CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #2

[Deleted member 39678]

No, but a company might overlook the illegal things that do happen in order to have their products throughout the world.

Looks like it's LE that is overlooking illegal activities. This has been going on for over 3 decades and not one arrest. JMO

 

[Gardener1850]

I have a dumb question about the dogs. Are they cadaver dogs in addition to SAR? Or are those normally different dogs?

I don't know which kind of dogs are being used but from what I understand the dogs are either trained as scent tracking dogs or they are trained as cadaver dogs. The same dog would not be trained for both types of searching. I'm not sure what kind of dogs a SAR unit typically uses. Maybe they have one of each type there?

MOO.

 

[Lilibet]

We could sleuth it without posting anything here, but if we find anything relevant, we could PM him or offer a tip to LE without violating TOS, yes?

Yes, of course we can do this individually if we have the resources available and find relevant information to pass along to LE. Here is what our Rules State:

NOTE: Websleuths does not condone members becoming personally involved in cases by initiating contact with family members, law enforcement, or the media. This does not preclude responding to a request for volunteers, or utilizing proper channels to report valid information, i.e., "a tip", to law enforcement.
Rules - Etiquette & Information

But the problem is, most or all of us don’t have the investigative resources to dig into RT’s personal/financial/Herbalife affairs deeply enough to connect RT to BT’s disappearance. We certainly shouldn’t bombard LE with general Herbalife conspiracy theories (not that you are suggesting that). The family can suggest that LE look into RT and Herbalife or hire a PI to do that if they are truly convinced there is a connection.

 

[PommyMommy]

Yesterday's search was suspended due to extreme temperatures. Historical temperatures per Bullhead City, AZ History | Weather Underground

Jul Max
12th 114
13th 114
14th 114
15th 114
16th 113
17th 107
18th 109
19th 107
20th 107
21st 111
22nd 96

 

[NervousNellie]

Yes, of course we can do this individually if we have the resources available and find relevant information to pass along to LE. Here is what our Rules State:

NOTE: Websleuths does not condone members becoming personally involved in cases by initiating contact with family members, law enforcement, or the media. This does not preclude responding to a request for volunteers, or utilizing proper channels to report valid information, i.e., "a tip", to law enforcement.
Rules - Etiquette & Information

But the problem is, most or all of us don’t have the investigative resources to dig into RT’s personal/financial/Herbalife affairs deeply enough to connect RT to BT’s disappearance. We certainly shouldn’t bombard LE with general Herbalife conspiracy theories (not that you are suggesting that). The family can suggest that LE look into RT and Herbalife or hire a PI to do that if they are truly convinced there is a connection.

ETA because I hit post too soon:
respectfully bolded and colored the font red by me
Websleuths members should not be posting on family members' FB pages and telling them to come here.

 

[Steelslady]

Perhaps I should have clarified which type of foul play I was referring to. LE must not think she was abducted in order to have that much manpower out in the desert all this time looking for her.

As far as if RT is responsible for her disappearance. It would be pretty stupid of him to dispose of her body and then invite LE to the exact area to search. If RT did something to BT I think it happened somewhere else and the whole out hiking, lost sight of her story is a red herring.

JMO

This is my fear as well. Seeing that some family members appeared to know ahead of time about this camping trip, it would sound believable to them that she "disappeared" from there.

 

[IceIce9]

"I will not press charges, no questions asked, just drop her of"

These, are Robert's words. He does not seem to even consider Barbara wanting to press charges or having questions after being kidnapped and being held against her will.

I thought this was odd myself. And almost like the crime was against him, rather than his wife who he thinks was kidnapped.

 

[mrstfs]

self deleted. I’m pushing the envelope lol

 

[Steelslady]

Latest update

July 21st - The search for Barbara Thomas, age 69, is continuing in the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle
UPDATE #9
Sunday, July 21st, the search continued today for Barbara Thomas.
Search and Rescue members from throughout the San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department were deployed into the field this morning just after sunrise. K9 units, members certified in cave searches, rope climbing and desert terrain ground searchers were utilized today.

The search has been suspended for the day due to extreme temperatures. No evidence of Barbara was located today.

I was thinking (yeah, probably not smart on my part, haha) about her travel mug and her hat. I can't remember, did she have any sunglasses on? Thinking in terms of an abduction, you would think that perhaps the travel mug, hat, or something of hers would fall off somewhere? Perhaps I am over thinking things.

 

[MizStery]

We could sleuth it without posting anything here, but if we find anything relevant, we could PM him or offer a tip to LE without violating TOS, yes?

Hello Stripehaven, on another thread gosh it may have been the Liberty and Abigail Delphi forum one of our WS moderators posted the following:

Liltexas Moderator posted the following on a previous WS thread:

Take any and all sleuthing of non-POIs to your private conversations and DO NOT mention them here. It is a major TOS violation to sleuth non-POIs on the forum. It's even worse if you are implicating a minor child in your posts. And baiting is against our rules, so DO NOT hint that you have uncovered information that you can't share openly here.

Maybe someone else can chime in or perhaps already has on your TOS Rule question.


Trisha WS Owner Posted this when we switched over to the new editor.
The first thing you should try is our new way of sending Private Messages. PM's are now called "Conversations". You can invite up to 5 other people (with you equals 6 people on a conversation) and the conversation looks exactly like a thread on a public forum. However, it is not public, no one in management can see it, and the only people who can read the conversation are those who are actually participating.

