British student murdered in Perugia, 3 suspects

[Isabella]

There are some telling factors about Meredith's body.....some knife points under her chin like someone was holding a knife or glass shard/s there to intimidate her...
bruises on her jawbones...like someone was holding her or forcing her
she was (at some point) forced to her knees from what they can tell
someone crushed her windpipe (partially, not the cause of death)....like holding her or forcing her
she was raped ...front...and back...
and ....her death was horrible and slow....a knife was pushed in from side to side...but did NOT sever her cartoid artery (which would have been mercifully quick)...
instead, her throat and lungs filled with blood...she literally drowned in her own blood..and that took maybe an hour to two hours....her hands were filled with blood as if she was trying to hold it...she would have been too weak to move and could not shout or cry..just horrible

whoever was in the room would also have blood on them
and I think they washed off and then came back in the am and tried to clean it up

LM i cant help thinking..when we read that it affects us people that didnt even know Meredith more than it did Amanda. Her death was so gruesome and my heart drops every time i read it it really does

I am not saying its not possible but i find it unlikely one guy could do all that on his own.

 

[Isabella]

I also wouldn't be telling all my friends and family 2 days after the murder about the stomach ache I had from the lack of food, yet not reacting to the murder of my roommate who was supposedly my friend!

To be honest had i been Amanda...( if innocent of course ) i would have felt sick every time i thought of Meredith and totally unable to eat. Shes just so weird.

 

[LogicalMinds]

This article sums up a LOT of things that make me feel that justice was served

Guede had no reason to "stage" a break =in...as he had no reason to be there at the apartment

Amanda *and Rafaelle...had reason to stage a break in...to deflect from Amanda

very telling that the ridiculous "break in" not only had glass outside the window...but someone threw the roommates clothes around the room...and threw some under the window on the floor of her bedroom...then broke the window!! so that glass is on top of the clothes thrown around
which makes NO sense....if someone broke in and climbed up the 15 feet to the window and then came in and threw the clothes around, the clothes would be on TOP of the glass...not under it

http://www.truejustice.org/ee/index.php?/tjmk/C356/

 

[LinasK]

This article sums up a LOT of things that make me feel that justice was served

Guede had no reason to "stage" a break =in...as he had no reason to be there at the apartment

Amanda *and Rafaelle...had reason to stage a break in...to deflect from Amanda

very telling that the ridiculous "break in" not only had glass outside the window...but someone threw the roommates clothes around the room...and threw some under the window on the floor of her bedroom...then broke the window!! so that glass is on top of the clothes thrown around
which makes NO sense....if someone broke in and climbed up the 15 feet to the window and then came in and threw the clothes around, the clothes would be on TOP of the glass...not under it

http://www.truejustice.org/ee/index.php?/tjmk/C356/

I totally agree! I hope Forensic Files picks up this case, as they definitely would find this very type of evidence credible!

 

[LadyL]

so much inflammatory reporting in this case has really made me nervous, esp. in regard to supposed evidence against Amanda & Raf; evidence that was really speculation in the early days and is still two years later being repeated as fact so like a good WSer, I've been digging for links (because I am just as guilty as anyone else of thinking I remember something but not having the proof handy)

so these snippets are just food for thought ... other statements to consider

something to ponder re: the shop owner identifying Amanda as being at his shop:

Quintavalle volunteered this information to the prosecution a year later upon the suggestion of a reporter friend.

a witness who stated Amanda was at Raf's place the evening of the murder:

In other testimony, Jovana Popovic of Serbia said Sollecito had agreed to drive her to a bus station in Perugia the night of the murder. They ended up not going as Popovic changed her plan. Popovic went to Sollecito's house at 8:40 p.m. to tell him she no longer needed to go, and Knox opened the door to take the message, the Serbian woman testified.

from this link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29812751/

another interesting tidbit (what it means, I don't know):

Doctor Giobbi says that he was locked in the director's room. And he could hear Amanda's screams from there. Amanda's screams. What was going on in that police station?

on her fluency in Italian:

On the famous night, on the original night, Amanda was waiting for Raffaele, under interrogation, at the police station. She didn't have anything to do. So she called her housemate Filomena.
She was wiretapped.

But the conversation with Filomena also shows another detail: the Italian Amanda Knox could speak at that time. A very basic Italian, so basic that in order to understand each other they had to switch into English.

from this link: http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/

I'm still reading ... so much more out there ...

