British student murdered in Perugia, 3 suspects

[LogicalMinds]

If you notice...in MY posts I don't speculate on what Amanda wore to the court..

or the cartwheels or all the other odd things she has done

I am trying to focus on what the Italians used to prosecute her, how and why they built a case against her

with the evidence and the actions and the lies of the people involved I think they had a very strong case

In USA this could be life in prison plus xx years, no parole

I realize "beyond a reasonable doubt"...but none of the Amanda supporters has really showed any reasonable doubt....just emotions...

I have not seen anyone actually explain away the evidence...or produce any evidence that Amanda was "beaten" into false confessions

that would really be stupid for the Italians to do that...I am sure that they handled her with kid gloves

as for the longer interrogations...oh well...it is their laws, not America

they also dragged out the trial from Jan to Dec.....cause they only had court 2 days per week

and they took off the ENTIRE MONTH OF AUGUST>>> WHICH IS VACATION "HOLIDAY" TIME FOR ITALIANS lol

I would not be surprised if they didn't take a 3 hour lunch and a little snooze too

unlike us, many Europeans are not workaholics and they apparently take their time on cases

it is also a move by the defense (traditionally) to drag out cases in order to get them dismissed or lesser charges...so I am sure that the well paid lawyers were helping to drag it along

As they said...Rome wasn't built in a day <grin>

 

[LinasK]

If you notice...in MY posts I don't speculate on what Amanda wore to the court..

or the cartwheels or all the other odd things she has done

I am trying to focus on what the Italians used to prosecute her, how and why they built a case against her

with the evidence and the actions and the lies of the people involved I think they had a very strong case

In USA this could be life in prison plus xx years, no parole

on a good day in Texas someone might get the needle in about 9 years

Hey now!:hand: I'm only pointing out that Amanda didn't help herself by any of these behaviors. They are the behaviors of a narcissistic murderer. I have no problem with the evidence, or the Italian judicial system, or the fact that a young, lying, white American woman is capable of murder. At least Amanda can thank her lucky stars that she'll only be about 48 when she gets out, that's not a life sentence or death!

 

[LogicalMinds]

LOL Lina..

I really agree with you ...I think she did hurt herself from the start with her crazy antics
and she might have gotten a lighter sentence had she been more sympathetic

However, most of the supporters for Amanda are assuming that she was somehow railroaded for being American, promiscuous and arrogant and silly

when the fact is that her actions would have her convicted here

there is a lot of evidence...and opportunity....and even motive/s

what more can a proscecution want?

I have not seen anyone here give a good "defense" other than to assume that she was somehow brutalized during interrogations

which of course she never reported....altho she did "report" that she was getting lots of mail and even marriage proposals which seemed to delight her during her early days in jail

 

[BuzzieCat]

Another witness testified the day prior to the murder AK Guede and Raffael was together so yes.

He testified about an incident with a knife.

I've read that this witness was arrested on drug charges. If that's true, I'm not sure he really saw what he says he did.

There are plenty of other things that IMO point toward her guilt, but I'm just not sure this knife incident is one of them. The thing I can't get over is why she would participate in this horrible crime with two men she hardly knew. How would she know they wouldn't turn on her? I also don't really buy the theory that they wanted to "tease" Meredith or get her to participate in their little party, then realized they had gone too far and had to kill her. I think they must have started with the intent to kill her. But WHY I have no idea. Why couldn't they just leave her alone? Why would they be interested in "working" together to do such a thing?

 

[Infojunkie]

That bathroom photo is extremely misleading. The blood isn't blood but the spray that they used to make the protein show up. Here is a link to the police video of the bathroom as they found it. While I don't think she is innocent she did not bathe in a blood soaked bathroom.

 

[jjenny]

That bathroom photo is extremely misleading. The blood isn't blood but the spray that they used to make the protein show up. Here is a link to the police video of the bathroom as they found it. While I don't think she is innocent she did not bathe in a blood soaked bathroom.

So what looks like blood? Is the spray pink? Or does it turn pink when it comes in contact with bodily fluids?

