GUILTY CA - Ellorah Warner, 3 wks, Santa Clarita, 23 Jan 2015

[southsleuth]

No words. Sperm donor isn't even close to human.

 

[bluenoser]

Does meth really cause people to do such things? Or would the 'idea' have already been there in his sick mind?

 

[nikb]

I could not agree more. I was awaiting Mod approval to share that image on the thread, having found it before MSM released it.

Seeing her, eyes wide open and alert, looking up into the light of the toy giraffe, a sparkle in her eye, she looked just like an angel on earth. <snipped for space>

:tears:

But at this moment, my mind can't escape the crimes against her - what torture was committed before her soul left this real and she actually crossed over into the light. It breaks me that she's a true Forever Angel after just 19 days! Then it starts all over again, the anger, the tears, the physical reactions to what was done, it's this continuous feed of fury, disgust and pain. I can only imagine what her own mom & grandmother are going through right now - as her vigil starts in less than an hour! <snipped for space>

That's the one. Thanks for posting it. She is so tiny, innocent, beautiful, I just... there are no words. Her poor family. If several of us feel this horrible and didn't even know her, my heart absolutely breaks for her Mom and grandma.

 

[nikb]

Does meth really cause people to do such things? Or would the 'idea' have already been there in his sick mind?

I tend to think the thought already had to be there, at least to some degree. Maybe he wouldn't have acted on it without the drugs, and meth users can do some bad things, but certainly not all meth users do things this despicable.

 

[kaen]

I think I am reading the statute right about capital murder in CA. It must be murder with special circumstances.

Including:
2.1. Murder carried out for financial gain
2.2. Prior murder conviction
2.3. Multiple murder convictions
2.4. Murder by bomb or destructive device
2.5. Preventing arrest or escaping
2.6. Murder of a police officer, federal agent, or firefighter
2.7. Murder of a witness
2.8. Murder of a prosecutor, judge, government official,
or juror
2.9. Lying in wait
2.10. Murder because of race, religion, or nationality
2.11. Murder in commission of a felony
2.12. Murder involving torture
2.13. Murder by poison
2.14. Drive-by shootings
2.15. Murder by a street gang member

The charges included torture so maybe they will try and make it capital but need the tox. evidence before they can get there. See the torture conditions below-

2.12. Murder involving torture

Murder that involves the infliction of torture -- extreme pain and suffering -- is also special circumstances murder punishable by death or life without parole.73

Here are the factors that need to be proven for this special circumstance to apply:

The defendants need to have intended to kill the victim (accidental or negligent killing won't count);
The defendant needs to have intended to inflict extreme physical pain on the victim while that person was still alive, for any reason (revenge, extortion, etc.); AND
The defendant needs to have performed an act that would inflict extreme physical pain on the victim.74
Interestingly, for torture-murders committed on or after June 6, 1990, it's not required that the victim actually feel the pain...it's enough for the defendant to intend to inflict pain and take some action to inflict pain.75 But for murders committed before that date, it IS required that the victim actually suffer pain.76

http://www.shouselaw.com/special-circumstances-murder-california.html

 

[Bayou Mistress]

Does meth really cause people to do such things? Or would the 'idea' have already been there in his sick mind?

What Are the Effects of Methamphetamine Abuse?

Long term effects of methamphetamine use may include:

addiction
psychosis, including:
paranoia
hallucinations
repetitive motor activity
changes in brain structure and function
memory loss
aggressive or violent behavior
mood disturbances
severe dental problems
weight loss

http://www.timberlineknolls.com/drug-addiction/meth/signs-effects

 

[Bayou Mistress]

http://www.drugfreeworld.org/drugfacts/crystalmeth/the-stages-of-the-meth-experience.html

4) Tweaking&#8212;A methamphetamine abuser is most dangerous when experiencing a phase of the addiction called &#8220;tweaking&#8221;&#8212;a condition reached at the end of a drug binge when methamphetamine no longer provides a rush or a high. Unable to relieve the horrible feelings of emptiness and craving, an abuser loses his sense of identity. Intense itching is common and a user can become convinced that bugs are crawling under his skin. Unable to sleep for days at a time, the abuser is often in a completely psychotic state and he exists in his own world, seeing and hearing things that no one else can perceive. His hallucinations are so vivid that they seem real and, disconnected from reality, he can become hostile and dangerous to himself and others. The potential for self-mutilation is high.

 

[MSNurse]

Those who are not WSers may not understand, regardless of gender :moo:

Our partners, family members, friends and loved ones who don't share our passion for the victims of crime, the missing, the voiceless who populate the literally countless threads here, may find it hard to comprehend what draws us to these cases - what drives us to continue on when we encounter one heartbreak after another.

