CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #16

[Tortoise]

They objected lots in Schroeder's testimony when it came to the devices being discussed. I wasn't even thinking of Mike's testimony.

The one laptop question asked of Schroeder by the defense and objected to by the state pertained to ownership of the Asus. The objection was sustained as being beyond the scope of direct, hearsay and not relevant. I believe I heard La Rock testify yesterday that the Asus belonged to Jonah.

The state did not object to questions about Joey's laptop named Jesepe Lap.

 

[missy1974]

@mrjitty The IP's... La Rock was asked about them, it was objected to, the judge asked a bunch of questions... it was over ruled and he was allowed to testify about them. We will see what the State says today. But it is possible that it is different where you are compared to North America. If I understood correctly, IP's are given out globally, blocks that are assigned to different regions, North America is one block, from that North America has it's own registry that assigns numbers called ARIN, American Registry of Internet Numbers.

Now there is a possibility he was using a VPN. But my experience with VPN's .. I never use a VPN to pretend I am normally where I am, it's used to hide your IP and region or used to 'pretend' you are in a geographical region, usually not the area you are actually from lol But that's just my experience. There is a difference between IP's and mobile IP's as well, and the mobile IP's give a more general region like 'southern california', I'm going to guess the IPs starting with 208. are mobile IP's, since we see that on Joey's phone records as well when he connected to the internet on his phone ;-)

 

[mrjitty]

@mrjitty The IP's... La Rock was asked about them, it was objected to, the judge asked a bunch of questions... it was over ruled and he was allowed to testify about them. We will see what the State says today. But it is possible that it is different where you are compared to North America. If I understood correctly, IP's are given out globally, blocks that are assigned to different regions, North America is one block, from that North America has it's own registry that assigns numbers called ARIN, American Registry of Internet Numbers.

Now there is a possibility he was using a VPN. But my experience with VPN's .. I never use a VPN to pretend I am normally where I am, it's used to hide your IP and region or used to 'pretend' you are in a geographical region, usually not the area you are actually from lol But that's just my experience. There is a difference between IP's and mobile IP's as well, and the mobile IP's give a more general region like 'southern california', I'm going to guess the IPs starting with 208. are mobile IP's, since we see that on Joey's phone records as well when he connected to the internet on his phone ;-)

The point is that DK may well have a similar IP address whether he is in San Diego or Hawaii

The provider doesn't necessarily change your IP range just because you went on holiday.

So you can't use this method to tell where he is and I just gave you an example with my own phone.

 

[missy1974]

The one laptop question asked of Schroeder by the defense and objected to by the state pertained to ownership of the Asus. The objection was sustained as being beyond the scope of direct, hearsay and not relevant. I believe I heard La Rock testify yesterday that the Asus belonged to Jonah.

The state did not object to questions about Joey's laptop named Jesepe Lap.

This reminded me... I did take some snips of the photo's that La Rock was talking about...

The one of Joey is apparently from October 28/o9, the one of Summer is from January 15/10. They were found on the HP media center (device 5). Maline/ LaRock said that Schroeder determined the laptop was Device 3, the dell laptop (which I didn't get a snip of). La Rock said that the last time that Device 3, the Dell laptop, was used was October 25/09 at 8:53am. He showed some other photo's as well, showing that the camera date (thus the data on the photo's)was most likely correct. (on a side note, I noticed in Summer's photo, it looks like the countertop had already been changed in the kitchen, that would help with dating as well)

That coupled with the information he found in the McAfee logs showing a device named "Josepe-Lap" was communicating with other devices on Jan 22/25/26/28/31 and Feb 3, leads to the belief there is a "missing" laptop. *note: McAfee doesn't keep those logs for long IIRC

 

[Mica]

@mrjitty The IP's... La Rock was asked about them, it was objected to, the judge asked a bunch of questions... it was over ruled and he was allowed to testify about them. We will see what the State says today. But it is possible that it is different where you are compared to North America. If I understood correctly, IP's are given out globally, blocks that are assigned to different regions, North America is one block, from that North America has it's own registry that assigns numbers called ARIN, American Registry of Internet Numbers.

