CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #12

[cobalt sky]

rsbm

How did the murderer get Summer out of the house alive and wrapped in blue painter's tape, Joey, the children in pull ups and bath towels, at breakfast-time just after the dogs had been put outside and before Joey had made any business calls, without Joey or Summer using a phone to call for help, without being spotted by neighbours going to work, children going to school, mail and other delivery people about, people opening their curtains, or other drivers on the roads? And why did they take the towels and the floor mats and the sledgehammer with paint that matched the paint on Summer's bra?

Where is the realistic alternative scenario to the family being killed in the house, wrapped/concealed, taken out in darkness and loaded into the back of a truck?

Your scenario assumes that I think the family was abducted the morning of the 5th? I don't think it can be completely ruled out, it's possible but imo not probable. Regarding the prosecution's version of events, they do put forth a compelling circumstantial account of what might have happened, but when pressed, even they admit that they cannot definitively prove it. There are many possibilities of what might have happened under the cover of darkness. Some theorize that Joey never made it home, and Summer & kids were abducted later in the day. Again, there are many possibilities, and without a confession, we are likely never to know exactly what happened.

As for the painter's tape and the sledge hammer, it's possible the sledge was used to incapacitate one or more of them, and possibly the tape used to wrap and restrain, in order to get them out of the house. I just don't know for sure, and neither does anyone else really. There are a lot of strange things about this case...the backpack in the graves, why??? Shoes aren't the only thing missing... Summer's & Joey's wallet, phone(s), maybe the shoes are with those items? We just don't know. All IMO.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

simple
you're on a ladder and you lean over to reach a corner and it drips down from above
there's soooooooooooooo many possibilities for it to be an innocent explanation IMO
red herring

Okay. I understand your theory, and greatly respect your point of view, like always.

However; we will have to agree to disagree on this one piece of evidence. I find it highly unlikely based on the evidence this was benign.

I believe it happened when Summer was being attacked, and murdered or when he had killed her, and still standing over her with the weapon still in his hand.

I also dont believe in any coincidences in any murder case, much less a mass murder case.

This one has paint drips on the victim's bra, and sledgehammer. They are linked together, and lines up, imo

Imo, that is not a common piece of clothing to receive paint drips unless the victim was forced to undress.

It's even rarer to find it on a victim's bra that had been purposefully cut in half.

I think we can all agree Summer wouldnt be walking around in her bra painting if she had any idea at all CM would intrude into her home.

Since it was found on her bra half, I believe this logically supports she was on the floor on her side when it dripped on her cut bra.

It also coincides with the same paint being on the chilling murder weapon as well.. Both paints had to be fresh when put there.

Iirc, there were questions why Summer had a paint tray out with dried paint in it, that she hadn't lined with foil when she had used that method McG showed her for easy clean up, imo.

I think when attacking her some of her blood may have spattered into the foiled tray with paint in it.

Imo, he changed the paint out, but forgot to reline it with foil like she was doing.

To me whether it is blood or paint spatter or drips it tells a story for the jury to consider, and they will.

Imo, this was entered in as evidence for a reason by the state for the jury to consider when linking all of the evidence in its totality.

I dont believe the jury will think it's a red herring at all, but will think it lines up with her being on the floor on her side.

Its common knowledge if something is liquid on any bludgeoning weapon the liquid will drip if someone stands over someone who is laying on the floor on their side.

The clothing it drips on, will give these same like horizontal patterns as found on her bra when it dripped from his weapon of choice.

Take care.

Ocean

Jmo only!

 

[Bernina]

Unfortunately we don't really know exactly what business arrangements Joey agreed to with Dan because Joey is not here to tell us . But from what we know, it is unlikely that Joey had given Dan permission to pay himself. This is evidenced by Dan's own words, that he was trying to contact Joey to receive payment, and the text/email? I can't remember which...on Saturday the 6th I believe..asking Summer where Joey is because he wanted paid. IMO.

Regardless, Dan was owed the balance and monthly (or whatever arrangement) payment as web master. Didn't he have access to the Paypal account before the family disappeared? Susan said Dan was an old friend so she probably wouldn't have a problem with Dan distributing funds related to EIP. Obviously, she didn't give Chase that authority because he was asking her for money.