I am often unable to explain it myself.

I've said before that these past few months have been unusually brutal - at least it seems that way. I've been here for a few years, after lurking for a while, becoming official after a The HinkyMeter went offline. Websleuths became my new home.

I don't know why, but the cases seem to be getting ..... worse. I'm sure there's a better word for it, but I'm at a loss right now. As a victim of more than one instance of crime myself, a student of forensic psychology, a healthcare professional, a mandated reporter, a mother, and just a human being, I feel a sense of overwhelming duty to lend my voice to these cases. Each WSer's perspective is SO important, offering a thread that weaves a quilt of care, understanding, and knowledge. We join forces in an effort to bring truth and justice for all victims and to bring the missing home.

It's a calling that does not touch everyone. However, I am thankful for the fellowship of my cohort of WSers, especially when trying to process the insanity of a case like this one. I am leaning on you all, while weeping on your shoulders through the interwebs.

:grouphug:

#JusticeForEllorah

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I admire your ability to come back time and time again...
I have been on WS for just under a year. While trying to offer hope for friends and families of those missing or justice for those found deceased at the hands of criminals, WS has taught me a lot. I keep in better touch with my husband. I watch out for my neighbors a little closer. I am a little more of a mother hen. I keep my guard up when out at night alone. It has made me cautious. The brutality of some of these cases has helped me better protect myself, friends, and family.

But this...this case has kind of sealed the deal that I need a break from WS. I am in healthcare. I've seen the sick, dead, abused, traumatic, psychotic, happy, sad...you name it. But never have I seen a man show such love towards an innocent, helpless newborn....only to take her life in the way he did just a day or so later. I am physically ill and can't get the image of that beautiful, sleeping baby lying on his chest...feeling such comfort and protection...out of my mind.

I am glad there are people like you that can continue on here...
I just don't think I can.

IMO

 

[Portabella]

To face him about it?

Yup he would see my face. I would have nothing left to live for.... and three hots and a cot for the rest of my days would not be so bad.... This man does not deserve to live... I wish the death penalty was on the table, or that he could be housed in another country where the prisons are true hell. I cannot tell you how strongly I feel when it comes to crimes against children, and this one takes the cake. I was telling my boys about it at supper and I truly am very angry.... on so many levels. IMHO

 

[MsFacetious]

I think I am reading the statute right about capital murder in CA. It must be murder with special circumstances.

Including:
2.1. Murder carried out for financial gain
2.2. Prior murder conviction
2.3. Multiple murder convictions
2.4. Murder by bomb or destructive device
2.5. Preventing arrest or escaping
2.6. Murder of a police officer, federal agent, or firefighter
2.7. Murder of a witness
2.8. Murder of a prosecutor, judge, government official,
or juror
2.9. Lying in wait
2.10. Murder because of race, religion, or nationality
2.11. Murder in commission of a felony
2.12. Murder involving torture
2.13. Murder by poison
2.14. Drive-by shootings
2.15. Murder by a street gang member

The charges included torture so maybe they will try and make it capital but need the tox. evidence before they can get there. See the torture conditions below-

2.12. Murder involving torture

Murder that involves the infliction of torture -- extreme pain and suffering -- is also special circumstances murder punishable by death or life without parole.73

Here are the factors that need to be proven for this special circumstance to apply:

The defendants need to have intended to kill the victim (accidental or negligent killing won't count);
The defendant needs to have intended to inflict extreme physical pain on the victim while that person was still alive, for any reason (revenge, extortion, etc.); AND
The defendant needs to have performed an act that would inflict extreme physical pain on the victim.74
Interestingly, for torture-murders committed on or after June 6, 1990, it's not required that the victim actually feel the pain...it's enough for the defendant to intend to inflict pain and take some action to inflict pain.75 But for murders committed before that date, it IS required that the victim actually suffer pain.76

http://www.shouselaw.com/special-circumstances-murder-california.html

So if he accidentally smothered her while sexually assaulting her, that wouldn't count as intentional murder.
If that is the cause of death it will likely explain why he won't face the death penalty.
There was another case like that before on Websleuths. :twocents:

My question is are the two sexual assault charges for the same thing?
Can sexual assault on a child apply also to the oral charge...
Or does this mean he also assaulted her a second way?
Surely that would count as torture... lease:

 

[TTF14]

Those who are not WSers may not understand, regardless of gender :moo:

Our partners, family members, friends and loved ones who don't share our passion for the victims of crime, the missing, the voiceless who populate the literally countless threads here, may find it hard to comprehend what draws us to these cases - what drives us to continue on when we encounter one heartbreak after another.

I am often unable to explain it myself.

