Found Deceased CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #13

[Andreee]

O.K., one more try....seems as if I'm causing some confusion.

-We will not hear anything more about cause of death from the Coroner unless it is determined COD was criminal (Nothing at present suggests that)
-For those who wish to know COD, you can obtain that from the death cert., where in California that is public record. (Links provided in a couple different posts above)
-Is the Death Cert ready for public review/purchase? - I do not know
-Do I believe this is a criminal matter? - No, I do not
-Will those who believe this is a criminal matter be satisfied with the outcome of this case and the COD on the death cert? - Probably not based on recent posts

While this is a terribly sad case, the outcome was predictable based on the harsh environment. If proven wrong I'll gladly eat crow, but I think this was a very tragic misadventure brought on by that scorching heat.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I agree. From everything we have heard thus far, I do think this is an accident. IMO. There is one thing that puzzles me, how the heck the searchers did not find her after the extensive searches they did! It happens so much in other cases as well.

 

[rosesfromangels]

...

In general, in the court of public opinion, if someone was falsely accused of a crime, are they ever really viewed by the public the same way again? For some, I think they are screwed no matter what, the damage is done.

In this case, I don't think anyone will be harder on RT over BT's death, than RT himself.
They left together to do an activity they both enjoyed, one came home, the other one didn't. If only this would have happened, if I would have did this, or we didn't go, and so on...

I'll say it, I feel bad for the guy.

IMO

Horrible to happen at any age, but particularly to elders.
Very sad and tragic all around.
A

I agree. From everything we have heard thus far, I do think this is an accident. IMO. There is one thing that puzzles me, how the heck the searchers did not find her after the extensive searches they did! It happens so much in other cases as well.

If you ever volunteer for a search (especially in a large search area), the answer to that question will quickly get answered. Even with grid searches (shoulder to shoulder), you can literally step right over remains and not see them.

Mother Nature embraces the dead.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Cherwell]

Yeah, as soon as RT gave that interview - I thought this is not a good idea. He talks too much, way too much. He's going to get shredded.
But if BT was wearing a bikini and had a beer with her (these are questions he would have been asked, describe what she was wearing, what did she have on her), what else could he say? Then he said out loud, in that interview, what scenarios were running through his head.

That's the thing, he would have been questioned and prompted to say certain things. Such as "if someone snatched her, do you have a message for them?"
The interview we saw was edited down for broadcasting so we didn't hear all the in-between stuff.

 

[Reasonable & Just]

Thank you so much for posting this! I had never heard of this case. The first link makes for some fascinating reading.

It was really heartbreaking. I can't imagine what was going through the adults' minds as they realized their little ones weren't going to make it. The desert is harsh, and I'm sure all the people who loved Barbara are thinking back through so many moments of that day and asking "What if"?

 

[kkdj]

O.K., one more try....seems as if I'm causing some confusion.

-We will not hear anything more about cause of death from the Coroner unless it is determined COD was criminal (Nothing at present suggests that)
-For those who wish to know COD, you can obtain that from the death cert., where in California that is public record. (Links provided in a couple different posts above)
-Is the Death Cert ready for public review/purchase? - I do not know
-Do I believe this is a criminal matter? - No, I do not
-Will those who believe this is a criminal matter be satisfied with the outcome of this case and the COD on the death cert? - Probably not based on recent posts

While this is a terribly sad case, the outcome was predictable based on the harsh environment. If proven wrong I'll gladly eat crow, but I think this was a very tragic misadventure brought on by that scorching heat.

Amateur opinion and speculation

At this point I agree with you.
I had been thinking RT seemed unusual at best, under the circumstances. But with him calling in, LE searching for 9 days, and now BT being found near the search area, I think it was a tragic misadventure too.
moo

 

[Andreee]

O.K., one more try....seems as if I'm causing some confusion.

-We will not hear anything more about cause of death from the Coroner unless it is determined COD was criminal (Nothing at present suggests that)
-For those who wish to know COD, you can obtain that from the death cert., where in California that is public record. (Links provided in a couple different posts above)
-Is the Death Cert ready for public review/purchase? - I do not know
-Do I believe this is a criminal matter? - No, I do not
-Will those who believe this is a criminal matter be satisfied with the outcome of this case and the COD on the death cert? - Probably not based on recent posts

While this is a terribly sad case, the outcome was predictable based on the harsh environment. If proven wrong I'll gladly eat crow, but I think this was a very tragic misadventure brought on by that scorching heat.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I agree. From everything we have heard thus far, I do think this is an accident. IMO. There is one thing that puzzles me, how the heck the searchers did not find her after the extensive searches they did! It happens so much in other cases as well.

...

Horrible to happen at any age, but particularly to elders.
Very sad and tragic all around.
A

If you ever volunteer for a search (especially in a large search area), the answer to that question will quickly get answered. Even with grid searches (shoulder to shoulder), you can literally step right over remains and not see them.