 

[Isabella]

so much inflammatory reporting in this case has really made me nervous, esp. in regard to supposed evidence against Amanda & Raf; evidence that was really speculation in the early days and is still two years later being repeated as fact so like a good WSer, I've been digging for links (because I am just as guilty as anyone else of thinking I remember something but not having the proof handy)

so these snippets are just food for thought ... other statements to consider

something to ponder re: the shop owner identifying Amanda as being at his shop:

Quintavalle volunteered this information to the prosecution a year later upon the suggestion of a reporter friend.

a witness who stated Amanda was at Raf's place the evening of the murder:

In other testimony, Jovana Popovic of Serbia said Sollecito had agreed to drive her to a bus station in Perugia the night of the murder. They ended up not going as Popovic changed her plan. Popovic went to Sollecito's house at 8:40 p.m. to tell him she no longer needed to go, and Knox opened the door to take the message, the Serbian woman testified.

from this link: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/29812751/

another interesting tidbit (what it means, I don't know):

Doctor Giobbi says that he was locked in the director's room. And he could hear Amanda's screams from there. Amanda's screams. What was going on in that police station?

on her fluency in Italian:

On the famous night, on the original night, Amanda was waiting for Raffaele, under interrogation, at the police station. She didn't have anything to do. So she called her housemate Filomena.
She was wiretapped.

But the conversation with Filomena also shows another detail: the Italian Amanda Knox could speak at that time. A very basic Italian, so basic that in order to understand each other they had to switch into English.

from this link: http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/

I'm still reading ... so much more out there ...

I dont know what your point is about the shopkeeper..but like we have said many times..the receipts were found so it DID happen. Who the shop keeper may or not be friends with is irrelevant.

Also no offence but that blog doesnt look what i would call...particularly trustworthy.

 

[jjenny]

Lady L, you might discount the witness who says he saw her in the store that morning. Well, does it sound credible to you that she would go into her apartment in the morning to get a mop for a spill (at dinner time) in her boyfriend's apartment? How much water did the boyfriend spill that she would need a mop from her apartment all this time later? Wouldn't someone just wipe the spill with a paper towel or a blanket rather then going to another apartment for a mop the next morning?
And so unlucky she is, she needed the mop that was the same morning her roommate was murdered during the night.

 

[LadyL]

Very, very possible...but it's definitely NOT luminol. I wonder what fingerprints they were looking for? I mean, anyone who visits me would have their fingerprints in the bathroom if they used it.

The article, besides maintaining that the police had been distributing the photographs, suggests that the bathroom in which Amanda took the shower was in the apparent bloody conditions shown in one of those pictures (which would have been an obvious sign of guilt).

This website, on the same day, explained that the pink-red substance wasn't blood but the ester cyanoacrylate sprayed after inspection and sample collection (just to remind one of the differences in the media).

What will the prosecutor do? --Dalla Vedova asks. What will the police do? Are they going to press charges against the Daily Mail?

http://perugia-shock.blogspot.com/

 

[missyjane77]

Is ester cyanoacrylate a form of "super glue" substance used in forensics?

ETA: Yes, it is. I found an MSDS here: http://www.imperialinc.com/msds0095180.shtml

ETA-again: But that doesn't make sense b/c they use the cyanoacrylate ester fumes to detect finger prints. Did they actually fume the entire bathroom? I am under the impression that fuming only occurs on smaller objects and in a lab since the fumes are toxic.
http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/feneric/cyanoacrylate.html

 

[jjenny]

Is ester cyanoacrylate a form of "super glue" substance used in forensics?

ETA: Yes, it is. I found an MSDS here: http://www.imperialinc.com/msds0095180.shtml

ETA-again: But that doesn't make sense b/c they use the cyanoacrylate ester fumes to detect finger prints. Did they actually fume the entire bathroom? I am under the impression that fuming only occurs on smaller objects and in a lab since the fumes are toxic.

From what I gather, it is used for fingerprint development. Is it pink or red though? One would think they would try using luminol in the bathroom.

 

[LadyL]

I dont know what your point is about the shopkeeper..but like we have said many times..the receipts were found so it DID happen. Who the shop keeper may or not be friends with is irrelevant.

Also no offence but that blog doesnt look what i would call...particularly trustworthy.

it has also been written that Raf had a cleaning lady who could've left that receipt at his place

the shop owner's assistant (who was actually at the register) also supposedly denied ever seeing Amanda in the store

so we have a bunch of speculation as to who was in the store and a shop owner who reported his sighting a year later b/c a reporter urged him to

my point is, is that it is all speculation and not conclusive evidence


the blog is written by an Italian lawyer who has actually been in the courtroom seeing the evidence, unlike us, and is very credible IMO as I've seen him attack the system and the sensationalism and the evidence and both sides and dispel myths & unsubstantiated rumours

IMO, the hysteria in this case does not create an atmosphere where fairness & justice can prevail

