CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #9

[MsBetsy]

BBM

Oh, ok. I must have missed that.

Thinking that I've caught up here in Barbara's thread... but maybe not ?
Where else was she seen ?
I was thinking it's not the gas station, as RT just stated that she was in the truck and he couldn't move or manage without her help-- but the attendant saw him jog or sprint back to the truck and (the employee) thought it was odd.

The dog kennel footage was important, imo , as it would show what she was wearing that day.

Yes, but usually in missing persons cases part of the reason they show footage of the last place the person was seen is to get it out to the public hoping to get tips from anyone who would have seen that person there or noticed any suspicious activity in that area.

Since the kennel and the gas station were likely over a hundred miles away from where she went missing, maybe LE didn't think it was important to release those images.

After all, whatever happened was thought to occur while they were walking in the desert and there were probably no witnesses in that area.
They did release a picture that was likely what she was wearing or similar to what she was wearing when she went missing.

Maybe she was not wearing her bikini when she left the house or when she went to the kennel. Most people would wear a cover up or something over their swimsuit, I would think.
So if that is the case then she would appear much different in those surveillance photos to what she actually looked like when she went missing. Therefore it would not help the public to identify her. Imo

 

[Nerissa]

I have utterly zero understanding as to why the heck LE hasn't released the photos of her that are allegedly from that day, from that area, taken shortly before she vanished -

Why????

Maybe key word here is 'allegedly'

VI said that a detective confirmed there were photos.....

Why not release them?

Can anyone think of a case (that didn't end up criminal in nature) wherein the last known photos, from the day of the disappearance, in the clothing last seen in: were NOT released?

Baffling

JMO

BTW: ETA: I'm working on assumption the one of her in black bikini top, sunglasses & red hat is NOT from that day....

 

[LietKynes]

At this time I'm assuming the dog kennel was the last sighting.

Afaik, the gas station attendant recalled RT being 'naggy' and stating that his wife was in the truck and that he couldn't maneuver the fifth whell without her... or that he could do anything without her help.

Which is why the attendant remembered and found it odd when RT sprinted or jogged back to where he'd parked the fifth wheel out of sight of the store.
As if in a hurry ?
Although it could just have been to keep the ice cold that he'd just bought.

No one saw her at the gas station.
If the attendant's memory is correct.

Actually I think all of this discussion about Barbara is good, as we are all wondering what the heck happened, and how she vanished on what @sroad said was a fairly visible trail back to the fifth wheel rv.

Sad if interest in this case dwindles and she remains missing and the case unsolved.
It FEELS like it's a "solve-able" case !!!!
There are puzzle pieces missing that need to be brought to light.
Maybe there are others in Barbara's life who need to speak up. Imo.

 

[darring21]

I have utterly zero understanding as to why the heck LE hasn't released the photos of her that are allegedly from that day, from that area, taken shortly before she vanished -

Why????

Maybe key word here is 'allegedly'

VI said that a detective confirmed there were photos.....

Why not release them?

Can anyone think of a case (that didn't end up criminal in nature) wherein the last known photos, from the day of the disappearance, in the clothing last seen in: were NOT released?

Baffling

JMO

BTW: ETA: I'm working on assumption the one of her in black bikini top, sunglasses & red hat is NOT from that day....

It's simple - LE doesn't think the photos will help solve the case. Either they believe she got lost and fell victim to the elements or something nefarious happened or maybe something else that I haven't thought of but the photos and the public are of no help to them.

Except the public can be of help by assisting in the search. I believe LE has made that easy for the public to assist. May give another indication of what LE thinks happened.

 

[Cherwell]

I have utterly zero understanding as to why the heck LE hasn't released the photos of her that are allegedly from that day, from that area, taken shortly before she vanished -
Why????
Maybe key word here is 'allegedly'
VI said that a detective confirmed there were photos.....
Why not release them?
Can anyone think of a case (that didn't end up criminal in nature) wherein the last known photos, from the day of the disappearance, in the clothing last seen in: were NOT released?
Baffling
JMO
BTW: ETA: I'm working on assumption the one of her in black bikini top, sunglasses & red hat is NOT from that day....

The obvious explanation is that your assumption is wrong, and the photograph that was released WAS taken on the day of her disappearance.

 

[10ofRods]

For those who are interested in poking around into possible locations where the Thomases could have stopped, climbed a hill and taken a 360 photo before stopping at Kelbaker/HH, here are some coordinates, with an estimate of how far away from Kelbaker/HH:

34.768525 -115.631748 This is about 300 feet from a trailhead, provides a turnaround for an RV. It's then about 3/4-3/4 of a mile to a granite outcropping that, IMO, would be very hard for most people to climb. 45 degree angle or less. Steep. Granite. Some darker rock. Lots of loose scree, most people trying it would be climbers. The ridge at the top would be about 2000' of elevation gain. Quite the strenuous hike.

