CA CA - Ember Graham, 7 mos, Happy Valley, 2 Jul 2015 - #3

[Cubby]

I am one of those who would not like to think Ember was purposely harmed but I am willing to believe it and would not be surprised. I was leaning towards accidental because if he couldn't take the burden - he could have easily given her back but maybe he wasn't thinking that way or lashed out in anger. When he fled, I started to think in the direction you are going.

There is really no logical or rational thinking with an addict. It could have been an accident, anger, neglect. I don't think we could know without an autopsy, if she is deceased and is found in time for a coroner to find a COD.

 

[Cubby]

Cannabis wouldn't have killed Ember. Even if it's in the form of wax. Cannabanoids don't act in the same way as opiates. They latch on to a different receptor and that receptor doesn't affect respiration or heart activity. To overdose potentially on cannabis, you need to overdose by 40,000 times the acceptable amount. Cannabanoids are proven to have medicinal values. In fact there are children who are being treated for seizures with cannabis oil prescribed by physicians.

While MG may have believed cannabis oil was going to help Ember, she would have had to drink litres of the stuff to be in any danger of death by overdose.

Shaken baby syndrome, smothering, death from a seizure, SIDS, even being beaten to death is much more likely than cannabis overdose. I'm not defending MG, however while giving Ember wax may be highly illegal it wouldn't kill her.

My best guess is she succumbed to heat stroke, if she is no longer with us, as a result of neglect.

 

[La Louve]

Jenny Espino ‏@jennyespino_RS 47m47 minutes ago
You know how #BabyEmber's grandfather talks abt hot tip in Oregon? It was never a lead: https://www.facebook.com/FindBabyEmber/posts/146371602360494 …
http://www.redding.com/news/local-n...stands-behind-son-on-baby-ember-case_70139852 …

https://twitter.com/jennyespino_RS/with_replies

and on the Find Baby Ember FB page, the cousin's girlfriend is seemingly contradicting the report about it not being a lead. The same one who said she saw MG with Ember on the evening before she was reported missing.

 

[katydid23]

and on the Find Baby Ember FB page, the cousin's girlfriend is seemingly contradicting the report about it not being a lead. The same one who said she saw MG with Ember on the evening before she was reported missing.

I have mentally discounted that sighting as being unreliable. I don't trust her version of events right now. :no:

 

[La Louve]

Most people seem to want to believe that MG was this poor addict and the child 'accidentally' died while in his care. They don't want to believe something perhaps more insidious.

I go back to the seizures. I wonder if that poor baby had an undiagnosed (unproven) case of Shaken Baby Syndrome. I wonder if he couldn't handle her crying and his lack of sleep. I think it's possible he abused this poor baby. He was left alone with her, and I think he couldn't handle it and did something out of frustrated anger. I also think they would be able to tell this if, and hopefully when, they find her. I think MG knew this and would rather die than to live being thought of as a baby killer.

http://kidshealth.org/parent/medical/brain/shaken.html#

I don't necessarily want to believe anything in particular. And it certainly won't hurt my feelings if it is somehow proven that MG killed Ember intentionally. I'm not trying to protect his memory or defend him.

But if he was high on wax he easily could've been distracted and lost track of the time and something bad happened to Ember during that time. Admitting he was using drugs at all would be a parole violation again.

Interesting thought that her seizures might've been a result of being shaken. I've been going on the assumption that his drug use caused a birth defect. Not sure if she was born with the seizures of if they came on later in her young life.

 

[La Louve]

I have mentally discounted that sighting as being unreliable. I don't trust her version of events right now. :no:

Oh I don't trust her either. I just thought her posts on that FB were interesting given her previous involvement in this case. Methinks she likes the spotlight.