I've said before that these past few months have been unusually brutal - at least it seems that way. I've been here for a few years, after lurking for a while, becoming official after a The HinkyMeter went offline. Websleuths became my new home.

I don't know why, but the cases seem to be getting ..... worse. I'm sure there's a better word for it, but I'm at a loss right now. As a victim of more than one instance of crime myself, a student of forensic psychology, a healthcare professional, a mandated reporter, a mother, and just a human being, I feel a sense of overwhelming duty to lend my voice to these cases. Each WSer's perspective is SO important, offering a thread that weaves a quilt of care, understanding, and knowledge. We join forces in an effort to bring truth and justice for all victims and to bring the missing home.

It's a calling that does not touch everyone. However, I am thankful for the fellowship of my cohort of WSers, especially when trying to process the insanity of a case like this one. I am leaning on you all, while weeping on your shoulders through the interwebs.

:grouphug:

#JusticeForEllorah







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So beautiful. I think you need to make a version of your last sentence your signature line. (This is in no means to criticize your current signature, if you have one, as I'm not looking at it! )

 

[Portabella]

Does meth really cause people to do such things? Or would the 'idea' have already been there in his sick mind?

We have a major Meth problem in my county, I have worked with many many over the years, I have never had any have sexual offenses against their children if they were no pedophiles. They may get aggressive with their mate, or with a date. They would be more apt to lock a child in a room, or give a child a beating IMHO.

 

[abugs]

Just saw a pic posted on FB on our local news of all the news trucks lined up at the park waiting for the vigil tonight. I hope this brings the Mom some sort of peace. I don't even know how she can put one foot in front of the other right now.

 

[abugs]

http://www.hometownstation.com/sant...all-baby-charged-with-murder-sex-crime-120035

KHTS AM-1220 tried to obtain a copy of the 911 call in connection with the incident, and Sheriff&#8217;s Station officials said no call was placed based on their records.

 

[perfectingpink]

So if he accidentally smothered her while sexually assaulting her, that wouldn't count as intentional murder.
If that is the cause of death it will likely explain why he won't face the death penalty.
There was another case like that before on Websleuths. :twocents:

My question is are the two sexual assault charges for the same thing?
Can sexual assault on a child apply also to the oral charge...
Or does this mean he also assaulted her a second way?
Surely that would count as torture... lease:

I am sorry to be a little graphic here, but penetration of a 3 week old infant would likely kill her and I would think it would fall under torture. How depraved is someone to do this to a baby let alone their OWN baby?

 

[kaen]

So if he accidentally smothered her while sexually assaulting her, that wouldn't count as intentional murder.
If that is the cause of death it will likely explain why he won't face the death penalty.
There was another case like that before on Websleuths. :twocents:

My question is are the two sexual assault charges for the same thing?
Can sexual assault on a child apply also to the oral charge...
Or does this mean he also assaulted her a second way?
Surely that would count as torture... lease:

"Matthew Brendan Warner, 30, faces one count each of murder, assault on a child causing death, torture, oral copulation or sexual penetration with a child 10 years or younger and aggravated sexual assault of a child, the Los Angeles District Attorney’s Office said."
CBS local news

Maybe that is why the torture is in there.

 

[Portabella]

So if he accidentally smothered her while sexually assaulting her, that wouldn't count as intentional murder.
If that is the cause of death it will likely explain why he won't face the death penalty.
There was another case like that before on Websleuths. :twocents:

My question is are the two sexual assault charges for the same thing?
Can sexual assault on a child apply also to the oral charge...
Or does this mean he also assaulted her a second way?
Surely that would count as torture... lease:

As defined here it could be either ...or....
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=pen&group=00001-01000&file=261-269

but with the torture, I don't even want to say it, but I fear the worst....that poor baby.

 

[branwynbreeze]

Just saw a pic posted on FB on our local news of all the news trucks lined up at the park waiting for the vigil tonight. I hope this brings the Mom some sort of peace. I don't even know how she can put one foot in front of the other right now.

I considered attending, but after latest details, I just can't.

 

[abugs]

That is how I feel as well. I am already trying to shield my own kids from these details and I would have had to bring them.

 

[tlcya]

http://www.hometownstation.com/sant...all-baby-charged-with-murder-sex-crime-120035

KHTS AM-1220 tried to obtain a copy of the 911 call in connection with the incident, and Sheriff&#8217;s Station officials said no call was placed based on their records.

Interesting since Lt Francisco is on camera confirming a call to police placed by the grandmother several hours before the couple showed up to report Ellorah missing at the station. She was very non specific as to the call's content and referred to it as "unrelated" to the murder of this baby.

Is the Sheriff's department circling the wagons? Are they concerned about a civil suit? Or protecting the integrity of their case against Warner? Time will tell.