I just really keep getting the vibe these women were hippie wannabes. They were creating this peace, love look at us and our created family to have some sort of identity. How sad is that.... Sorry kids, you just weren’t listened too..
CA CA - Hannah, 16, Devonte, 15, & Sierra Hart, 12, Mendocino County, 26 March 2018 #1
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60,000 lb shipping containers can float in the ocean.
Exactly! Me too!
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I can imagine one of them going off the deep end, but somehow I just can't wrap my mind around both of them agreeing to end it all. I also don't think we would assume that was the case if it wasn't for them both being women. This isn't a slam, by the way. I see them as a unit acting in tandem too, much more than I think I would if it was a heterosexual couple. I also admit it could be possible, I just think it's far fetched.
bluesneakers
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My point was we don't know. I try to consider all possibilities.
Good for you! Forced hugs and kisses?.. No! No! No!JMO
I grew up with my parents forcing me to hug every and all relative and extended relative whenever we would visit any of them. I luckily did not have any creepy relatives but I do remember feeling quite uncomfortable when I met some of them for the first time and did not know this "stranger" in front of me and was being forced to approach them for a hug.
I have not had children but if I did I would only reserve closeness like that only with the very closest of relatives like Grandma Grandpa only and I would join the child in approaching the grandparents as in hugs all around for all of us.
Having flashbacks from a movie where Grandma pinches the child's cheek really hard and says "Goochie Goochie".
flourish
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Do we have anything stating any personality disorders these women were or were not diagnosed with? I really don't feel comfortable with statements which essentially diagnose them... Even people qualified to diagnose wouldn't do it without more information.
keeleydoll
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They dont have broken/open windows and doors or all of the places that vehicles have for water to get into.
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bluesneakers
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I agree, and the same thing applies to diagnosing the children with eating disorders or other mental illnesses.
bluesneakers
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I've been looking for that too. I found a few cases involving siblings, but nothing about couples and almost nothing about females.
I posted a few links earlier - just really basic stuff - but there is a study out there specifically about female family annihilators.
52 Ton ships can float too, until they fill up with water.
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<modsnip>
I've had to take a break from this case for a few days because it was getting confusing as to what the actual facts were vs what posters were speculating. I'm also a little uncomfortable at some of the conclusions that are being drawn in regards to to race. (Non-Caucasian, older children are traditionally the most difficult to find adoptive parents for. While it is certainly possible that the mothers had some kind of "white savior" complex, it is JUST as likely that they adopted African American children because they simply wanted to provide a home for children that might have otherwise not found a permanent home. I've been through the adoption process. In the very beginning we were told that if we wanted a "occasion infant" then we'd have to wait several years. If we were willing to adopt an African American toddler, especially if there was a developmental issue or physical impairment present, then the process would be much quicker. Although we ultimately did not go through the process, we were definitely leaning towards an African American toddler because we were interested in providing a home for someone who'd been waiting longer.)
Where I live, there are many families who live off the grid and are almost "clannish." People actually move to my part of the state to set up farms and go offline. My household doesn't have a telephone, although we have internet because I do a lot of online work. We're also a little "crunchy" and we do the protests, family events, festivals, etc. with our kids. (Someone a few pages back referred to this as being "new age" and used that phrase in a negative manner.) So none of that is weird to me.
I'm not real big on calling this "another Turpin family" case. There are big differences between the families. For starters, the Hart children were adopted and their small statures/sizes could very well stem from problems they faced inutero or as infants. (Young children diagnosed with "failure to thrive" often have trouble catching up with other children their age in terms of development.)
Re: the burning of the cross in the yard. Posters were saying that it probably didn't happen because it would have made the news. Not necessarily. There was a Klan meeting about an hour away from me last year and a cross was burned in a yard of an African American family. Although the family took video footage of it and shared it on their social media, not even the local paper reported.
The Turpins went out of their way, it seems, to ensure that their children were cut off from the world. They were isolated from just about everyone. The Harts, however, were very sociable. Although we have no way of knowing what went on behind closed doors with the Harts, there were people in their lives who spent time with the children and the mothers.
I understand the comparisons between the two families but I think it serves either in reducing them to simply being the same. There are nuances, important ones, that set them apart.
The fact is, we don't have a lot of facts about this case. A good portion of the information has come from the next door neighbors. All we have, for instance, are the neighbors saying that the children were malnourished. Unlike in the Turpin case, we haven't heard any of the children's doctors, or even a coroner's report, corroborate this.
Something terrible clearly happened here. I don't believe it was accidental; I do think it was intentional. I think it's important not to let speculation become facts, however. We don't know that either parent had a narcissistic personality disorder, we don't know that there was anything nefarious in their adopting of ethnic children, we don't really even know to what extent they were "isolating" the children. I'm just trying to gather more information from official sources before I reach any firm conclusions.