 

[PLT]

Cannabis wouldn't have killed Ember. Even if it's in the form of wax. Cannabanoids don't act in the same way as opiates. They latch on to a different receptor and that receptor doesn't affect respiration or heart activity. To overdose potentially on cannabis, you need to overdose by 40,000 times the acceptable amount. Cannabanoids are proven to have medicinal values. In fact there are children who are being treated for seizures with cannabis oil prescribed by physicians.

While MG may have believed cannabis oil was going to help Ember, she would have had to drink litres of the stuff to be in any danger of death by overdose.

Shaken baby syndrome, smothering, death from a seizure, SIDS, even being beaten to death is much more likely than cannabis overdose. I'm not defending MG, however while giving Ember wax may be highly illegal it wouldn't kill her.

Very informative! Babies are very resilient in general and can survive falls, some drops, etc. so for those that do not believe she was taken....what is left .....abuse, heat fatality and seizure. If it was the latter, I think there would be absolutely no reason at all to panic and attempt to cover it up. Ember had a medical history of seizures and I doubt MG would be in any trouble at all if that was the case.

I'm hoping they can recover her but keep checking and have not heard any updates except one dispelling rumors that she has been found. The Sheriff says he doesn't have anyone actively searching for Ember. Does this mean he's done with the case and the only ones searching are volunteers at this point?

http://www.redding.com/news/local-news/sheriff-rumors-baby-ember-grahams-body-found-are-false

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

I think as long as she was with MG - it could have been a hotel, landfill...anywhere. For some reason....."this was her king and the queen's job is to protect her king".... as it states on SM.

Here's a thought I just had about the trailer arrangement - I had been thinking that maybe the goal was to live there and save up some money to move. (According to MGs post, they had lost their prior residence right before Ember's birth. ) But maybe it was a test of sorts to make sure MG had changed his ways? If he had been promising to change and that he was now ready for a family....maybe the move was a way to confirm and decide if she would stay or divorce? Then with the move upon him the next day, he felt trapped and on edge. I guess it doesn't matter at this point but if JG is ever interviewed - I would be interested in hearing what she had to say about all of this.

If I wanted to win my baby girl and wife back, I'd already have a job and money saved up for a better place than what Ember was left in. Moving back in with your husband with the same problems wasn't going to make life any better.

If Ember's death was an accident or an unintentional act, then the most he would of been charged with would an abuse of a corpse and making a false claim about her being taken in the night I think. I'd think his mother could of told him that's what happens in most cases. So, maybe whatever happened to her was violent and he didn't want people to find that out how bad he hurt her.

 

[Cubby]

I don't necessarily want to believe anything in particular. And it certainly won't hurt my feelings if it is somehow proven that MG killed Ember intentionally. I'm not trying to protect his memory or defend him.

But if he was high on wax he easily could've been distracted and lost track of the time and something bad happened to Ember during that time. Admitting he was using drugs at all would be a parole violation again.

Interesting thought that her seizures might've been a result of being shaken. I've been going on the assumption that his drug use caused a birth defect. Not sure if she was born with the seizures of if they came on later in her young life.

I don't know of any situations where a males drug use caused a birth defect. I've read mj use decreases sperm count, but IRL I haven't seen any situations where the use of mj caused fertility issues.

I knew one chronic pothead who fathered a child after more than 20 years of pot use and his child is an honors student.

 

[MyBelle]

Cannabis wouldn't have killed Ember. Even if it's in the form of wax. Cannabanoids don't act in the same way as opiates. They latch on to a different receptor and that receptor doesn't affect respiration or heart activity. To overdose potentially on cannabis, you need to overdose by 40,000 times the acceptable amount. Cannabanoids are proven to have medicinal values. In fact there are children who are being treated for seizures with cannabis oil prescribed by physicians.

While MG may have believed cannabis oil was going to help Ember, she would have had to drink litres of the stuff to be in any danger of death by overdose.

Shaken baby syndrome, smothering, death from a seizure, SIDS, even being beaten to death is much more likely than cannabis overdose. I'm not defending MG, however while giving Ember wax may be highly illegal it wouldn't kill her.