Now there is a possibility he was using a VPN. But my experience with VPN's .. I never use a VPN to pretend I am normally where I am, it's used to hide your IP and region or used to 'pretend' you are in a geographical region, usually not the area you are actually from lol But that's just my experience. There is a difference between IP's and mobile IP's as well, and the mobile IP's give a more general region like 'southern california', I'm going to guess the IPs starting with 208. are mobile IP's, since we see that on Joey's phone records as well when he connected to the internet on his phone ;-)

“The use of a VPN, or any sort of proxy, is not permitted when using PayPal.” It’s a violation of their TOS.

paypal and VPN problem - PayPal Community

 

[fridaybaker]

From what I remember all the investigators found concerning the book were notes containing several quotes about remorse, forgiveness, and murder.
Chase told them he was going to bring the book to them but he never did.

I remember this too.

 

[mrjitty]

The problem even before VPN is how was DK connecting to the internet in the first place?

What ISP was he using?

Was he using his own accounts?

As I have already shown his phone may have kept similar IPs while in Hawaii

Did he have a broadband connection? If so was he using his own account in Hawaii?

These questions are crucial in terms of what IPs he would be assigned

 

[mrjitty]

The defence would need to explain why the DK IP comes up sometimes generically as San Diego but also as Hawaii

Bit of a coincidence no?

 

[Mony Mony]

@mrjitty The IP's... La Rock was asked about them, it was objected to, the judge asked a bunch of questions... it was over ruled and he was allowed to testify about them. We will see what the State says today. But it is possible that it is different where you are compared to North America. If I understood correctly, IP's are given out globally, blocks that are assigned to different regions, North America is one block, from that North America has it's own registry that assigns numbers called ARIN, American Registry of Internet Numbers.

Now there is a possibility he was using a VPN. But my experience with VPN's .. I never use a VPN to pretend I am normally where I am, it's used to hide your IP and region or used to 'pretend' you are in a geographical region, usually not the area you are actually from lol But that's just my experience. There is a difference between IP's and mobile IP's as well, and the mobile IP's give a more general region like 'southern california', I'm going to guess the IPs starting with 208. are mobile IP's, since we see that on Joey's phone records as well when he connected to the internet on his phone ;-)

I use a VPN daily as required by my employer. I work from home with sensitive/protected information. The main purpose of the VPN is not to pretend you are somewhere, rather, the VPN is used to prevent someone stealing or hacking in to your computer while you are online. IMO

What Is a VPN, and Why Would I Need One?

 

[fridaybaker]

If the DT have a case to prove against DK then they better prove it BARD to the jury and the court. Otherwise they are just throwing stuff at the wall hoping it sticks, IMO.

Karinna, that is the key. There is no way a case against DK could be proved BARD. The only person the entire constellation of evidence points to is Chase Merritt. There are always going to be people on the perimeter of a case -every case- who "fit" into one piece or another: Have no alibi, were in the wrong place at the wrong time, etc. Even if it were proven that DK had been in San Diego at the time, then what? So what

At this point in the case, all the stars align on Chase. We shall see, as things go forward, if that changes. However, I think virtually everyone knows that the entire DT focus on DK is nothing more than throwing out distractions for the jury.

MO.

 

[Mony Mony]

Re the IP address locations.......

IMO, those debit card transactions put DK in Hawaii unquestionably. The physical addresses for those transactions do not change. They are all in Hawaii.

Even the computer expert himself said there are no historical logs to indicate what region an IP address was assigned to and he had to use deductive reasoning to determine a historical location for an IP address.

And third, TSA requires ID to board an airplane. DK had airline tickets encompassing the dates of the debit card transactions that took place in Hawaii (that no one is disputing).

IMO MOO etc etc

 

[la2cabo]

“The use of a VPN, or any sort of proxy, is not permitted when using PayPal.” It’s a violation of their TOS.

paypal and VPN problem - PayPal Community

It appears the question and subsequent answers are from November 2017. What was the policy in 2010?

 

[Karinna]

Also this expert makes a big deal that Joey added 'day labor' and it was also 'all in lower case.'

WHY wouldn't it be? It is not a name or a business. There's no reason to capitalise it.