34.722238 -115.677195 This is immediately adjacent to the freeway, not filled with lovely vegetation like the Granite Hills hike and the "scenery" would be the freeway.

**Neither of these has a parking lot up the road a ways, such that RT could have pointed to it. IMO

***Further south has no climbable hills, these are steep cliffs (volcanic I think, so slippery). Also it's hotter than anywhere else nearby and lots of black rock (not far from where the Schmeiers died). So, I don't think it's likely they stopped there.

If they got off on the 66, they'd be heading back east, not to Kelbaker and there are no obvious trails, trailheads or parking areas.

Goffs. If they wanted to drive up Old Route 66, and if they stopped to climb hills more than once, Goffs would be a place where it is possible.

Thing is, LE have to know their itinerary. There have been no calls for SAR personnel to go to Goffs (unless they did it top secret? Does that ever happen?) If RT turned his location services and his phone off, right before he got to Kelbaker (where he used it for a call), that's down right suspicious (so I don't think that happened).

Could LE be this slow at organizing the next search site? I think it's unlikely.

There's also the Camino Airstrip area. Maybe they stopped to check it out and climb the low hills nearby? You can google map that one. About half a mile from good parking at the airstrip to the hills - but of course, the airstrip would likely be visible in photos so as would a big stretch of the I-40.

So, I just don't see them pulling off and taking a different 360 picture that shows a completely different location than Kelbaker/HH and LE not calling in at least a few searchers for the stop immediately previous to where the 911 call was located.

It's simple - LE doesn't think the photos will help solve the case. Either they believe she got lost and fell victim to the elements or something nefarious happened or maybe something else that I haven't thought of but the photos and the public are of no help to them.

Except the public can be of help by assisting in the search. I believe LE has made that easy for the public to assist. May give another indication of what LE thinks happened.

I think there are only two possibilities. One of them is exactly as you say about the photos. They think they won't help solve it.

OR, LE already believes that the photos will be given into evidence in future. That showing them would convey something that could compromise either a trial or future investigation.

(Well, there could be a balance between the two I guess).

 

[Nerissa]

The obvious explanation is that your assumption is wrong, and the photograph that was released WAS taken on the day of her disappearance.

OK
But as far as I understand: that picture has not been confirmed by LE as having been taken on that day...correct - ?

If so: why assume it was?

I am assuming it was NOT because LE has not stated it WAS...

JMO

 

[10ofRods]

OK
But as far as I understand: that picture has not been confirmed by LE as having been taken on that day...correct - ?

If so: why assume it was?

I am assuming it was NOT because LE has not stated it WAS...

JMO

Not confirmed.

The reason to say it was taken that day? She's wearing the red/white hat and the black bikini. She's posed in front of rocks that look very similar to the boulders that are about half a mile from the turn out at Kelbaker/HH.

Most people make assumptions on less than that.

 

[Kapua]

Could LE be this slow at organizing the next search site? I think it's unlikely.

Respectfully snipped by me for focus.

I think it's quite possible that LE is waiting for cooler temps to initiate further searches. The last thing they want is to endanger their SAR personnel. MOO

 

[kay74]

Respectfully snipped by me for focus.

I think it's quite possible that LE is waiting for cooler temps to initiate further searches. The last thing they want is to endanger their SAR personnel. MOO

That's exactly my thoughts. It's way too hot to go out there now.

 

[rosesfromangels]

It's simple - LE doesn't think the photos will help solve the case. Either they believe she got lost and fell victim to the elements or something nefarious happened or maybe something else that I haven't thought of but the photos and the public are of no help to them.

Except the public can be of help by assisting in the search. I believe LE has made that easy for the public to assist. May give another indication of what LE thinks happened.

Just speculating, but others have made good points upthread. LE doesn't want to encourage the public to endanger themselves with searches in the unforgiving heat of the desert. They don't want more Victims on their hands is my guess.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[10ofRods]

Respectfully snipped by me for focus.

I think it's quite possible that LE is waiting for cooler temps to initiate further searches. The last thing they want is to endanger their SAR personnel. MOO

I was probably unclear. I meant "if they can see that RT and Barbara stopped someplace besides Kelbaker/HH, they need to organize a search." Next week, the highs out there are coming down to 101, and the overnight/early morning lows are only 68F. That's plenty cool enough for a crack search team of 10-12 people to get out to a yet unsearched spot (such as the spot they've determined the picture was taken, if indeed it was someplace else).

I really don't think they'd wait too much longer for that type of search. A *re-search* of the same area (probably 1-2 square miles, maybe 3 square miles) wouldn't receive the same kind of attention. But if there are tips/clues about a totally new spot (that RT doesn't mention to all of us in the public), it would be a good time to go scope it out.

I do think they'd prioritize such an event, as mid-September is upon us.

 

[Jo in Calif]

Here’s the weather for the Mojave Preserve.mojave preserve weather - Google Search

 

[10ofRods]

Here’s the weather for the Mojave Preserve.mojave preserve weather - Google Search

Even cooler than I thought. Cooler than where I work, actually.