Would there be any adverse reaction to mixing the cannabis oil with Ember's prescription medications? If she had died of a seizure there would be no need to hide her body. I think the hiding of the body is because the cause of her death can be directly tied to him. Even shaking baby syndrome on autopsy can show whether there was a history or just recent and the child had been in the care of her mother.

JMO

 

[Cubby]

Very informative! Babies are very resilient in general and can survive falls, some drops, etc. so for those that do not believe she was taken....what is left .....abuse, heat fatality and seizure. If it was the latter, I think there would be absolutely no reason at all to panic and attempt to cover it up. Ember had a medical history of seizures and I doubt MG would be in any trouble at all if that was the case.

I'm hoping they can recover her but keep checking and have not heard any updates except one dispelling rumors that she has been found. The Sheriff says he doesn't have anyone actively searching for Ember. Does this mean he's done with the case and the only ones searching are volunteers at this point?

http://www.redding.com/news/local-news/sheriff-rumors-baby-ember-grahams-body-found-are-false

If anything happened to a child when their caregiver was under the influence, accident or not, the caregiver would be in some serious trouble. MG would have had to be clean and pass a drug test to not have been in any trouble if an accident occured and he knew, as we do, that wasn't going to happen.

 

[MyBelle]

Sadly, we are also going through this with my 35 year old brother right now. His addictions have hurt everyone in his path. He was once such a smart, hardworking, loyal and sweet guy. Now, he is an unstable, unreliable, and volatile mess. His wife and 2 kids (6 & 8 yrs old) have been living with my mom since the oldest was born. My mom is the biggest enabler I've ever seen. I know she means well, but she continues to live in denial about how much this is hurting our family. It's hard for me to go to visit my mom bc I don't want to expose my daughter to the energy and vibes there. Even though my brother is upstairs locked in his room wasted most of the time...you can still feel something is off. Just a constant dark cloud. He will not change unless my mom puts her foot down, and makes him take responsibility for his actions. However, she argues that she wants them to live with her for the sake of the children. She is so scared of their well-being. Such a sad cycle. Addiction plagues so many of us...one way or another. Cubby's post was amazing- and it really hit home for me. Especially the part about ADDICTION, ENABLING, and DENIAL being so dangerous.

There is something YOU can do and that is contact CPS. They will force the parents to clean up and can also force them to move out and leave the kids with your mother. There are millions of grandparents, aunts, uncles raising grandkids these days because the parents can't or won't do it because of drug addiction.

JMO

 

[blefuscu]

Would there be any adverse reaction to mixing the cannabis oil with Ember's prescription medications? If she had died of a seizure there would be no need to hide her body. I think the hiding of the body is because the cause of her death can be directly tied to him. Even shaking baby syndrome on autopsy can show whether there was a history or just recent and the child had been in the care of her mother.

JMO

The oil wouldn't adversely react to seizure meds. She likely would have been ultra calm from the effects of both but no, not to the point of killing her. Obviously all doctors would say "don't mix the two" but they work entirely differently. I also wouldn't recommend giving anyone cannabis oil unless prescribed by a doctor (or if you are old enough to decide these things for yourself) but the medical researchers are finding that cannabis oil and cannabanoids have so many medical benefits in many illnesses including epilepsy, fibromyalgia, MS, chronic pain syndrome, anxiety disorders, cancer pain, arthritic pains etc.

 

[KinderedSpirits]

BBM. Them? Are your brother's children living with him and your mother?

She has been supporting them since my oldest nephew was born 8 years ago!!! My brother, His wife, and 2 kids live with her. In fact, my brother has always had it easy because he has always worked for my mom's construction company. My sister-in-law (who is not an addict, but is definitely an unstable and insecure mess) doesn't work! I know- it's a mess!! My mom is so desperate, and has been begging for help to figure out a solution... after all these years!