UNLIKE Charles Merritt

The problem with the checks and QB's is that there is no evidence other than Merritt's statement to suggest Merritt had permission to use Joseph's Quickbooks accounting software to write checks. Merritt is not an authorized signer on the account.
Page 208 of the SW's.

 

[Karinna]

Thank you.

Wow! I never knew the police found these quotes several times when they did their SW. Darn it, I wish I had the time to read all in the PDF you have linked. Maybe one day I can have the time to do so. Maybe. Lol! It sure makes me realize I have missed a lot I didnt know.

Remorse, forgiveness, and murder???? Was that going to be the title of his book, I wonder? Shudder.

It's like he was planning to write a tell all book, but make it appear more fictional instead of nonfiction.

Just like OJ did in his book 'If I Did it'.

Has the jury been made aware of those very revealing three words? Tia

Imo

You're welcome ocean. Yes there is a lot of interesting information in the PDF of the SW's.
I'm not sure if the Jury has heard that information?

 

[mrjitty]

I use a VPN daily as required by my employer. I work from home with sensitive/protected information. The main purpose of the VPN is not to pretend you are somewhere, rather, the VPN is used to prevent someone stealing or hacking in to your computer while you are online. IMO

What Is a VPN, and Why Would I Need One?

And if you were using a VPN (not unlikely for a dev) your IP will always come up as a generic IP & untraceable to you.

In these sorts of prosecutions, LE always contacts the ISP to find out which customer had the IP address at the relevant time. A VPN would be a dead end effectively.

Seems like the defence hasn't bothered to check

Googling the geo is fine for broad applications - website analytics for example is a similar tech

But trying to prove where one user was on IP address alone is faulty logic.

What needs to happen is take this IP address back to the provider and try to learn from the logs what customer it was assigned to, and understand how IPs are distributed

 

[Mony Mony]

“The use of a VPN, or any sort of proxy, is not permitted when using PayPal.” It’s a violation of their TOS.

paypal and VPN problem - PayPal Community

I wonder when the use of a VPN became prohibited. The first question on the PayPal link above is dated in 2017, and the user states he always uses a VPN WITH PayPal and is now experiencing problems. The user wants to KEEP using the VPN. Sound to me VPN usage was allowed at some point in time.

 

[la2cabo]

Does anybody know if the boys (Joey and Summer's) knew DK? Would they be able to identify him the same way they would be able to identify Merritt? In my opinion, the primary reason the boys were killed was to prevent them from identifying the perp.

 

[Texas Red]

The defence would need to explain why the DK IP comes up sometimes generically as San Diego but also as Hawaii

IMO, the most likely reason is DK was using a VPN to make it appear he was somewhere other than his actual location, if he was careless or the VPN was disconnected while he was online his actual IP and location would be exposed such a scenario explains the IP behavior mentioned in your comment.

Considering this one must ask why was he using a VPN? One reason would be he was in Hawaii and wanted to make it appear he was in the San Diego area, but why? The other reason would be he was in the San Diego area but wanted to make it appear he was in Hawaii and with this scenario I think the reason he would do so is quite obvious.

 

[mrjitty]

The problem with the checks and QB's is that there is no evidence other than Merritt's statement to suggest Merritt had permission to use Joseph's Quickbooks accounting software to write checks. Merritt is not an authorized signer on the account.
Page 208 of the SW's.

Exactly - and actually admits to forging Joey's signature

That is prima facie evidence to all the world that Joey was not consenting.

The defence needs to produce direct evidence on this point.

e.g written confirmation in emails or testimony from the accused

 

[mrjitty]

IMO, the most likely reason is DK was using a VPN to make it appear he was somewhere other than his actual location, if he was careless or the VPN was disconnected while he was online his actual IP and location would be exposed such a scenario explains the IP behavior mentioned in your comment.

Considering this one must ask why was he using a VPN? One reason would be he was in Hawaii and wanted to make it appear he was in the San Diego area, but why? The other reason would be he was in the San Diego area but wanted to make it appear he was in Hawaii and with this scenario I think the reason he would do so is quite obvious.

This theory doesn't work because the same IP comes up as San Diego or Hawaii depending on which list service you use to look it up

The problem is that these look ups are not accurate enough to pinpoint one user.