 

[citygirl]

Unfortunately we don't really know exactly what business arrangements Joey agreed to with Dan because Joey is not here to tell us . But from what we know, it is unlikely that Joey had given Dan permission to pay himself. This is evidenced by Dan's own words, that he was trying to contact Joey to receive payment, and the text/email? I can't remember which...on Saturday the 6th I believe..asking Summer where Joey is because he wanted paid. IMO.

Interesting. So, Dan was looking to be paid by Joey in text and emails and even texted Summer on the 6th? Seems pretty honest to me. And the DT is looking to pin it on him whilst their defendant is printing, back dating , cashing and deleting checks? Which he claims Joey gave him permission? Did he ever call Summer after they went missing?

 

[missy1974]

rsbm

How did the murderer get Summer out of the house alive and wrapped in blue painter's tape, Joey, the children in pull ups and bath towels, at breakfast-time just after the dogs had been put outside and before Joey had made any business calls, without Joey or Summer using a phone to call for help, without being spotted by neighbours going to work, children going to school, mail and other delivery people about, people opening their curtains, or other drivers on the roads? And why did they take the towels and the floor mats and the sledgehammer with paint that matched the paint on Summer's bra?

Where is the realistic alternative scenario to the family being killed in the house, wrapped/concealed, taken out in darkness and loaded into the back of a truck?

Summer was wrapped in painters tape?

There are things that can't be explained, no matter what time of the day it was. You mention people going to work... what about them coming home that evening? We did see a vehicle drive by right before the truck left the driveway in the Mitchley video. Joey and Summer not calling for help... well, that's something that we could say about any time of the day and any place it could have happened. With the exception of 2, the one with the sunflower on it and the hooded baby one, I believe the towels were shop towels, and I don't think we ever did 'see' the bath mat, we did see that it was not in the bathroom, but I do not believe it was in the graves.

The roll of painters tape, the sledgehammer (although McG couldn't place it there the days prior), and the shop towels are the best evidence connecting to the house. The other towels could have easily have been something from the truck. When my kids were younger, we always had everything in the truck, including towels in the summer, but in Cali it's summer all the time lol

 

[missy1974]

Regardless, Dan was owed the balance and monthly (or whatever arrangement) payment as web master. Didn't he have access to the Paypal account before the family disappeared? Susan said Dan was an old friend so she probably wouldn't have a problem with Dan distributing funds related to EIP. Obviously, she didn't give Chase that authority because he was asking her for money.

With that logic, doesn't the same go for Chase... (or whatever arrangement)?

I do not believe Joey gave him access before they went missing and he only accessed it afterwards, probably through his emails <<<< JMO I really don't think Susan knew or understood what was going on with the finances, her concern was Joey and his/her family.

 

[cobalt sky]

Regardless, Dan was owed the balance and monthly (or whatever arrangement) payment as web master. Didn't he have access to the Paypal account before the family disappeared? Susan said Dan was an old friend so she probably wouldn't have a problem with Dan distributing funds related to EIP. Obviously, she didn't give Chase that authority because he was asking her for money.

If Dan had access to the PayPal with permission to pay himself then he probably wouldn't have needed to track Joey down to ask to be paid. IMO.

 

[missy1974]

Interesting. So, Dan was looking to be paid by Joey in text and emails and even texted Summer on the 6th? Seems pretty honest to me. And the DT is looking to pin it on him whilst their defendant is printing, back dating , cashing and deleting checks? Which he claims Joey gave him permission? Did he ever call Summer after they went missing?

Did he ever call Summer before they went missing? I have a feeling probably not... jmo

 

[citygirl]

Summer was wrapped in painters tape?

There are things that can't be explained, no matter what time of the day it was. You mention people going to work... what about them coming home that evening? We did see a vehicle drive by right before the truck left the driveway in the Mitchley video. Joey and Summer not calling for help... well, that's something that we could say about any time of the day and any place it could have happened. With the exception of 2, the one with the sunflower on it and the hooded baby one, I believe the towels were shop towels, and I don't think we ever did 'see' the bath mat, we did see that it was not in the bathroom, but I do not believe it was in the graves.

The roll of painters tape, the sledgehammer (although McG couldn't place it there the days prior), and the shop towels are the best evidence connecting to the house. The other towels could have easily have been something from the truck. When my kids were younger, we always had everything in the truck, including towels in the summer, but in Cali it's summer all the time lol

Missy, it seemed like a lonely neighborhood to me. Have always wondered if the houses on either side were even occupied? Don't think that has ever been addressed? All the talk has mostly been about the Mitchely house. And one or two families up in the cul-de-sac. That's it.