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Yeah..you have the facts wrong

Guede...the guy who is doing 30 years...is also Black..and it was his semen found

Patrick, Amanda's boss at the pub, is the guy she falsely accused

she also claimed at first that she was there at the apartment and watched Patrick rape and kill Meredith...then she changed that

Patrick had nothing to do with it, she just was angry cause he was about to fire her and possibly hire Meredith

~~~~
Regarding her crazy antics...I remember when she was delighted at all the letters and even marriage proposals being sent to the prison there....she seems to be a sociopath to me
and I am glad that justice was served...Italian style

Actually, no. I was responding to Isabella's post and she had been referring to Guede. It turns out he's guilty but not because he's black but because he's guilty. But what you explain above about AK falsely accusing Patrick who I saw on 48 Hours is a black man too so I see where the confusion comes in. Since there was no evidence indicating his involvement, it is good to know he was let out of jail - justice was served and I think it is terrible that AK would falsely implicate any man of any color. Maybe she thought she could get away with that but, thank God, she didn't.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Will this work the same way when a "foreigner" is tried in America? I personally think she comes across as racist and not really a good ambassador for America.

As for Guede yes he had sex with Meredith. He claims he was consensual and that he was in the bathroom when the murder happened and that he was too scared to go and help her.

My post was worded poorly. We are in agreement. I wrote the same point you are making back to me. I stated that when I go to a foreign country I learn their laws and obey their laws but most of all stay out of trouble as I KNOW I'm in a foreign country and must represent my country well. My point was that the Senator cannot demand that U.S. laws be applied to Americans living in foreign lands. My words must have confused people because I said that I would like all people in all countries to be treated in a fair manner (not meaning U.S. laws).

iirc the exception to the above is when an American carries a Diplomatic passport.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Semen does not exclude him from the killing spree, nor does it exclude the others.
It does not mean that he acted all alone. (but I did not follow this very closely).
Seems to me this little crowd of 3 was a force to tango with...If she threatened someone with a knife and was hanging out with these two at the time looks more like they were a group made in heaven, NOT :crazy:

If one goes back and reads Isabella's post that I responded to initially, they will find that my post is in response to an accusation that American's would rather blame a black man than a young American girl. I replied "not this American" meaning me and then pointed out WHY the black man was being accused imo - the semen, him at the scene, etc. The other black man was falsely accused by AK and let go. I would not want him to remain in jail because he is black when he is innocent under any circumstances. That was the point of my post.

Many Americans do not view people with different color skins from their own as a reason to blame them for crimes. We all need to stop pointing the finger at one another and that includes this race pointing at that race and that one - etc. I am not like that. I go by how a person presents himself and if he is civil and fair minded himself. It burns me when all Americans are "lumped into one pile" like Logical stated earlier.

By the way, maybe because I'm overtired and can't sleep, but I came here to read after missing a day and I'm feeling really misunderstood and like I'm being picked on or something. Are my posts that unclear? Everyone is arguing back at me the same point I thought I made! Night, or should I say good morning?

 

[Trino]

Just an opinion...

Amanda's parents are asking Hilary C to become involved. Can you imagine if an Italian woman was similarily convicted in a US court, and Italians tried to have a politician intervene in a US court decision?

Honestly, what can Hilary do? Italy is a foreign country. How can anti-Americanism play a part when her Italian bf was also convicted?

 

[LogicalMinds]

That bathroom photo is extremely misleading. The blood isn't blood but the spray that they used to make the protein show up. Here is a link to the police video of the bathroom as they found it. While I don't think she is innocent she did not bathe in a blood soaked bathroom.

Thanks for that video....I am sorry I posted the other pics they are from a British newspaper

yes, the video does look different...I will search around for another picture I remember seeing not too long ago however, of blood streaks on the walls

I wonder if the "cleaner" bathroom is what she cleaned up..and washed herself?? I wonder if the Italians checked the drains like they might do here?

Can you share why YOU think that the guilty verdict was correct??

MY own feelings came from the timeline of how long they messed around before calling police...seems the "postal police" came upon Amanda and Rafaelle
'
Why would anyone wait so long? why go in an apt with a broken window, messed up room *the Italian roommate....open door..and take a shower??

I do feel the broken window is important...it was 15 feet about the ground, under a highly sloped eave...and the glass went "outward" ...like someone broke it from inside??

This article is interesting...and shows that the other roommates and their boyfriends suspected something from the start due to the odd actions of Amanda and Rafaelle

again, thanks for the video...I agree the picture looks awfully pink

 

[LogicalMinds]

Just an opinion...

Amanda's parents are asking Hilary C to become involved. Can you imagine if an Italian woman was similarily convicted in a US court, and Italians tried to have a politician intervene in a US court decision?

