CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #4

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  • #601
Yet there are many unsolved cases where foul play is suspected.

Because there is evidence to that effect that meets a certain threshold.

Law enforcement owes us nothing here. We are not entitled to know what cards they are holding.

We’re going to have to wait.
 
  • #602
Does it help the public in the Dulos case? I don’t think so, but they did, and they do in many many cases.

Also I think the info can help. It can help families and loved ones feel that their suspicions are being taken seriously. It can help the community feel like LE is on the case.

I’m asking because people are speculating here on everything, so why not this? It’s certainly intriguing to me.
I'll add to the list Ms. Facetious gave you; media saturation makes finding a unbiased jury more difficult. I've noticed DA's in high profile cases many times request a gag order.
 
  • #603
Strongly disagree.

It's not just semantics here.

LE can definitely suspect foul play has occurred, but lack evidentiary proof of it.

In this case, LE may strongly suspect foul play on the basis of there being no evidence of BT having been in that location.

Lack of evidence isn't evidence, but in this case, it may raise LE's suspicions.

JMO.
Lack of evidence is evidence. In the scenario you give, it’s strong circumstantial evidence the spouse is lying about his whereabouts
 
  • #604
People have led cops straight to the body before.... there are certainly reasons for the strategies they use.

But again they can also lie to suspects.... Jessica Lunsfords family and Shasta Groene's family were both told they failed polygraphs.... and they didn't. Neither had anything to do with it.

Not trying to go off topic, but very curious...Did the police actually admit that they had lied about the failed polygraphs in these cases? If so, that's surprising in terms of revealing an investigative tool (though everyone already suspects it's a tool).
 
  • #605
We don't know because we aren't part of the investigation.
LE isn't in the habit of sharing more information than required with the public.
If they don't believe that sharing the information is going to help find the missing person or solve a crime, they don't.
How would it help for them to come out and say they believe there is foul play?
Ok it seems everyone is missing my question. I’m asking you to speculate on this as apparently that’s what everyone does here.
 
  • #606
Maybe. The only reaction we know he had was to be open about this to the press.

(Honestly? I don't think I'd tell the press if the cops said I was deceptive on the polygraph. Innocent or not.)

BBM:
Me, neither.
Fortunately, there are a lot of dumb criminals out there who will.
Take that creep Steven Capobianco in Hawaii who murdered Charli Scott, for example.
He gave an interview to a reporter who asked him about a polygraph he took.
Exclusive: Ex-boyfriend of missing Maui woman speaks out
SABBM:
Steven: "I volunteered for all of that. I went down there as soon as I could. I let them interrogate me. I let them polygraph me. I did everything."

Mileka: "How'd the polygraph go?"

Steven: "To the best of my knowledge, it went ok."

Mileka: "Did you pass, fail?"

Steven: "The Police told me I failed."

__________________________________

I mean, try to wrap your brain around that.

Seriously. You just can't make this stuff up.

So, sometimes guilty people do give interviews and tell on themselves.

JMO.
 
  • #607
Not trying to go off topic, but very curious...Did the police actually admit that they had lied about the failed polygraphs in these cases? If so, that's surprising in terms of revealing an investigative tool (though everyone already suspects it's a tool).
They don’t need to. Just being anxious, not sleeping well, or anything that causes your heart rate to go up or you to sweat will cause your polygraph test to be deceptive. They don’t work for lying. They work for stress.
 
  • #608
Ok it seems everyone is missing my question. I’m asking you to speculate on this as apparently that’s what everyone does here.
Can you re-phrase your question, I think I missed your intent too :)
 
  • #609
I imagine polygraphs could work for lying if lying is stressful for an individual. But I also know it's just a very limited tool among many that can help investigators move in a direction for investigation.
 
  • #610
I imagine they could work for lying if lying is stressful for you. But I also know it's just a very limited tool among many that can help investigators move in a direction for investigation.
I think getting polygraphed would be stressful.
 
  • #611
Can you re-phrase your question, I think I missed your intent too :)
I asked why the police might say they don’t suspect foul play in BT’s disappearance.