ETA- I guess I'm saying all this, bc my brother's life could have easily paralleled
what became of MG's, if it wasn't for my mom covering his a*s. But enabling is not the answer no matter what, and it comes at a heavy price!

 

[blefuscu]

If anything happened to a child when their caregiver was under the influence, accident or not, the caregiver would be in some serious trouble. MG would have had to be clean and pass a drug test to not have been in any trouble if an accident occured and he knew, as we do, that wasn't going to happen.

I totally agree with you. While giving cannabis oil directly to Ember may not have hurt her, there is nothing to say that MG being stoned wasn't damaging to her. He may have dropped her or shook her or anything. He shouldn't have been stoned and/or using with Ember in his care. For me that's as bad as being drunk with children around you. Neither state enables a parent to properly supervise and care for a child. (Spoken as an ex alcoholic who has nearly 6 years sober)

 

[MyBelle]

She has been supporting them since my oldest nephew was born 8 years ago!!! My brother, His wife, and 2 kids live with her. In fact, my brother has always had it easy because he has always worked for my mom's construction company. My sister-in-law (who is not an addict, but is definitely an unstable and insecure mess) doesn't work! I know- it's a mess!! My mom is so desperate, and has been begging for help to figure out a solution... after all these years!

Who has your mother been begging? She has to reach out for the resources, they won't come to her. Emotional abuse is just as harmful as physical abuse and if neither your mother nor SIL are willing to reach out, report them to CPS.

JMO

 

[PLT]

If anything happened to a child when their caregiver was under the influence, accident or not, the caregiver would be in some serious trouble. MG would have had to be clean and pass a drug test to not have been in any trouble if an accident occured and he knew, as we do, that wasn't going to happen.

So if she had a fatal seizure like I stated....(and not an accident)....and the seizure caused her death....which could be proven medically, MG would be at fault for her death because he was high? I can see him getting ramifications/charges for drug use around a minor, etc. ...but if COD was seizure that is very interesting that it would carry heavy jail time. And to think Casey Anthony walks free.

 

[MyBelle]

The oil wouldn't adversely react to seizure meds. She likely would have been ultra calm from the effects of both but no, not to the point of killing her. Obviously all doctors would say "don't mix the two" but they work entirely differently. I also wouldn't recommend giving anyone cannabis oil unless prescribed by a doctor (or if you are old enough to decide these things for yourself) but the medical researchers are finding that cannabis oil and cannabanoids have so many medical benefits in many illnesses including epilepsy, fibromyalgia, MS, chronic pain syndrome, anxiety disorders, cancer pain, arthritic pains etc.

I know zip about cannabis oil or marijuana but my daughter had three very severe seizures while pregnant and the neurologist did mention it to her. Fortunately, she has had no seizures since then but I was curious about the effects of mixing it. Thanks!

 

[blefuscu]

I know zip about cannabis oil or marijuana but my daughter had three very severe seizures while pregnant and the neurologist did mention it to her. Fortunately, she has had no seizures since then but I was curious about the effects of mixing it. Thanks!

No problems. Cannabis can ruin lives but it's often more to do with societal problems and the impact on relationships rather than the effects of say Meth or Heroin which obviously run the dangers of death as soon as you use. I'm extremely interested in the research being done into cannabis and cannabanoids in legitimate healthcare and also anecdotal evidence of the benefits of cannabis for what you would call "none-typical" ideas of users, so say older women with pain, children who are given cannabis oil for conditions, older men.

 

[Cubby]

So if she had a fatal seizure like I stated....(and not an accident)....and the seizure caused her death....which could be proven medically, MG would be at fault for her death because he was high? I can see him getting ramifications/charges for drug use around a minor, etc. ...but if COD was seizure that is very interesting that it would carry heavy jail time. And to think Casey Anthony walks free.

I think it would depend on how his impairment contributed to the seizure causing her death and I am certain that would be part of a death investigation.