CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #15

[missy1974]

Ok...on a different note. According to Patrick McStay's book the text Summer sent to Joey on 2/4 was actually sent at 5:05 pm. Joey doesn't get it until 5:47. Maybe his phone died and he was already home at 5:47 and recharging it. That would explain the fact JM didn't respond to SM's text.

Also, I listened again to the testimony from the T-Mobile guy Michael Bolsillo (day 14 part 4), apparently JM's phone accessed the internet 8:27 pm 2/4.

So we have the truck being moved at 7:47 pm
QB accessed from JM's computer at 8:01 pm (I wish we knew the site)
Last internet access from JM's cell at 8:27 pm
Last call from JM's phone (to CM) at 8:28 pm

Then CM's cell pinging in Mira Loma at 9:32 pm (which is right on time if he left Fallbrook at around 8:30 pm).

What made him move the truck and then go back in the house?

MOO

The 5:47 thing is weird... he makes a call to Chase which shows 3 minutes. There is an E-note and internet access and the text from Summer. The BBM part above.. is that from his book as well? or is that your thoughts?

Now if you look at Chase's records... it shows a 5:47 as 0 seconds and then a 5:48 as 2:37 seconds (but shows only 1 on Joey's and a call for 3 minutes) On Joey's records, it only shows Chase's number 1 time. I have actually wondered if Joey sent Chase something? Through email? a pic or something ... which would be the internet access (email), then the e-note (I have found conflicting info about what an e-note was back then lol)... and then a call maybe right after?

I've added some snips I have.

 

[QueenBofOB]

I agree that it is a shame this information is not made public record. Sex offenders must register and I feel like child abusers should be made to register as well. I am in no way accusing CM of child abuse as I know he has never been charged with that but simply stating that a registry of people convicted of child abuse or harm with open records would benefit everyone. IMO

There should be an easily accessible National Registry of everyone convicted of DV, Child Abuse and Elder Abuse. IMOP.

 

[QueenBofOB]

BBM, All i can think is that in his hurry to get out of there he forgot something, or needed to do something else in the house quickly?
And got his vehicle away from the house some for his own known reasons?

Maybe he got nervous. Didn't a neighbor hear some sort of noise and switch on their outside light?

 

[Satchie]

So we have the truck being moved at 7:47 pm...What made him move the truck and then go back in the house?

RSBM

I recall the unreliability of the timestamps on surveillance video systems came up in one case I followed.

"Millard's lawyer Ravin Pillay asked Plaxton about how digital video recorders are "prone to clock error over time." Most of the videos Plaxton was working with in the case had time-stamp errors, sometimes by three to four hours.

"When you encounter security camera video, you have to be very careful with attempting to fix a time that's out on the video, fair?" Pillay asked. Plaxton
responded yes."
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hami...r-hours-after-tim-bosma-disappeared-1.3483358

I recall in his testimony he cited various methods that are used to test and correct the time, by sychronizing the video to known events. It was eye-opening. This was video created in 2013.

Since LE weren't given permission to remove the McStay neighbour's computer, they couldn't check and correct any potential time error. I was confused at first why the footage was entered into the record by the neighbour: I think it must be becauss it doesn't have the reliability of forensic evidence.

So, IMO, the puzzle about the time of the truck leaving might simply be a timestamp error.

 

[missy1974]

RSBM

I recall the unreliability of the timestamps on surveillance video systems came up in one case I followed.

.....

So, IMO, the puzzle about the time of the truck leaving might simply be a timestamp error.

RSBM

so is that good or bad for Merritt? LOL shoot, for all we know, it could be from a different day then. I have never really questioned the time/day of the video, thinking that the neighbour would be completely non-biased and it wouldn't matter to her what she did or didn't see on whatever day.

With that being said... I have no idea how they figured out what time it was in that video LOL I think we may have missed some stuff on the video that was off L&C's screen that showed the times.

 

[travelbug]

RSBM

I recall the unreliability of the timestamps on surveillance video systems came up in one case I followed.
(snip)

Since LE weren't given permission to remove the neighbour's computer, they couldn't check and correct any potential time error. I was confused at first why the footage was entered into the record by the neighbour: I think it must be becauss it doesn't have the reliability of forensic evidence.

