CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #11

[suzyq211]

Did JeM drive all the back to Running Springs to tell his wife JuM that her father was missing and NOT call her on the phone and have her come to the house???

If my father was missing and my husband had been at the house before he was missing, I would expect a phone call, I would expect him to tell me as soon as it happened and i would get in the car and GO TO the place my father was last seen and I would make sure people were out looking for him. I would smack the bejesus out of my husband if he just drove home and TOLD me he had disappeared from the house while he was there that day.

A-YEAH!!!! That whole thing just blows me away! Those are not normal actions!

 

[zwiebel]

The body found in the San Bernadino county desert was not Bob:

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2012/11/todd_hansen_missing_orange_hos.php

 

[GrainneDhu]

Something I forgot about completely but the Brittney Woods case reminded me; do you think all people connected to this case allowed LE access to their cell phone records? Or could LE just pull them without permission? Phone pings would almost certainly help with sorting out who was where, and when. It also might help to see who was calling who, and when. I suppose it's too much to hope for.

One other thing; as JeM seems to have been a bit of a slow worker, and the repairs had been left to the last minute, does anyone think it's possible he may have brought someone along to help? And maybe dropped them off during his morning store trip? That's where a cell phone ping or two might really come in useful. If he did have someone helping him initially, I wouldn't wonder at them keeping quiet, or JeM protecting them, with all the attention that has been generated since.

I am really not sure if anyone could be insane enough to do that though, because how suspicious would that look if LE found out? Unless they are relying on JeM to back them up and explain their innocence, should disclosure become unavoidable.

IMO it's unlikely, I think, but not entirely impossible.

SBM

I think that whatever happened to Bob involved a certain amount of planning in advance. I think pings from all involved parties would be interesting, particularly if one or more phones pinged off the same tower closest to their home from somewhere around 9 am to somewhere around 6 pm.

Because I would never take my cellphone along with me when I was planning to commit a crime. But sometimes a lack of movement is as indicative of guilt as pings coming directly from the scene of the crime.

 

[GrainneDhu]

The body found in the San Bernadino county desert was not Bob:

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2012/11/todd_hansen_missing_orange_hos.php

That is very sad. Poor man. It probably never occurred to him that his disappearance would cause so much worry amongst his friends, family and employer.

 

[zwiebel]

It is very sad. I found it during another search and all I could see initially was the line 'updated, body found San Bernardino...'. For one moment I thought Bob might be coming home.

 

[zwiebel]

I'm still thinking about what I would like to see revealed in disappeared. Most of the things I'd like to know revolve around the CL. It was such a twist of fate that Bob had made a special arrangement for her to come, and had not got around to telling anyone. Just imagine how much more unfathomable that timeline could have been without her.

I'd like to know if she made Bob's unmade bed. If she noticed if all the sheets and usual coverings were still there. If not, did she notice were they in the laundry bin? Was the washer loaded?

If she noticed any repairs in one of the bathrooms - anything replaced, or painted etc. If the floor looked as though it had been recently washed.

If she noticed if the tiled floor in the kitchen, where the phone was kept, had been recently washed.

If she noticed if JeM had a toolbox with him while he was doing the repairs, and if he took it with him when he left, or left it behind in the bathroom because he was coming back the next day.

Anything in the bathroom or kitchen that was missing or had been moved from its usual place. Same goes for wherever Bob stored his paperwork, files and documents.

If she noticed if there was any building waste in JeM's vehicle when he returned to the house.

If Bob ever mentioned to her that many of the items in his house were on loan from his family members.

 

[Angelo]

Informal poll, as it were. What would you most like to learn from the upcoming episode of Disappeared?

I want to see if JeM and JuM cooperated with the Disappeared show. Did JeM clear up the timeline and recount his sighting of the Tahoe for the show?

 

[Angelo]

I'm still thinking about what I would like to see revealed in disappeared. Most of the things I'd like to know revolve around the CL. It was such a twist of fate that Bob had made a special arrangement for her to come, and had not got around to telling anyone. Just imagine how much more unfathomable that timeline could have been without her.

I'd like to know if she made Bob's unmade bed. If she noticed if all the sheets and usual coverings were still there. If not, did she notice were they in the laundry bin? Was the washer loaded?

If she noticed any repairs in one of the bathrooms - anything replaced, or painted etc. If the floor looked as though it had been recently washed.

If she noticed if the tiled floor in the kitchen, where the phone was kept, had been recently washed.

If she noticed if JeM had a toolbox with him while he was doing the repairs, and if he took it with him when he left, or left it behind in the bathroom because he was coming back the next day.

Anything in the bathroom or kitchen that was missing or had been moved from its usual place. Same goes for wherever Bob stored his paperwork, files and documents.

If she noticed if there was any building waste in JeM's vehicle when he returned to the house.

If Bob ever mentioned to her that many of the items in his house were on loan from his family members.

BBM~~~~~

Since the CL was at Mr. Harrod's house on a weekly basis, did she notice anything in the bathroom that needed to be repaired prior to July 27, 2009.

 

[zwiebel]

I want to see if JeM and JuM cooperated with the Disappeared show. Did JeM clear up the timeline and recount his sighting of the Tahoe for the show?

Oh, I really want to see that too, but I thought it so unlikely I didn't even put it on my wishlist.

 

[Seajay]

BBM


He did. JuM did go to the house though. But only to 'change the linens'. And she waited until the next day.

