CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #5

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  • #361
I saw this video earlier and saw that the floor they got off was 14th and it was green. Then I saw other posts here that showed the 14th floor as brown. I wonder what is going on here.

Sorry, if anybody else said this, but it could be an older video and the hotel could have painted the walls and remodeled a little. The paint and stuff sort of look fresh in the current photos and videos.
 
  • #362
Clearly you have no experience with psychotic people. I have witnessed things in my line of work so bizzare they would blow your mind.

If she's had no past history of bizzare (sic) behavior, it's unlikely that she would exhibit them at that time. Her only symptoms we know are "lying in bed for days on end".
 
  • #363
Here's my translation of a news article from Dushi (Vancouver Chinese news) posted 2nd March 2013 here :

http://www.dushi.ca/tor/news/bencandy.php/fid11/lgngbk/aid95777


"Although the LAPD have not issued any official statements about Elisa Lam's toxicology reports, there have been reports of late claiming that Elisa's body is scheduled for burial on the 9th of this month. Elisa's family have not commented.

Singtao Daily reporters arrived at Elisa's family home on Friday hoping to verify these claims. When Elisa's father answered the door, he declined the opportunity to comment, waving his hands to say no. In addition, Elisa's father appeared to look much thinner and frailer than he did last month in Los Angeles during the press conference, perhaps due to grieving over his daughter's death.

Elisa Lam's family operates a popular restaurant on Hastings Street. Last Friday, it looked like it was still closed for business. Behind the window pane on the front door, a note taped to the window expressed words of gratitude to everyone who has supported the family throughout this difficult period. A basket of flowers sits in front of the front door of the restaurant.

The American Coroner's office have estimated that the results of Elisa's toxicology tests should be available around the middle of next month."


There's another news report here saying a similar thing :

http://www.chinanews.com/hr/2013/03-04/4611383.shtml

Thanks to four_seasons for the links :)
 
  • #364
Respectfully snipped for space and relevance

Hi everyone,
First post. I was so affected by the video the police released the first time I saw it that I started scouring the internet for more information, which led me to this forum and I've been closely following these threads. I have some questions but I'll save them for subsequent posts. Instead I'm going to relate a visit I took to the Cecil last week...

The lobby was brightly lit and ornate, but somewhat empty and I sort of felt my fear grow a bit. On top of it all, I really didn't know what I was looking for, I had no real objective, so I felt foolish just being there. I noted that there was no one behind the large check in counter. To the right there was a bank of computers and two young people were on computers; one looked up when I walked up but then went back to his screen.

I looked to the left and saw the elevators and started walking toward them. The elevators are underneath a Mezzanine and as I approached them a person dressed in a white uniform, perhaps a janitor or service person, came out of a door above me, just as I was passing underneath. The elevator on the left, the one that the video was taken in, was already indicating the "L" for lobby. As I walked up I heard the second elevator land and the second "L" lit up above that elevator (L.L. for those looking for coincidences). I stood there for a moment wondering what to do and then I reached out and hit the up button and the elevator to the right opened up. I thought of waiting for it to close so that I could try to get the other to open but instead I just entered the elevator to the right, turned and faced the buttons, which are on the opposite side as the buttons on the other elevator (judging from the video. The door also opens in the opposite direction).

At this point I thought I might take a quick picture of the buttons with my phone and then hightail it out of there, so I selected the camera on my phone, aimed it, and took a picture, at which point the elevator door closed abruptly, causing a chill to go down my spine. I quickly threw my hand out to push the door open button but even as I did so I felt the elevator lurch into motion and begin ascending. You'll probably find me foolish, but I was freaking out. My mind already so amped up with stories of ghosts and serial killers, it felt to me like the elevator was acting under its own volition.

It stopped suddenly, at the 7th floor. I was in a bit of a panic. I think maybe the door took a bit too long to open and I thought for a second that I was trapped. The seventh floor seemed dimly lit compared to the bright day outside. There was no one there.

I pushed the Lobby button but the door closed and the elevator began ascending again. It stopped a second time, at the tenth floor, and an elderly gentleman entered. He said hello and I responded accordingly as he pushed the Lobby button again. He turned to face the door as it closed.