So, IMO, the puzzle about the time of the truck leaving might simply be a timestamp error.

What if the security system hadn't been updated for DST. That would fit perfectly because the truck would have been leaving at 8:47 pm.

 

[Satchie]

RSBM

so is that good or bad for Merritt? LOL shoot, for all we know, it could be from a different day then. I have never really questioned the time/day of the video, thinking that the neighbour would be completely non-biased and it wouldn't matter to her what she did or didn't see on whatever day.

With that being said... I have no idea how they figured out what time it was in that video LOL I think we may have missed some stuff on the video that was off L&C's screen that showed the times.

It's not a person introducing deliberate bias, it's like a watch that loses or gains a few seconds per day, so after several months or years, the time stamped on the video footage is no longer correct.

I just tested my older digital camera by taking a photo, it's timestamped 1 hr 10 minutes later than the real time I took the photo.

The devices use algorithms to calculate time, which aren't totally accurate.

 

[Satchie]

What if the security system hadn't been updated for DST. That would fit perfectly because the truck would have been leaving at 8:47 pm.

Exactly, back in 2010, you might have had to make the time change manually, as described in the manual on p. 17.

 

[missy1974]

It's not a person introducing deliberate bias, it's like a watch that loses or gains a few seconds per day, so after several months or years, the time stamped on the video footage is no longer correct.

I just tested my handheld digital camera by taking a photo, it's timestamped 1 hr 10 minutes later than the real time I took the photo.

The devices use algorithms to calculate time, which aren't totally accurate.

Interesting! Good to know... we just got a surveillance system for our home, I will definitely watch for that. After watching the Mitchley video over and over and over again, I told my hubby if we were going to buy one it better have a good picture on it or it was pointless LOL I think we got a 'good enough' system and didn't have to take out a loan

I followed the Millard stuff in the beginning, didn't have time to follow the trials though. So much harder to follow cases up here ... I call it 'trial by twitter'... but I think the Canadian reporters are so good at tweeting details sometimes it feels like you are sitting there.

 

[Niner]

@Mica - any updates on hours of trial for next week? TIA!

 

[mrjitty]

What if the security system hadn't been updated for DST. That would fit perfectly because the truck would have been leaving at 8:47 pm.

I made this argument back at the time.

AFAIK there is nothing in testimony that Dugal made an effort to reconcile the clocks - e.g. by checking his watch vs the system clock would have been a start.

But we don't have the exhibits so maybe something like this was done.

 

[mrjitty]

It's not a person introducing deliberate bias, it's like a watch that loses or gains a few seconds per day, so after several months or years, the time stamped on the video footage is no longer correct.

I just tested my older digital camera by taking a photo, it's timestamped 1 hr 10 minutes later than the real time I took the photo.

The devices use algorithms to calculate time, which aren't totally accurate.

Also those systems often suffer from resets though power loss - e.g. the oven clock is wrong because of a power cut.

 

[mrjitty]

I was just going to post the same thing, forgot something or wanted to double check he didn't leave something behind and while in there wrote himself a check, then realized the folly of it.

I suspect he realised at the last minute it was the last chance to steal.

I think it was tortoise who speculated that he may not have been able to get the printer going immediately.

My own theory is that he probably realised that the time stamp for the cheque creation would be after the his "meeting with joey" and thus tie him to the crime scene

He had the backdating idea the next day?

 

[Cricket28]

The 5:47 thing is weird... he makes a call to Chase which shows 3 minutes. There is an E-note and internet access and the text from Summer. The BBM part above.. is that from his book as well? or is that your thoughts?

Now if you look at Chase's records... it shows a 5:47 as 0 seconds and then a 5:48 as 2:37 seconds (but shows only 1 on Joey's and a call for 3 minutes) On Joey's records, it only shows Chase's number 1 time. I have actually wondered if Joey sent Chase something? Through email? a pic or something ... which would be the internet access (email), then the e-note (I have found conflicting info about what an e-note was back then lol)... and then a call maybe right after?