That is not normal behavior for the situation. And the fact they pretty much cleaned out the house of what they wanted also shows they knew he wasn't coming back to have to face over taking his possessions and claiming them as theirs.

 

[Cubby]

BBM


He did. JuM did go to the house though. But only to 'change the linens'. And she waited until the next day.

Respectfully, not only to change the linens. She did give the media interview indicating her dad was missing about noon or one.

So, it appears we have daughter JuM stating her dad was missing about noon or one and her husband, according to Det. Loomis, stated he last saw Bob around 2:30 pm, a few hours AFTER the housekeeper arrived.

Yup.

 

[Cubby]

That is not normal behavior for the situation. And the fact they pretty much cleaned out the house of what they wanted also shows they knew he wasn't coming back to have to face over taking his possessions and claiming them as theirs.

I think she took an inventory which led to the memorabilia list. There is no way someone recalls where all those items are by memory, even though daughter JuM made sure to add that the list was (paraphrased) just from memory or something along those lines.

 

[zwiebel]

Yes Cubby, and they reserved the right to look through the house for anything they might have forgotten - teapot to go with those teacups maybe?

Seajay, have you seen the memorabilia list? Not sure if I can link if for you, but I can tell you where to find it, if you haven't.

 

[zwiebel]

By the way, does anyone have any idea when Bob might have retired? And does the US have a national pension that becomes payable at a certain age, or do you all have to look after yourselves with private plans?

Sorry for asking the obvious again. Please don't tell me every state is different again......

 

[zwiebel]

I am getting too confident. Don't know where I ended up there, but I have found the link now:

CA CA - Bob Harrod-Court Documents No discussion - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

It's the court document link, post 2 by ****** and it is on page 35 (of 40 pages).

 

[zwiebel]

Unless JeM had bought something before he arrived at Bob's house the first time that day. Something he knew he would need but would seem odd or suspicious to Bob if carried into the house at that time.

Like... cleaning supplies?

Another thing for my wishlist on Disappeared; did the CL notice any of Bob's cleaning supplies had been suddenly depleted, or had disappeared?.....unless she brought her own, that would be very unusual over my way, for a domestic cleaner, but it's yet another thing I need advice on.

 

[GrainneDhu]

By the way, does anyone have any idea when Bob might have retired? And does the US have a national pension that becomes payable at a certain age, or do you all have to look after yourselves with private plans?

Sorry for asking the obvious again. Please don't tell me every state is different again......

The US has Social Security, into which people pay throughout their working lives and from which people draw when they are of age and decide to retire (or at age 72, whether or not the person retires). Social Security is pretty bare bones and Bob probably had his own pension plan (which is often referred to as a 401k).

As to how old Bob was when he retired,
it's hard to say. Without looking it up, I'm guessing that he could have qualified for Social Security at age 65 but individuals vary.

If Bob had been employed by the state of California, then he qualified for the California pension plan and my recollection is that it used to be more than adequate.

Bob's decision as to when to retire may also have been influenced by Georgia's health. If she was already experiencing significant health problems, Bob would probably have chosen to retire. He certainly proved that looking after Georgia was a high priority during her life.

 

[zwiebel]

Thanks Grainne,
The only reference I can find is neighbour PE, when he says he believes Bob's wife had been sick for a long time prior to her death. I'm guessing the move to Placentia from Monrovia may have signalled his complete retirement, what do you think?

 

[zwiebel]

Checked. Bob moved 2002. Age 74. Retired before then, surely?

 

[GrainneDhu]

Another thing for my wishlist on Disappeared; did the CL notice any of Bob's cleaning supplies had been suddenly depleted, or had disappeared?.....unless she brought her own, that would be very unusual over my way, for a domestic cleaner, but it's yet another thing I need advice on.

In the US, it depends on the tax code and how meticulously it is followed. To greatly oversimplify the question, there are two main categories of employment: employees and independent contractors. The difference is that employees have their various taxes withheld from each paycheck by the employer and independent contractors are responsible for paying their own taxes. With employees, half the FICA (Federal Insurance Contributions Act which funds Social security) comes out of the employee's paycheck and the employer pays half of the FICA. With independent contractors, the independent contractor is responsible for paying the entire FICA. Additionally, employers must pay unemployment tax for each employee.

In most instances, a worker is an employee and the employer has to pay half their FICA. Of course, it hasn't escaped the attention of business people that hiring independent contractors would save the business money, so there are strict conditions that define an independent contractor vs an employee.

As I recall, an independent contractor sets their own schedule, determines how to complete the work they have been assigned and several other factors but the two I listed are the salient ones for Bob and the CL.

One of the things the worked can do to demonstrate clearly that they determine how to complete the work they have been assigned is to take their own cleaning supplies (which includes things like vacuum cleaners and dusters as well as various cleaning formulas).

All of the above is irrelevant, though. The tax laws about employment and compensation are so convoluted that even lawyers don't always understand them and it is workhorse business section story for some reporter to call the IRS a number of different times and record the different answers they are given (out of 10 calls, there's usually 5-7 different answers).

All that really matters is how things were usually done in Bob's house. If the CL usually brought her own cleaning solutions, etc, then she may not have ever noticed what Bob had on hand. If she usually used cleaning solutions provided by Bob, then I'd be curious about how much was left the week before and if significant/unusual amounts of one or more of those solutions was gone the day Bob disappeared.