I've had to take a break from this case for a few days because it was getting confusing as to what the actual facts were vs what posters were speculating. I'm also a little uncomfortable at some of the conclusions that are being drawn in regards to to race. (Non-Caucasian, older children are traditionally the most difficult to find adoptive parents for. While it is certainly possible that the mothers had some kind of "white savior" complex, it is JUST as likely that they adopted African American children because they simply wanted to provide a home for children that might have otherwise not found a permanent home. I've been through the adoption process. In the very beginning we were told that if we wanted a "occasion infant" then we'd have to wait several years. If we were willing to adopt an African American toddler, especially if there was a developmental issue or physical impairment present, then the process would be much quicker. Although we ultimately did not go through the process, we were definitely leaning towards an African American toddler because we were interested in providing a home for someone who'd been waiting longer.)
Where I live, there are many families who live off the grid and are almost "clannish." People actually move to my part of the state to set up farms and go offline. My household doesn't have a telephone, although we have internet because I do a lot of online work. We're also a little "crunchy" and we do the protests, family events, festivals, etc. with our kids. (Someone a few pages back referred to this as being "new age" and used that phrase in a negative manner.) So none of that is weird to me.
I'm not real big on calling this "another Turpin family" case. There are big differences between the families. For starters, the Hart children were adopted and their small statures/sizes could very well stem from problems they faced inutero or as infants. (Young children diagnosed with "failure to thrive" often have trouble catching up with other children their age in terms of development.)
Re: the burning of the cross in the yard. Posters were saying that it probably didn't happen because it would have made the news. Not necessarily. There was a Klan meeting about an hour away from me last year and a cross was burned in a yard of an African American family. Although the family took video footage of it and shared it on their social media, not even the local paper reported.
The Turpins went out of their way, it seems, to ensure that their children were cut off from the world. They were isolated from just about everyone. The Harts, however, were very sociable. Although we have no way of knowing what went on behind closed doors with the Harts, there were people in their lives who spent time with the children and the mothers.
I understand the comparisons between the two families but I think it serves either in reducing them to simply being the same. There are nuances, important ones, that set them apart.
The fact is, we don't have a lot of facts about this case. A good portion of the information has come from the next door neighbors. All we have, for instance, are the neighbors saying that the children were malnourished. Unlike in the Turpin case, we haven't heard any of the children's doctors, or even a coroner's report, corroborate this.
Something terrible clearly happened here. I don't believe it was accidental; I do think it was intentional. I think it's important not to let speculation become facts, however. We don't know that either parent had a narcissistic personality disorder, we don't know that there was anything nefarious in their adopting of ethnic children, we don't really even know to what extent they were "isolating" the children. I'm just trying to gather more information from official sources before I reach any firm conclusions.
gcharlie
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The reason an ocean cargo shipping container will float is because it is water tight. Shipping containers are made for transporting goods across the oceans often on decks of ships. They have heavy duty rubber door seals which keep out the elements. In the case of an object that sinks (is totally submerged), the volume of the object is displaced. In the case of an object that floats, the amount of fluid displaced will be equal in weight to the displacing object.
Archimedes' principle, a physical law of buoyancy, states that anybody completely or partially submerged in a fluid (gas or liquid) at rest is acted upon by an upward, or buoyant, force the magnitude of which is equal to the weight of the fluid displaced by the body. Thus an empty, water tight container will float, but if the container is full and its weight is great enough, the container will sink.
Cars are not watertight and with water filling the vehicle, enough displacement will take place to sink it.
jantour
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Just going through all the photos that are publicly available in the news or social media....it feels to me like the kids' digital footprint gets cut off in 2016. The Bernie Sanders rally where the photo of them in the matching blue shirts was March 20, 2016. The youtube video of Sarah's birthday was posted on April 12, 2016. But after that, it seems really murky. Are there any known photos from 2017 or even 2018? I know they both have their privacy settings on with FB, but I just don't see the "friends" posting recent photos. They all seem pre-2016. I wonder what the kids looked like in 2018 since they are all at ages where even a year or two can make a huge difference with height/weight/facial hair for boys, etc. Especially since three of them are still missing.
Gardenista
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Me and Mr. Washington [official music video]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wd1CHFfym1s&app=desktop
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wd1CHFfym1s&app=desktop
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All posts responding to the T&L reference have been removed.
People, there was absolutely no malintent on the part of the original poster. Stop the bickering about it and move on please.
Thanks.
People, there was absolutely no malintent on the part of the original poster. Stop the bickering about it and move on please.
Thanks.
nothingnew
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Except they WERE listened to. CPS twice in MN, I think both times from teachers, then CPS via the neighbors. & then West Lin which I don't know details about. The kids told, it was reported and then a lot of departments dropped the ball. JMO
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Oh cool. I did see that post. I just didn't notice you had links to articles. I am reading them now.
A couple of people have posted pictures that show the children looking much bigger than in the blue shirts. I am not sure how recent they are, but I would guess at least Spring/Summer 2017.
True. I was more so responding to the weight part of the comment.
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