Thanks for this. One interesting part of your post that I haven't seen anyone mention here is that you were easily able to walk into the hotel, through the lobby, and into the elevator without any trouble at all. So much for that "no visitors" policy! I realize this was during the day, but I still think it's a great example of how easy it could be for someone to just walk right into the hotel off the street. Does that mean this person would kill a guest and hide the body in a water tank? Not necessarily. But who knows...
 
  • #365
I don't recall anyone having posted this here. Sina English reports "Rumor has it a staff member of the hotel was detained on suspiction of killing Lam."

"Rumor has it..." is admittedly very weak. So perhaps we shouldn't put much stock in it, but it's interesting nonetheless. Many people here have suggested staff members and long-term residents were likely suspects.
 
  • #366
Okay, this obviously made it less difficult to get her up there and the hypothesis of her being squeezed into a suitcase, plastic bag or whatever, less unlikely.

Source: http://library.thinkquest.org/04oct/00206/text_ta_time_since_death.htm

Does anyone know to what extent it is going to affect the blood pooling when a corpse is found in water resp. when it has been floating around there for several weeks?

I am wondering this as well.

Investigators normally
will find postmortem lividity,
or blood pooling, on the portion
of the body or head lying on
the bottom after drowning. For
instance, a corpse that ends up
face down should have this
condition evident on the chest,
abdomen, face, or all of those
areas. Typically, lividity is
most evident in the head or
neck because the body normally
assumes a position of
head down, buttocks up, and
extremities dangling downward.
Blood pooling not conforming
to these patterns should alert
authorities to investigate further
to determine if death preceded
immersion.
www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/law-enforcement-bulletin/2006-pdfs/feb06leb.pdf
 
  • #367
Does anyone know to what extent it is going to affect the blood pooling when a corpse is found in water resp. when it has been floating around there for several weeks?

Great find--Bessie's FBI newsletter link has a nice article on drowning victims. Anybody correct me if I read it incorrectly.

But in simple terms, it seems to say that in most deaths by drowning, blood pooling will be in the head and that bruising will become less apparent the longer putrefaction occurs (although it does not state any averages for how long before bruising would disappear from a body that has been decaying for x amount of time).

We don't know from the article how long a body would retain evident bruising or also pooling of blood during the decay process. I hope longer than three weeks in cold water.

From the article, one would think that if pooling is still evident, then the m.e. or coroner should be able to tell whether Elisa Lam died in the water or on land just from the pooling alone assuming that she didn't die upside down on land.
 
  • #368
Hi everyone,
First post. I was so affected by the video the police released the first time I saw it that I started scouring the internet for more information, which led me to this forum and I've been closely following these threads. I have some questions but I'll save them for subsequent posts. Instead I'm going to relate a visit I took to the Cecil last week. My hope is twofold: one, that you might get a bit of an idea about the hotel and two, that perhaps you will get some amusement at my expense, on account of my own fearful nature and suggestive mind, that maybe it will bring a little levity to a thread about a terribly sad tragedy. In no way do I mean any disrespect to Elisa Lam or her family, (I would hope that her family and friends do not read these posts, as on occasion I can't help but feel that some posts might read as insensitive or be otherwise painful).

As I said, I went to the Hotel Cecil a week ago, last week. I live in Los Angeles and I was working one morning last week in downtown. I had been reading these threads and my mind was full of questions about what happened, so after I got off work around lunchtime I decided to walk over to the Cecil being that we were about a block away. My coworkers were going back to work so I was alone.

The first thing I noticed upon walking up was that the building to the north had installed large letters in the sidewalk. These letters were made of a gold metal, and facing perpendicular to the street to alert pedestrians to a large driveway coming out from under the building. They were composed on either side of a single word, capital letters about a foot high spelling the word "DANGER." I couldn't help but wonder how many times Ms. Lam had seen these words and whether they had impressed her in any way.