Mother Nature embraces the dead.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Andreee]

I have never been in a search, but I read time and time again that yes, the deceased can be passed right by even with an intense search! I certainly wouldn't blame the searchers, who work tirelessly in these cases. It just is in some cases perplexing when searches prove fruitless, especially when the land is so open and less dense with trees, etc. I would help with any search in my region if I was needed for sure.

 

[wary]

...

Horrible to happen at any age, but particularly to elders.
Very sad and tragic all around.
A

If you ever volunteer for a search (especially in a large search area), the answer to that question will quickly get answered. Even with grid searches (shoulder to shoulder), you can literally step right over remains and not see them.

Mother Nature embraces the dead.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I have not been on one of these searches. Obviously, even walking shoulder to shoulder, the searchers are going to have to split up to go around obstacles—like clumps of cholla cactus. Are the searchers trained, and constantly reminded, to turn and look behind them, any time they go around an obstacle? You see what I mean? If they continue looking forward, which I think is natural, they’ll miss whatever is on the far side of these obstacles.

 

[unknown402]

I’m so happy she was found so the family can find some closure.
IMO, my personal suspicious against the husband came from his own story. Him saying “Someone snatched her” made it sound to me like he was covering up for if she was eventually found with evidence of foul play. Of course being on this site it is easy to think the worst. It is just as easy to switch my mindset and think that it would probably be easier as a love one to be able to blame an invisible villain than to have to go through the process of “what if”. It just depends on the lens you’re wearing.

I also have never been on a search for human remains. In an open air environment, would the smell of decay not catch the attention of anyone? I imagine there had to be cadaver dogs? I do remember it was brutally hot around this time.

 

[rosesfromangels]

A lot of you are asking questions about searches. I am going to leave those answers to someone who is a professional or semi-pro SAR or Tracker. We have some amazing folks on WS who do this professionally, and I enjoy following their amazing work, and how they approach it.

From an amateur volunteer perspective, I'll share a bit about my first volunteer search effort. There were several hundred volunteers, and I had to search on a farm that had what seemed like at least 100 oil barrels. My knees were shaking so bad as I stuck a probing stick in those barrels, I thought I was going to drop. I was scared spitless. Next, we did a grid search in an area of the farm that had been deemed particularly "interesting". (We weren't told why). We were told if we found anything *not to touch it*, but blow a whistle that was given to us. In one area, we got on our knees and meticulously covered a field about a football field length. Each item found elicited a whistle blow, where a trained professional would look and then mark it for further review or dismiss it, and we would move on. We didn't find anything that was evidence that day, and the Subject of the search is still missing.

I would encourage everyone to participate in a search if you can. It's a great way to help, and the families are so grateful.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[deugirtni]

Criminal Investigation?
@mlhenn bbm. Thx for your post and link.

IIUC, The Charley Project's "resolved" status = BT is no longer missing, iow, remains were identified as hers.
IIUC, that stmt does not reflect status/nature of LE's current investigation, i.e., criminal or non-criminal.

LE's Dec 18 NIXLE stmt says "cause of death is pending"* and
"INCIDENT: Missing Person/Death Investigation"* bbm Before Dec. 18, did <-- say "Missing Person" only?

Does anyone recall --- before Dec 18, did SBSD characterize case as:
- anything other than "Missing Person"?*
- "Death Investigation" (LE phrasing in Dec. 18 update)?*
- "criminal investigation" which LE did not say in Dec 18 update?*
Thx in adv.

________________________________________________
* INCIDENT: Missing Person/Death Investigation
"UPDATE – December 18, 2020
On November 27, 2020 two people were hiking in a field off Kelbaker Road when they discovered human remains. On November 28th a further search was conducted, and additional bones and evidence was recovered.
The remains have been positively identified as Barbara Thomas. The cause of death is pending.
No other details are available for release at this time."
^ http://nixle.us/CE3JA

It appears the Nixle details only said 'Missing Person' prior to December 18th when they announced publicly that BT's remains had been discovered and identified. It appears the last update prior to that was on July 22nd, 2019, when they suspended the daily searches for BT, transferred the case to the Specialized Investigations Division, and changed the contact details:

Advisory

July 22nd - The investigation continues into the whereabouts of missing person Barbara Thomas

DATE/TIME: July 12, 2019 2:30 pm

INCIDENT: Missing Person

LOCATION: Kelbaker Road/Hidden Hills near I-40

VICTIM: Barbara Thomas, 69 years old, resident of Bullhead City, AZ described as 5'9, 130 lbs., Blonde hair, Green eyes
Last seen wearing a black bikini, a red baseball cap and tan hiking boots with black socks

SUMMARY:
UPDATE - Monday, July 22, 2019

The ongoing daily searches for Barbara Thomas in the Mohave National Preserve have been suspended. Additional searches will be conducted as any additional information is developed in the investigation.