Honestly, what can Hilary do? Italy is a foreign country. How can anti-Americanism play a part when her Italian bf was also convicted?

True..
and will only make "us" look more stupid than ever

not to mention that sometimes we want to extradite someone from Italy..
of course we always have to take the "death penalty" off the table as just about every country besides us bans it LOL

It is just absurd...Amanda was not there on official business, or a diplomat
And it is not "cruel and unusual" punishment...this is not a case of some tourist offending in an Islamic country and facing a caning or beheading

 

[justbeachy]

Regarding the bathroom and the blood, here is a link to a YouTube video showing what Amanda *actually* saw in the bathroom when she showered. The video is from actual police video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1orfm9fdBCI

Here are some screen shots from that video:

Bathroom photo released to press (after police had sprayed it with chemicals):

The sink as Amanda saw it:

The bidet as Amanda saw it:

The drain of the bidet as Amanda saw it:

Here is a photo of the bloody footprint on the bathmat. I can see how this might be overlooked by a young girl. As a 38 year old woman and mom of 2, I would probably notice it, but as a college student, I probably would not. Or, if I did, I probably wouldn't give it much thought. And, if the reports are true that Amanda was messy, it probably would have even been less notable to her.

I can honestly say that I would have showered in this bathroom without any thoughts at all.

 

[justbeachy]

That bathroom photo is extremely misleading. The blood isn't blood but the spray that they used to make the protein show up. Here is a link to the police video of the bathroom as they found it. While I don't think she is innocent she did not bathe in a blood soaked bathroom.

Ha!!! Well, I just put together a long post with photos (see above) and then I realized that you had posted the video. Oops!!! I was getting so fired up about everyone's comments about the bathroom and how they couldn't possibly shower in a bloody bathroom that I put together my post without catching up on the thread. Note to self: always read to end of thread before adding info!

 

[LogicalMinds]

Thanks....I edited my other post..the pictures are from the daily mail which might be one of those horrible British tabloids like the Nat Enquirer only worse LOL

However...woudl you go into your apartment with the door open...see one of your (Italian) roommates window broken, room all "tossed" and messed up....and door to your other roommates room locked...would you shower and mess around for 2 hours?

10:30 -12:30

or maybe even earlier ...as the shopkeeper saw here there early and the reciept in Rafaelle's apt to that store for cleaning supplies is dated early??

How did only a small amount of blood get in the bathroom when Meredith was literally in a "lake of blood">>??? I think Amanda cleaned it

 

[Isabella]

Thanks....I edited my other post..the pictures are from the daily mail which might be one of those horrible British tabloids like the Nat Enquirer only worse LOL

However...woudl you go into your apartment with the door open...see one of your (Italian) roommates window broken, room all "tossed" and messed up....and door to your other roommates room locked...would you shower and mess around for 2 hours?

10:30 -12:30

or maybe even earlier ...as the shopkeeper saw here there early and the reciept in Rafaelle's apt to that store for cleaning supplies is dated early??

How did only a small amount of blood get in the bathroom when Meredith was literally in a "lake of blood">>??? I think Amanda cleaned it

Nope the Mail is nothing like the Enquirer. Our papers are not like yours and will get fined if they print anything that isnt the truth. Likewise..they have to print apologies if someone complains about a article being untrue which hasnt happened in this case.

For the record i saw the youtube last night. Because they say thats how the bathroom looked after the chemicals were put in..im curious in fact what makes them more believeable than the Mail is?

 

[LogicalMinds]

Nope the Mail is nothing like the Enquirer. Our papers are not like yours and will get fined if they print anything that isnt the truth. Likewise..they have to print apologies if someone complains about a article being untrue which hasnt happened in this case.

For the record i saw the youtube last night. Because they say thats how the bathroom looked after the chemicals were put in..im curious in fact what makes them more believeable than the Mail is?

?? Maybe no one has asked them to retract it?

the picture does look very pink

there is another picture of the bathoom or some wall that shows a bloody handprint...I know I have seen it but can't find it

there are some interesting pics on msnbc I think...the "window"..(with the glass outside on the ledge)...pics of the little house....
etc

 

[iluvmua]

Q: If Amanda cleaned up the bathroom so blood would not be present anywhere why did she not take the bathmat which had a bloody footprint on it?

 

[Isabella]

Q: If Amanda cleaned up the bathroom so blood would not be present anywhere why did she not take the bathmat which had a bloody footprint on it?

She ran out of time? who knows.

Btw someone said the guy who testified about the knife incident was arrested for drugs so maybe he shouldnt be believed..well..although i never have im well aware a LOT of people do take drugs especially cannabis and marijuana so does that mean they all shouldnt be believed? And on the same basis Knox and her BF had drugs that night so maybe anything they said shouldnt be believed?

 

[Linda7NJ]

I'm an American and I say that she is guilty. Don't put all Americans in the same basket, please. It does appear that you are stereo-typing all Americans as saying that Knox was not guilty just because she is an American, that is just not true. Dont' believe everything you read about Americans. We, each have our own minds and believe it or not, are not the racists as the rest of the world would like us portrayed.

Ditto !


Amanda is exactly where she belongs