I've added some snips I have.

Those were my thoughts.
You might be right about all that.

Now I'm wondering....
Joey's records show he was hitting off one of the towers near his home in Fallbrook at 4:18, 4:27, and 4:31 (and again at 5:47 and 8:28)... so where was he when Summer sent her text at 5:05? Unless Summer wasn't home when she sent it.

I wish the T-Mobile guy was asked about the enote.

MOO

 

[missy1974]

Those were my thoughts.
You might be right about all that.

Now I'm wondering....
Joey's records show he was hitting off one of the towers near his home in Fallbrook at 4:18, 4:27, and 4:31 (and again at 5:47 and 8:28)... so where was he when Summer sent her text at 5:05? Unless Summer wasn't home when she sent it.

I wish the T-Mobile guy was asked about the enote.

MOO

I thought the same... about Summer maybe not being home at the time. Of course, we haven't even seen her records. When I first looked up the e-notes... there were a few possibilities, of course I didn't keep those links, but just googling quick, here is a link... Mysterious text messages this one is a bit older than 2010, but seems to be similar to what I found before... a system note from maybe rebooting? some say it's sending a text to an email ... no really good answer, but some possibilities. I agree... I wish they had asked!!!! I considered the text to email or email to text only because Chase's records show 2 incoming from Joey and the one shows 0 for the time, it's weird. It's really hard to remember the phones from 2010 too lol It's not that long ago... yet it is Something else I *think* is that Joey had his email on his phone, I think it did an automatic check every 2 hours if he left it open... if you look at this internet activity (which is slightly cut off in the snip I took), previous to that, the internet was accessed every 2 hours the previous night. My guess is that he had it set to check every 2 hours if it was left unchecked, but that is just my speculation based on knowing his business was internet based.

Somewhat off this specific topic.... I feel like Summer gets forgotten about in this whole thing... no mention of what she did that day, who cares about her phone records, or who she talked to that day

 

[katydid23]

A child who has a father described and imagined by many here.

It is not simply our imaginations. There is evidence for the things we described.

 

[katydid23]

That fact is no proof that they were abused by their fathers.

Not true.
I was sexually abused by my uncle, who was our after school babysitter, from age 6 to age 9. And I still loved him because he did some very nice things for us as well and I was just a kid who didn't understand it all.

 

[katydid23]

A daughter, who is possibly reading how strangers trash her father and the relationship between her and her father, and call him the worst to ever walk the earth, with no basis, is truly an innocent victim.

Yes, a daughter who believes that her father is going to the casino so he can 'make money' to pay the car note, is truly an innocent victim.

If you are behind on your bills, the casino is not the solution it is the problem.

 

[katydid23]

Perlin's DNA results are really hard to fathom in my opinion. Summer's DNA was not on her bra - either cup - inside or out - yet he found 2, 3 & even 4 possible contributors of DNA there that doesn't match anyone.

I can sort of accept that there might be foreign DNA on the 2 white electrical cords and the 1 red tie-down strap. As the Prosecution noted, those are items that are generally used by multiple people. We don't know where the cords or strap originated from - it could have been a metal shop, or construction site, or Merritt's toolbox, or the McStay garage. We just don't know.

We can be pretty certain that CM didn't go out and buy this cords and straps the day before the murders. He had these things all around him. In his truck or workshop, or in Joeys truck or at the house. Any one and everyone could have handled them previously

 

[mrjitty]

Geevee - I found it!! it starts approx at 43:00 in Part 4 of the cross examination. From the Bode results on an evidence item it reflected a #24 allele of DNA but Cybergenetics did not include this allele and instead used a #23 allele for their "genotyping" and report. And the Prosecution notes that from all the reference samples - isn't it odd that out of Joseph, Summer, the kids, and Merritt that Merritt's DNA profile is the only one that includes allele #24.

This tends to confirm my suspicion with this stuff.

The recovery technique is one thing, but creating profiles out of degraded samples can obviously be tilted one way or other depending on what assumptions you make