MOO

 

[ZhaZhaHa]

Still nothing

Did our insider ever become verified? And did we ever pick up a new insider who is posting theories on FB?

 

[PommyMommy]

I was thinking (yeah, probably not smart on my part, haha) about her travel mug and her hat. I can't remember, did she have any sunglasses on? Thinking in terms of an abduction, you would think that perhaps the travel mug, hat, or something of hers would fall off somewhere? Perhaps I am over thinking things.

She had sunglasses on in the photo of her in the hat and bikini but it hasn't been confirmed whether that photo was taken the day she disappeared. I wish LE would at least tell us that! I think it's reasonable to assume that anyone out there at that time of day would be wearing sunglasses, though. You're not over-thinking anything, IMO. MOO

 

[AliceInPain]

Latest update
July 21st - The search for Barbara Thomas, age 69, is continuing in the area of Kelbaker/ Hidden ... from SBSD - Colorado River Sheriffs Department : Nixle.
The search has been suspended for the day due to extreme temperatures. No evidence of Barbara was located today.

sbm.

Thank you. And in their message the previous day they said: "There has been no evidence of Barbara Thomas located on previous days."

So no evidence at all then? Hm....

 

[kkdj]

She had sunglasses on in the photo of her in the hat and bikini but it hasn't been confirmed whether that photo was taken the day she disappeared. I wish LE would at least tell us that! I think it's reasonable to assume that anyone out there at that time of day would be wearing sunglasses, though. You're not over-thinking anything, IMO. MOO

Kinda odd RT didn't mention sunglasses tho. You would think it would be something else we'd be looking for.
ETA
Plus, I think BT looks younger in that bikini picture so I don't think that was taken that day, but rather a picture RT had to show that she dresses like that out in the desert.

 

[PommyMommy]

Still nothing

Did our insider ever become verified? And did we ever pick up a new insider who is posting theories on FB?

Yes, dbdb11 is a verified family member. He is the only VI so far. MOO

 

[Medstudies]

Is there a photo/ map, by chance, that shows where he was standing in relationship to her position as she rounded the bend? (Oh and the camper spot? I’m not greedy!)

Was their camper, and “the bend” at/near a crossroad? What distance are we talking from his position to hers when last seen? A few hundred feet? A kilometer?

Another thought: I suppose this is an area that is somewhat common to hike. But that particular dirt road? Is it a road a trucker would take? Are there nearby cell towers that would have picked up specific pings?

He hasn’t reported a specific vehicle that was in the area at the time of her disappearance right? Again, is there a crossroad nearby? I suppose there could be a reasonable explanation why he would miss a vehicle passing...perhaps a vehicle was parked near their camper, and person was waiting there?

(Just rambling here, I’ve most likely missed these answers, feel free to scroll)

 

[kay74]

I do not see RT being involved in this at all. He knows that she knows this area inside and out so the only thing he can come up with, is abduction and maybe it was! They have not found her, have they?

 

[PommyMommy]

Kinda odd RT didn't mention sunglasses tho. You would think it would be something else we'd be looking for.

It is. It's also kind of interesting that LE isn't using that photo. Maybe just because her face/hair is covered up with the sunglasses and hat. MOO

 

[GordianKnot]

Perhaps I should have clarified which type of foul play I was referring to. LE must not think she was abducted in order to have that much manpower out in the desert all this time looking for her.

As far as if RT is responsible for her disappearance. It would be pretty stupid of him to dispose of her body and then invite LE to the exact area to search. If RT did something to BT I think it happened somewhere else and the whole out hiking, lost sight of her story is a red herring.

JMO

BBM:

Now, that, I completely agree with...LE does not believe she was abducted.

What we don't know is whether or not LE believes she was in the area they're currently searching when she disappeared.

A thought has occurred to me about this search.

My thought relates to search warrants.

Presumably, LE would need to obtain warrants to get ping/electronic phone data from the service carrier for both RT's and BT's phones.

Especially given the fact that BT'S phone is/was not on her person when she went missing, what would LE need in order to convince a judge there was probable cause to get those records?

Maybe they need to show a judge they've searched high and low in the area RT says they were when she went missing, and that there's no sign of her anywhere, in order to get a judge to sign off on those warrants.

Stating the obvious: LE needs to track that phone data.

They need to know where and when those 2 phones pinged, and where and when those phones stayed stationary for any period of time.

I'm not convinced they have that info yet.

JMO.

 

[IceIce9]

BBM:

Now, that, I completely agree with...LE does not believe she was abducted.

What we don't know is whether or not LE believes she was in the area they're currently searching when she disappeared.

A thought has occurred to me about this search.

My thought relates to search warrants.

Presumably, LE would need to obtain warrants to get ping/electronic phone data from the service carrier for both RT's and BT's phones.

Especially given the fact that BT'S phone is/was not on her person when she went missing, what would LE need in order to convince a judge there was probable cause to get those records?

Maybe they need to show a judge they've searched high and low in the area RT says they were when she went missing, and that there's no sign of her anywhere, in order to get a judge to sign off on those warrants.

Stating the obvious: LE needs to track that phone data.

They need to know where and when those 2 phones pinged, and where and when those phones stayed stationary for any period of time.

I'm not convinced they have that info yet.

JMO.

There aren’t any security cameras on those trails, correct?