Of course, maybe they are planning something but are trying to keep it down low. But usually if it's a desert recovery search, they try to organize it on the weekends, so that the volunteers can make plans.

Still possible though, we can hope.

 

[Catmommy]

What if the picture isn't time/date stamped and was just something used because it fit the scenario? What if Barbara never disappeared from that location at all? If I was trying to throw someone off the scent I certainly wouldn't have anyone looking where something/someone might be found. I don't know anything. I'm just trying to figure things out like everybody else.

 

[PommyMommy]

Respectfully snipped by me for focus.

I think it's quite possible that LE is waiting for cooler temps to initiate further searches. The last thing they want is to endanger their SAR personnel. MOO

I agree that cooler temps are one consideration but I think the bigger factor is that information has to develop from the investigation that identifies a specific search area. The Mojave is a big place! MOO

 

[TGIRecovered]

What if the picture isn't time/date stamped and was just something used because it fit the scenario? What if Barbara never disappeared from that location at all? If I was trying to throw someone off the scent I certainly wouldn't have anyone looking where something/someone might be found. I don't know anything. I'm just trying to figure things out like everybody else.

If RT was responsible for Brenda’s death and didn’t want to die in prison for murder , getting rid of the body then staging a disappearance might sound like a good way get away with it. Maybe he made a fuss about his wife at a store on the way to the “scene” because he needed be remembered as a traveling couple, not a man alone, who later claims his wife just wandered off while on the trip.
Maybe the pics haven’t been released because they were faked, photoshopped. LE would be wise not to release those pics if they aren’t going to help find Barbara. Otherwise, when the day comes that they can prove who did it, a defense lawyer could use the public release of obviously doctored pics to bolster one of their usual arguments. “ he was tried in the news” or “ he can’t get a fair trial”.
All MOO.

 

[MassGuy]

What if the picture isn't time/date stamped and was just something used because it fit the scenario? What if Barbara never disappeared from that location at all? If I was trying to throw someone off the scent I certainly wouldn't have anyone looking where something/someone might be found. I don't know anything. I'm just trying to figure things out like everybody else.

Exactly. I think Barb wore similar clothing when she hiked, and that photo was put out to represent what people should be looking for.

If that photo was from that day, then why not come out and say that?

This would be so simple if we had any indication that Barb was there, when her husband said she was.

We don’t though.

We have the word of a lone individual, who for some reason, was administered a polygraph.

It’s not hard to read between the lines.

 

[LietKynes]

If RT was responsible for Brenda’s death and didn’t want to die in prison for murder , getting rid of the body then staging a disappearance might sound like a good way get away with it. Maybe he made a fuss about his wife at a store on the way to the “scene” because he needed be remembered as a traveling couple, not a man alone, who later claims his wife just wandered off while on the trip.
Maybe the pics haven’t been released because they were faked, photoshopped. LE would be wise not to release those pics if they aren’t going to help find Barbara. Otherwise, when the day comes that they can prove who did it, a defense lawyer could use the public release of obviously doctored pics to bolster one of their usual arguments. “ he was tried in the news” or “ he can’t get a fair trial”.
All MOO.

BBM
Ita.

Re. the bolded : Exactly why I thought he seemed 'naggy' and also why he sprinted or hurried back to the truck that he'd parked out of view of the gas station.
LE needed to use cadaver dogs on the truck and the fifth wheel. Imo.

 

[Leney]

I agree with you. The picture was circulated so widely on July 12-13

PLUS, the rocks behind her look like the same age, shape and type as the rocks near Kelbaker/HH

there are several right in that vicinity though, so they could have gone to the primitive camp - but that's just a mile away, surely SAR looked there?)

If they paused, opened the awning, had lunch, poured beer into a container, etc., that makes sense to me. However...2 hours is a long time to be out in the heat. Age, weight, dress, hydration, time of day, color of sand - all variables.

SBMFF

They are retired. They were not working within a restricted time frame.
Driving a 5th wheel of that size means that they were not travelling at any speed, probably not even the speed limit.

I do believe they did take a short walk prior, came back and ate a lunch/brunch, then decided to take another leisurely walk.
They are experienced, so I suspect they were well hydrated prior to their walk/hike.
I believe not only are there pictures of her but remnants of their lunch. (plates, glasses,utensils).

What has not been taken into account is that most will stop, rest a few minutes, re-hydrate, perhaps have an energy bar?
I suspect they did once or twice. It would of been at one of these stops were she could of requested her travel mug while she was looking around.

When two individuals have different interests, BT looking for driftwood/rocks, and RT taking pictures, they could of potentially been a distance apart, but still within a comfortable talking/shouting range.

Many have felt she was dehydrated prior to returning and I disagree. I am going on the premise she was in fact quite hydrated.
BT appears fit and could conceivably travell quite a distance. I would not be surprised if she is outside the search area, or the perimeter.