Detectives from the Specialized Investigations Division have assumed the investigation as is standard department policy when a missing person has not been located.

The investigation is ongoing and anyone with information is asked to contact Detective Nicholas Clark, Specialized Investigations Division (909) 387-3589. Callers wishing to remain anonymous are urged to contact the We-Tip Hotline at 1-800-78-CRIME (27463) or www.wetip.com.
https://local.nixle.com/alert/7427618/
-=-==-==================-----------------
Definition:
Specialized Investigations
The Specialized Investigations Division is comprised of the Homicide Detail, Crimes Against Children Detail and the Polygraph Detail. These details investigate a variety of major crimes including homicides, suspicious deaths, in-custody deaths, officer-involved shootings, child , child abuse, and various other crimes against children. ...
Specialized Investigations – San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department
-=-=-=-=-
In looking up Detective Nicholas Clark, I found numerous references that he is from the Homicide Detail of the Specialized Investigations Division.

 

[calico3]

O.K., one more try....seems as if I'm causing some confusion.

-We will not hear anything more about cause of death from the Coroner unless it is determined COD was criminal (Nothing at present suggests that)
-For those who wish to know COD, you can obtain that from the death cert., where in California that is public record. (Links provided in a couple different posts above)
-Is the Death Cert ready for public review/purchase? - I do not know
-Do I believe this is a criminal matter? - No, I do not
-Will those who believe this is a criminal matter be satisfied with the outcome of this case and the COD on the death cert? - Probably not based on recent posts

While this is a terribly sad case, the outcome was predictable based on the harsh environment. If proven wrong I'll gladly eat crow, but I think this was a very tragic misadventure brought on by that scorching heat.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I would accept the outcome of Barbara's death if it is not a criminal matter, but I may still speculate other...actually, I just want to know one way or the other.

I truly care about what happened to Barbara...she has been on mind since the beginning and I truly care what happened to her. I just want peace...

 

[Cherwell]

@deugirtni
Yes, this was discussed in an earlier thread. There's not really anything to glean from it, as stated it's "standard department policy when a missing person has not been located". I would guess these cases go to the Homicide Detail by default.

 

[rosesfromangels]

I would accept the outcome of Barbara's death if it is not a criminal matter, but I may still speculate other...actually, I just want to know one way or the other.

I truly care about what happened to Barbara...she has been on mind since the beginning and I truly care what happened to her. I just want peace...

WS attracts such caring people such as yourself.
You might want to order a copy of the death cert. when it becomes avail if it will help ease your mind.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[al66pine]

Searching.

.... From an amateur volunteer perspective, I'll share a bit about my first volunteer search effort. We didn't find anything that was evidence that day, and the Subject of the search is still missing.... I would encourage everyone to participate in a search if you can. It's a great way to help, and the families are so grateful....

@rosesfromangels Thanks for sharing your ^ experience.
It would seem doubly disheartening - to participate in search that found nothing that day, and also that Subject has not yet been located. But those kinds of searches can and do find ppl, so thank you for joining that effort.

Just curious approx how long ago did you search? How soon was it after person went missing, days, wks, mo's?
(If you are inclined to post. If not, no worries.)

 

[rosesfromangels]

Searching.
@rosesfromangels Thanks for sharing your ^ experience.
It would seem doubly disheartening - to participate in search that found nothing that day, and also that Subject has not yet been located. But those kinds of searches can and do find ppl, so thank you for joining that effort.

Just curious approx how long ago did you search? How soon was it after person went missing, days, wks, mo's?
(If you are inclined to post. If not, no worries.)

It was shortly after she went missing....IIRC, it was the very next weekend.
Similar to Barb, there had been professional searches, but the area was so vast they needed all hands on deck.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

I would accept the outcome of Barbara's death if it is not a criminal matter, but I may still speculate other...actually, I just want to know one way or the other.

I truly care about what happened to Barbara...she has been on mind since the beginning and I truly care what happened to her. I just want peace...

I’m not sure I will accept not a criminal matter. She could have just been left there with no way to return. So many truly bizarre actions after she went missing.

 

[Catmommy]

The question about the odor of decomp is a good one. That is an odor impossible to ignore, impossible to miss. As would be the sight of carrion birds circling fresh remains. It's curious that these were missed, in my opinion. No theory, just curious.

 

[calico3]

WS attracts such caring people such as yourself.
You might want to order a copy of the death cert. when it becomes avail if it will help ease your mind.

Amateur opinion and speculation

Thank you, rosefromangels ...I can do this...to help myself and anyone else concerned.

 

[rosesfromangels]

I’m not sure I will accept not a criminal matter. She could have just been left there with no way to return. So many truly bizarre actions after she went missing.

BBM - I must have missed something. What bizarre actions that lead you to conclude there is criminality involved?