 

[jjenny]

it has also been written that Raf had a cleaning lady who could've left that receipt at his place

the shop owner's assistant (who was actually at the register) also supposedly denied ever seeing Amanda in the store

so we have a bunch of speculation as to who was in the store and a shop owner who reported his sighting a year later b/c a reporter urged him to

my point is, is that it is all speculation and not conclusive evidence


the blog is written by an Italian lawyer who has actually been in the courtroom seeing the evidence, unlike us, and is very credible IMO as I've seen him attack the system and the sensationalism and the evidence and both sides and dispel myths & unsubstantiated rumours

IMO, the hysteria in this case does not create an atmosphere where fairness & justice can prevail

So he had a cleaning lady but unfortunately no mop? And after a spill at dinner Amanda had to go to her apartment to pick one up the next morning? Instead of using a towel or something to wipe it after the spill, as I presume most people would do?

 

[missyjane77]

From what I gather, it is used for fingerprint development. Is it pink or red though? One would think they would try using luminol in the bathroom.

Apparently they can't fume a bathroom though. It has to be done in an airtight container. Yes, it is used to detect fingerprints, but again, not in large areas. So, we can rule out luminol and cyanoacrylate. I'm thinking it has to be a powder of some sort....or perhaps some photo editing...

 

[Isabella]

So he had a cleaning lady but unfortunately no mop? And after a spill at dinner Amanda had to go to her apartment to pick one up the next morning? Instead of using a towel or something to wipe it after the spill, as I presume most people would do?

You forget one thing..according to him she wasnt even there.

 

[LadyL]

Lady L, you might discount the witness who says he saw her in the store that morning. Well, does it sound credible to you that she would go into her apartment in the morning to get a mop for a spill (at dinner time) in her boyfriend's apartment? How much water did the boyfriend spill that she would need a mop from her apartment all this time later? Wouldn't someone just wipe the spill with a paper towel or a blanket rather then going to another apartment for a mop the next morning?
And so unlucky she is, she needed the mop that was the same morning her roommate was murdered during the night.

absolutely not - none of that necessarily makes sense to me, except to say that they did live only 5 min. from each other & I might grab a mop from home to take back to my b/f, esp. if I was at home anyway taking a shower, rather than go to a strangers house or a store

on the other hand, I don't know why a mop would be necessary the next day, unless he had some kind of flooring that it would leave a water-mark on?

yeah, I do find it strange but that's as far as I'm willing to go in my judgment of it; I don't think strange necessarily = guilty

 

[weedemout]

That email is very telling. She says that Meridith is not accounted for yet she thinks she is in the room sleeping? Also, did Meridith's door have a lock on it? You are so worried but you don't even try to open her door and look in? WTF?

 

[LadyL]

Apparently they can't fume a bathroom though. It has to be done in an airtight container. Yes, it is used to detect fingerprints, but again, not in large areas. So, we can rule out luminol and cyanoacrylate. I'm thinking it has to be a powder of some sort....or perhaps some photo editing...

my understanding is they use some kind of dye stain afterwards but I'm with you - I don't know why it would be used in a bathroom

 

[Isabella]

absolutely not - none of that necessarily makes sense to me, except to say that they did live only 5 min. from each other & I might grab a mop from home to take back to my b/f, esp. if I was at home anyway taking a shower, rather than go to a strangers house or a store

on the other hand, I don't know why a mop would be necessary the next day, unless he had some kind of flooring that it would leave a water-mark on?

yeah, I do find it strange but that's as far as I'm willing to go in my judgment of it; I don't think strange necessarily = guilty

But her bf has said she didnt stop with him that night..so...im not sure what living 5 mins apart has to do with anything. I am at a loss to understand if she didnt stay with him..why she would go from wherever she supposedly stayed to get him a mop for a spill the n ight before.

 

[Isabella]

That email is very telling. She says that Meridith is not accounted for yet she thinks she is in the room sleeping? Also, did Meridith's door have a lock on it? You are so worried but you don't even try to open her door and look in? WTF?

That is one thing i didnt get. Didnt she even try and open the door?

Also one of the articles linked on here today reminded me of something else. She said she didnt go in there cos her bf pulled her back..and they didnt go in before the cops got there and yet she told people the description of Merediths body. How if she hadnt seen it?

 

[LadyL]

But her bf has said she didnt stop with him that night..so...im not sure what living 5 mins apart has to do with anything. I am at a loss to understand if she didnt stay with him..why she would go from wherever she supposedly stayed to get him a mop for a spill the n ight before.

raf also admitted to telling the policia a load of b.s.

who knows, they both confuse me, which is why I'm trying to ferret out more details