Before coming to the Cecil itself someone had created a little shrine to Ms. Lam in front of a small tree growing out of a square in the sidewalk. There were dozens of candles in jars, and bouquets of flowers below a Canadian flag, a small placard announcing the intention of the shrine and several pictures of Elisa. I noticed that similar trees were growing in front of the Cecil itself and wondered why the shrine was in front of the adjacent property and not in front of the hotel itself, and whether the hotel had forbidden it being set in front of their property.

I walked up to the entrance of the hotel (past the Stay entrance which I neglected to notice at the time) and into the hotel. I had expected to perhaps be turned away, maybe there would be security, or reporters or something, but other than a young woman on her cell phone out front there was no one else around. I'm somewhat ashamed to admit that I believe in the paranormal and had read all about the past deaths at the hotel, the resident serial killers and whatnot, so as I entered I already felt trepidation. The lobby was brightly lit and ornate, but somewhat empty and I sort of felt my fear grow a bit. On top of it all, I really didn't know what I was looking for, I had no real objective, so I felt foolish just being there. I noted that there was no one behind the large check in counter. To the right there was a bank of computers and two young people were on computers; one looked up when I walked up but then went back to his screen.

I looked to the left and saw the elevators and started walking toward them. The elevators are underneath a Mezzanine and as I approached them a person dressed in a white uniform, perhaps a janitor or service person, came out of a door above me, just as I was passing underneath. The elevator on the left, the one that the video was taken in, was already indicating the "L" for lobby. As I walked up I heard the second elevator land and the second "L" lit up above that elevator (L.L. for those looking for coincidences). I stood there for a moment wondering what to do and then I reached out and hit the up button and the elevator to the right opened up. I thought of waiting for it to close so that I could try to get the other to open but instead I just entered the elevator to the right, turned and faced the buttons, which are on the opposite side as the buttons on the other elevator (judging from the video. The door also opens in the opposite direction).

At this point I thought I might take a quick picture of the buttons with my phone and then hightail it out of there, so I selected the camera on my phone, aimed it, and took a picture, at which point the elevator door closed abruptly, causing a chill to go down my spine. I quickly threw my hand out to push the door open button but even as I did so I felt the elevator lurch into motion and begin ascending. You'll probably find me foolish, but I was freaking out. My mind already so amped up with stories of ghosts and serial killers, it felt to me like the elevator was acting under its own volition.

It stopped suddenly, at the 7th floor. I was in a bit of a panic. I think maybe the door took a bit too long to open and I thought for a second that I was trapped. The seventh floor seemed dimly lit compared to the bright day outside. There was no one there.

I pushed the Lobby button but the door closed and the elevator began ascending again. It stopped a second time, at the tenth floor, and an elderly gentleman entered. He said hello and I responded accordingly as he pushed the Lobby button again. He turned to face the door as it closed.

"What a beautiful day outside," he said.
"Yes, it's really nice today," I said, hoping he wouldn't ask me what I was doing there (I really didn't have an answer) and trying to pretend that I was in a normal state instead of freaked out of my mind.
"So glad we don't have it like they've got it on the east coast," he said.
"Oh, right, yeah, they're having bad weather or something I heard," I said, really not knowing what else to say.
"That global warming's really kicking in," he said as the door opened, offering me a good day and heading out. I followed him out and walked as fast as I could to get out of that building as fast as I could.

I guess the story isn't as funny as I thought, but it amuses me to see how easily I can spook myself.

One more thing. On this forum someone posted a link to a tour of haunted hotels and old main street stories. I ended up going on that, something I would have done regardless had I known about it. So whoever it was that posted it, thank you!

That was me :) Wasn't that the coolest tour? We learned so much about DTLA and it's sordid history.
 
  • #369
Same here. I will believe it when I see a direct source. <modsnip>


The reason it is not found is because the link address is an URL to a different article that was posted by someone on my behalf. The corrected link is

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2013/02/13/lapd-hoping-new-video-will-lead-to-missing-canadian-woman/

According to the Facebook page &#8220;Find Elisa Lam,&#8221; the Vancouver native does not have her glasses with her.


as quoted in news article.
 
