gun was in the box? Were there two guns in the box?

We don't know who originally owned the toolbox, but there is a photo of it in DM's house from DM's computer.

Right now I'm leaning toward there being one murder weapon in this case. DM was in possession of it after the murder, but MS managed to get it after DM's arrest. JMO.

 

[Inspector_North]

If nge until DM was arrested, maybe the "f----d up" referred to throwing TB phone out the window. That was key. The news report of finding the phone came out May 10 prior to DM arrest. http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...y_hold_out_hope_for_hamilton_mans_return.html
:noooo:

What was so important about finding the phone that would have spooked MS? TB cell records were already available through a warrant. That's how they linked calls to the Bates phone, and IT.

If anyone "f---d up", it was DM and his unique tattoo that he chose to expose during the test drive with IT.

MOO

 

[Satchie]

Although we want to see murderers feel remorse, I think it's very rare. They regret being caught, that's all. If they had never been caught, they would have quite contentedly gone about their lives, perhaps even congratulating themselves on being so superior.

I don't think they're unique among the human race for being smug in spite of causing major suffering to others, they're just the most extreme example. I can think of many people who hurt others physically, mentally, emotionally, and it doesn't bother them one bit. <modsnip>

 

[Inspector_North]

although we want to see murderers feel remorse, i think it's very rare. They regret being caught, that's all. If they had never been caught, they would have quite contentedly gone about their lives, perhaps even congratulating themselves on being so superior.

I don't think they're unique among the human race for being smug in spite of causing major suffering to others, they're just the most extreme example. I can think of many people who hurt others physically, mentally, emotionally, and it doesn't bother them one bit. <modsnip>

b i n g o !

 

[RandomName479]

Anyone at the trial today......what was MS's demeanour when BD was testifying? I would think poker face as usual....just curious about impressions.....this really was the first evidence we are hearing about MS and not DM. moo

 

[Londoneye]

I was trying to figure that out as well. He makes it sound like it is some ****s and not LE. But IMO the fact that he wants to raise money for a lawyer makes me think it was LE. If you had ****s after you, a lawyer isn't your first thought, money for a plane ticket is. MOO

My first thought was Homicide police. Once DM was picked up they weren't dealing with the same LE department that picked MS up for the graffiti and he knew it. IMO

 

[matou]

Except Dungey is the one who mentioned Hitler in his cross.

Godwin's Law

Godwin's law (or Godwin's rule of Nazi analogies) is an Internet adage asserting that "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches"—&#8203;&#8203;that is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Hitler or Nazism.

 

[qdm]

Although we want to see murderers feel remorse, I think it's very rare. They regret being caught, that's all. If they had never been caught, they would have quite contentedly gone about their lives, perhaps even congratulating themselves on being so superior.

I don't think they're unique among the human race for being smug in spite of causing major suffering to others, they're just the most extreme example. I can think of many people who hurt others physically, mentally, emotionally, and it doesn't bother them one bit. <modsnip>

I agree 99%, however <modsnip>

 

[RandomName479]

May just be me, but I see more "typical" emotions/actions from MS than DM. Even in the hangar video seems like MS is spooked a little, checking his surroundings.....By all accounts DM went about his merry little life, even after he knew LE was on to him - he kept meetings, business as usual....only emotion we have heard was when SS said he was upset about AJ calling crime stoppers. If we believe BD, MS started acting extremely paranoid after DM was arrested......to me that makes sense. You committed murder with this dude and he's arrested - time to freak out. At the trial, DM is treating this like a circus show.....smiling and waving, where MS IMO is acting more respectful and appropriate. Sociopath vs Gangsta **** wanna be who got in over his head? Moo and all that of course