 

[cobalt sky]

Interesting. So, Dan was looking to be paid by Joey in text and emails and even texted Summer on the 6th? Seems pretty honest to me. And the DT is looking to pin it on him whilst their defendant is printing, back dating , cashing and deleting checks? Which he claims Joey gave him permission? Did he ever call Summer after they went missing?

I don't know that I would call going into someone's PayPal and taking thousands of dollars BEFORE it has even been firmly established that the family was missing as being "pretty honest". IMO.

 

[Mica]

Regardless, Dan was owed the balance and monthly (or whatever arrangement) payment as web master. Didn't he have access to the Paypal account before the family disappeared? Susan said Dan was an old friend so she probably wouldn't have a problem with Dan distributing funds related to EIP. Obviously, she didn't give Chase that authority because he was asking her for money.

Bessie put together a spreadsheet of Paypal transactions in one of the old threads. From what I recall, there are no transactions showing Dan making any payments to himself in the month prior to the disappearance. Patrick said Dan did not have access to pay himself through the Paypal account.

 

[citygirl]

Did he ever call Summer before they went missing? I have a feeling probably not... jmo

Nor after which was my point.

 

[citygirl]

I don't know that I would call going into someone's PayPal and taking thousands of dollars BEFORE it has even been firmly established that the family was missing as being "pretty honest". IMO.

I didn't know this! Has this been in testimony? PH or today?

 

[smr]

Right, but it's not uncommon for a wife to get annoyed when hubby's buddies are hanging around. Especially with small children to care for and a huge home improvement project in the works. I wouldn't categorize this as something that would offer proof of a poor or declining relationship between Joey and Chase. All IMO.

Not only that, but it's the contrary: the fact that Joey had Chase in his house despite Summer's unhappiness about it, suggests that Joey and Chase had very good relationship, good enough not to be hurt by Summer's dislike. If both Joey and Summer disliked Chase, why would they have him in their house as someone welcome by no one? Chase would also not likely to want to be there. Apparently at least one person in the house welcomed him.

 

[cobalt sky]

I didn't know this! Has this been in testimony? PH or today?

It was in the Defense's OS, I'm sure they will be bringing it up at some point.

 

[missy1974]

Missy, it seemed like a lonely neighborhood to me. Have always wondered if the houses on either side were even occupied? Don't think that has ever been addressed? All the talk has mostly been about the Mitchely house. And one or two families up in the cul-de-sac. That's it.

I don't know if all the houses were occupied, but I know some were because I remember in the Tim Miller video's they were talking to neighbours. IIRC Mitchely worked early morning, but can't recall right at the moment and I don't have the time to look right now. Mitchely did live across the street and she talked about 'hearing' everything from neighbours, it would kinda echo in the cul-de-sac. But I think I would agree that it may have been quiet down at the end of that street where they were, but I think that can apply to either the evening or early mornings in neighbourhoods like that IMO

 

[missy1974]

Nor after which was my point.

And my point is, I don't know if he even had her number lol If I knew he called her before, then I could conclude he did, but since they were not really 'friends', I don't know that he would. Not like cell numbers are listed in the white pages. JMO

 

[citygirl]

I don't know if all the houses were occupied, but I know some were because I remember in the Tim Miller video's they were talking to neighbours. IIRC Mitchely worked early morning, but can't recall right at the moment and I don't have the time to look right now. Mitchely did live across the street and she talked about 'hearing' everything from neighbours, it would kinda echo in the cul-de-sac. But I think I would agree that it may have been quiet down at the end of that street where they were, but I think that can apply to either the evening or early mornings in neighbourhoods like that IMO

No need to look for Mitchely's testimony. I have listened myself.

 

[citygirl]

And my point is, I don't know if he even had her number lol If I knew he called her before, then I could conclude he did, but since they were not really 'friends', I don't know that he would. Not like cell numbers are listed in the white pages. JMO

Gotcha.

 

[cobalt sky]

And my point is, I don't know if he even had her number lol If I knew he called her before, then I could conclude he did, but since they were not really 'friends', I don't know that he would. Not like cell numbers are listed in the white pages. JMO

Right, I think early on, people were calling/texting who they were closer to, iirc Susan testified that she didn't call Summer either, at least at first. So I don't think it's really a big deal. IMO