We’ve covered trying to get the suspect relaxed so he trips up, but at the same time we’ve polygraphed the guy and told him he flunked (which would freak him out), so they kind of blank each other out as the guy thinks he’s a suspect.

Potential reasons; they suspect he’s done something but can find absolutely nothing yet (many days in). Not even a blip on his cellphone or timeline, but they’re hoping to uncover something.

Anyone got anything else?
 
  • #612
I've been following this case and my only Q at this particular point in time is:

**WHY have a key hidden (under a rock or whatever) when RT's Ford truck has a key code for the door?**

I have a Ford and my code is 5 digits - surely 5 digits isn't beyond the realm of what can be memorized by BT or RT. That is all.

MOO.

(I tried to find a pic of the truck to link but can not - sorry)
 
  • #613
Because there is evidence to that effect that meets a certain threshold.

Law enforcement owes us nothing here. We are not entitled to know what cards they are holding.

We’re going to have to wait.

IIRC - and please correct me if I am wrong - the only evidence we have that RT failed a polygraph is his own admission.
 
  • #614
IIRC - and please correct me if I am wrong - the only evidence we have that RT failed a polygraph is his own admission.

Correct. Law enforcement has said nothing.
 
  • #615
I think getting polygraphed would be stressful.

It is. And, in some industries, such as the one I worked in, you darn well better pass it.
 
  • #616
I've been following this case and my only Q at this particular point in time is:

**WHY have a key hidden (under a rock or whatever) when RT's Ford truck has a key code for the door?**

I have a Ford and my code is 5 digits - surely 5 digits isn't beyond the realm of what can be memorized by BT or RT. That is all.

MOO.

(I tried to find a pic of the truck to link but can not - sorry)
I was wondering why RT would hide a key when most men's shorts and pants have pockets? I was also wondering why, IF she was heading back to the truck/RV ahead of him, she would not have simply asked him for the key. Give me a sec and I will find that truck pic for you.
 
  • #617
I wondered this, as well. I think someone could’ve easily seen the brand new RV from the road, stopped to check it out and, seeing that no one was around, decided to help themselves. BT, returning to the RV ahead of RT, may not have thought another car parked near by was suspicious. If she surprised someone as she approached or entered the RV, I believe she could’ve been subdued fairly quickly with little noise or sign of struggle given her size.

Along those same lines of BT not finding another vehicle suspicious, BT may have been approached by someone as she returned to the RV (on the pretense of needing directions, asking about the trails, etc.) and was then able to subdue her. If someone is caught of guard- say midway through giving directions or similar- I believe they could be rendered unconscious with barely any noise at all and abducted with very little sign of struggle.

Not sure what to make of this. Not sure I believe yet that she was ever there in the first place.

Also still think she could have fallen or become stuck and was somehow missed by SAR (it does happen, though not often).

I think it unlikely that it was an animal attack, but don’t think it should be completely discounted. I’ve seen two mountain lions in my life and both were during the daytime. I do, however, think there’d be some sign, the beer or her hat, if this were the case.

I hope (and tend to think) LE knows more than they are letting on.

Hoping for the best.

Following up in the thought of her surprising someone at the trailer.

1. The key was still under the rock so if that happened she would have either gone in knowing someone was inside— unlikely— or met them at the area around trailer.

2. I can’t imagine someone taking her if they were in process of theft— and- if they did .
A. Nothing disturbed in trailer
B. RT noticed no vehicle or dust kicked up from that pull off area. I’d think if someone took her they’d be getting the heck out of dodge ... fast.. and dust would surely fly up with tires leaving fast. He noticed no dirt lingering in the air. He wasn’t that far behind, supposedly.
 
  • #618
It is. And, in some industries, such as the one I worked in, you darn well better pass it.
Do they still use them in the industry you worked in? I’m assuming you don’t mean LE.
 
  • #619
  • #620
Do they still use them in the industry you worked in? I’m assuming you don’t mean LE.

Yes, they do. I'm referring to aerospace and defense.

ETA - Let's leave the discussion of polygraphs so we don't tie up the thread with off-topic posts.
 
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