  • #370
This is what I meant:

6eca7f2b39cc421192bbef3.jpg


9D7AEF26-9756-46E0-97F7-D247546ADDE0-1447-0000014A87AB2E63_zps52186db7.jpg

Green is from June/July last year, and the brownish colour is from Feb this year. i guess they renovated the floor.
 
  • #371
I am sorry you feel that providing a list of facts and checking them is cavalier; I see it more as logical and basic to any investigation, especially one with so little information presented.

I cannot believe that I am here defending fact checking or sleuthing 101. I am not discounting any social media, but I do take issue when disrespect the information provided by her family for posts on an account that cannot be verified as hers. Why am I being called out for considering that we should check officially released information before making very iffy conclusions from a blog that contradicts what is officially released by police. A lot of potential misinformation is being stated now as fact and no one takes issue with this but me. Do you think an investigator would refer only to a Tumblr account without not first checking out what her family says

This is what is being stated as fact from an unsubstantiated source vs. what her family reports to the police.

EL is taking a drug cocktail for bipolar disorder vs. she has no medical or mental condition

EL missed a plane to California vs. EL habitually traveled Amtrak and public transport

EL was in San Diego until Jan 28th vs. when in fact EL arrived in LA on Jan 26th.

If her blog is so vital to this case here and now then please do tell which Tumblr post tells us why she arrived in LA on the 26 th? EL checked into the Cecil on Jan 28th. Where did she sleep for 2 nights? Maybe she was hallucinating and slept on a park bench?

Sorry that was quite a tangent but had to say it; I do not deserve the snarky comments.

I think the comment was only referring to the glasses thing and how the linked article (which you referred us to by saying to check the list of links for reference) had nothing about glasses in it. I still think the other article you linked with reference to not having her glasses with her is JUST saying that she didn't have them with her at the time of her disappearance, not that she left them in Vancouver entirely. That would be pertinent for a missing person report since the photographs released with that info do show her with glasses, so they wanted people to be on the lookout for her without them as well.
 
  • #372
Respectfully snipped for space and relevance



Thanks for this. One interesting part of your post that I haven't seen anyone mention here is that you were easily able to walk into the hotel, through the lobby, and into the elevator without any trouble at all. So much for that "no visitors" policy! I realize this was during the day, but I still think it's a great example of how easy it could be for someone to just walk right into the hotel off the street. Does that mean this person would kill a guest and hide the body in a water tank? Not necessarily. But who knows...

My brother and I will be downtown in the next month or so. We will go in and see just how far we can get. We are in our late 40s and 50s so we will not come off as some young thrill seekers, lol!
 
  • #373
I've been following this story from the beginning, and participating in this forum and others.

I have not seen one credible statement that Elisa Lam left her glasses in Vancouver or at home.
 
  • #374
My brother and I will be downtown in the next month or so. We will go in and see just how far we can get.

That is good. Although, please edit that bit out that describes you so they don't know who to be on the lookout for. The hotel employees might read this site.

If you go, please try to ride the elevator up away from the lobby and when the doors open, hit the DOOR HOLD button. I would like to know if the elevator makes chiming sounds while the door is in the held open state or if it is quiet.

And take a picture of the door that leads to the roof if you could get that far in the building. Especially get a picture of the locking mechanism.
 
  • #375
You've mistaken his conclusion. He said that it's nearly impossible to carry 115lbs on a wall ladder, not the one beside the water tanks. He said the tight space and the pipes actually lends itself better to carry a body up the water tank.

"Hiding in a water tank from a threat" is idiotic, even if you are psychotic. Has she ever "hidden" in weird places before? Has she had a past history of doing moronic things? Other than the reason, "she's crazy, therefore she'll do stupid things that I wouldn't do", why would you hide in a water tank? Why not hide in your room? Or the lobby? Or scream at the top of your lungs down the hallway? Maybe she was on the roof already and was in danger - so instead of heading for the 3 fire escapes or the rooftop door, she heads for the water tanks knowing there's a ladder for her to climb, knowing the lid is unlocked, and thinking that she'll be able to get out again, or that she wouldn't drown. It puts you at more danger, because you've trapped yourself. I would rank suicide as more likely.

Getting back to the ladder and the dead weight - what if someone had a backpack that weighed 120lbs? Since the weight is evenly distributed, and you have both hands, wouldn't it be possible to carry someone up a wall ladder?

JMO, but think even a very strong man accustomed to carrying weight on ladders, could descend with a body - but not ascend, as the shoulder muscles and the arms that must lift one at a time to climb, would be too constricted.
From the top of my head thinking - I wonder if say, a heavy rock/or whatever,high up, could be tied to a rope and attached to a body below,that has been sheathed in slippery material, garbage bag,sheet? and with a push of the rock - body is hoisted/slid up pulley style?
 
  • #376
That is good. Although, please edit that bit out that describes you so they don't know who to be on the lookout for. The hotel employees might read this site.

If you go, please try to ride the elevator up away from the lobby and when the doors open, hit the DOOR HOLD button. I would like to know if the elevator makes chiming sounds while the door is in the held open state or if it is quiet.

And take a picture of the door that leads to the roof if you could get that far in the building. Especially get a picture of the locking mechanism.

There is a video of people testing the exact elevator that EL was in and testing the door hold button too. It's a Chinese video. I've posted it here a few times.
 
  • #377
So here are my questions and comments:
1. I am pretty sure that I read something about some kind of common rooms on the 14th floor. I thought I saw them in one of the pictures reprinted from one of the Chinese websites, but when I went to look I couldn't find them. Am I wrong about this? If there is such a thing is it possible that Stay guests are told they can go to the 14th floor to use the common rooms, perhaps as a way to see a high skyline view of the city (being as people are not supposed to go on the roof?)
2. My brother was a graffiti artist years ago and I can add to the voices discounting the graffiti. That is definitely the names of a graffiti crew. Often one will write all of the names of the others in attendance, which will explain why there are two different writers (one tagged one set and another the other set). It's also possible that "Fecto" might also use the alternate spelling "Fekto" or that one of his friends got it wrong. (I'm a little shocked that a graffiti artist would use the name C***, but... ::shrug::)
3. Someone mentioned the mirror opposite the elevators and noted that it looked like Elisa was looking at herself in the mirror. This makes sense to me, it explains what she was doing with her arm up for such a long time, perhaps adjusting her hair).
4. As to Futzbucket's scenario: Here's something I thought of that would call that theory into question: If the fellow is standing to her left to avoid being seen on camera that puts him directly in front of the other elevator. If that elevator were to open for some reason he would then be seen by the other camera.

That's it for now.

The Stay has a lounge on the 6th floor. However, does anyone have documentation showing she was booked into a room on the 4th floor? according to SMeinzer, he stayed at the Stay and they tried to give him a room on the 14th floor. They originally thought he booked a single room, when in fact he booked a double . According to his post, once he mentioned that in fact it was a double he needed they switched his room back to the 4th floor. I also recall reading a few reviews were this switch happened. I've been reading on here that she had a room on 4 , have asked numerous times for any link to prove that but have yet to see one that verifies she was staying on 4 not 14 or any other floor for that matter.

Also, thanks for clarifying the graffiti, tried to say the exact thing in a previous thread but it's nice to have a 2nd person back this up. I think it's sometimes difficult for people not into graffiti or tagging to get the part about you being in a crew and that you tag everyone there and which crew/neighborhood/gang, if any you are with.


Can someone please post a link showing she was definitely booked into a room on 4??
 
  • #378
I wonder if say, a heavy rock/or whatever,high up, could be tied to a rope and attached to a body below,that has been sheathed in slippery material, garbage bag,sheet? and with a push of the rock - body is hoisted/slid up pulley style?

You are making me think of Archimedes pulling the ship to harbor. And then that there must be some old MacGyver (sp?) episode like this.
 
  • #379
Wouldn't it be also possible (since every floor is triplicate) that these pictures show two different 14th floors? Am not sure whether this has been discussed before.
 
  • #380
There is a video of people testing the exact elevator that EL was in and testing the door hold button too. It's a Chinese video. I've posted it here a few times.

Thank you!!!

I found your link to that video. It is awesome. Just perfect. Totally answers my question.
 
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