CA - Joey, Summer, Gianni, Joseph Jr McStay Murders - Feb 4th 2010 #9

[JMarsh]

Boles does a good job of explaining pretty much what JMarsh just said. Looking at the historical data compared to the real time data like they do when searching for a missing person or fugitive, etc is very different. JMO based off of what Boles testified to.

Are you still on "hotspot" Bernina???? You picked a good week to switch over lol Cams should be back for tomorrow morning

Kevin Boles also referred to radio waves as "energy". Technically there might be some truth that all things are energy at some level, but cellular towers and cell phones or handsets connect by way of radio waves. And these radio waves fun on frequencies. There is no "energy" component really. Not like when you are discussing heat or movement. And the drive test registers all kinds of things emanating from cell towers. Including DB levels. I believe that only engineers should testify on ping data. I'll be glad when this science is challenged more.

 

[JMarsh]

I blame San Diego Sheriff's Dept lol Seriously... once they said it looked like a 'voluntarily missing person's' case, the media seemed to drop it... Tim Miller saying the same back in 2010 didn't help. JMO

If the family wasn't killed in the home, and were dead by the time San Diego even knew of them going missing, there may not have been a whole lot more they could have done-aside from more scrutiny of video cameras at the border.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

They do, but that is not the case here. Many reporters have been using the L&C live stream to do their "reporting" IMO There have not been many articles since the opening statements, I was looking on the weekend. There is one link that has been shared here that gives a weekly update, can't recall who or where it is though.

Do you know if TrueCrime is reporting on this case? The man who runs it his first name is David, I believe. David Lohr? I may have his last name wrong though.

He used to be with CourtTV, and InSessions iirc.

Imo

 

[Bernina]

I blame San Diego Sheriff's Dept lol Seriously... once they said it looked like a 'voluntarily missing person's' case, the media seemed to drop it... Tim Miller saying the same back in 2010 didn't help. JMO

I blame Chase. He was in contact with JM multiple times every day for months. JM's and SM's families were not. He worked for JM. If JM was going to be out of pocket for a family vacation, Chase would have known. JM had contractors to pay, Chase forged checks to keep the heat off of a foul play investigation. And more than likely moved the Trooper to the border. And throwing shade on Summer?

As an aside, for an employee (CM) to be "working" as much as CM claimed, he sure wasn't at Metro Sheet Metal very often according to his cell phone pings.

 

[missy1974]

Thanks. Do you know if she is a defense attorney or use to be?

The reason I ask is Dan Abrams use to be a defense attorney, iirc.

I will heed your advice.

Since she rarely covers the state's direct examinations anyway, the logical thing for me is to scroll, and roll past her tweets.

Others like Tortoise, Katy and yourself are bringing forth what is being testified to anyway. Them for the state most often, and you for the defense.

Imo

I don't know her background... I will do some digging later FWIW, if you look at her tweets from other cases, I don't see the same "defense" slant. I do know that she spent the first few weeks there in person, I believe since, she has been watching like all of us, and she does watch it all.

On another note... personally, I have found that the defense has been able to make some pretty good points on cross exam on almost all of the State's witnesses. I was thinking of this laying in bed last night haha I don't know if I have ever watched a trial where that is the case.

I still don't know that he is "innocent", but I sure have some questions about the evidence at this point. I am somewhat floored by what came out about the cell phone evidence, when the State has been using that to show their belief of the timeline and using the cell phone as supporting evidence of that. I figured the defense would imply a whole bunch of stuff and not be able to show it, but when you get the State witness saying he doesn't want to answer questions until he confer's with AT&T... that IS significant, IMO of course. More significant is the fact that he had time during his 3 days of testimony to do just that, and he didn't. (unlike the Accountant who got a phone number from the prosecutor to do more investigating overnight)

All JMO

 

[JMarsh]

I don't know her background... I will do some digging later FWIW, if you look at her tweets from other cases, I don't see the same "defense" slant. I do know that she spent the first few weeks there in person, I believe since, she has been watching like all of us, and she does watch it all.

On another note... personally, I have found that the defense has been able to make some pretty good points on cross exam on almost all of the State's witnesses. I was thinking of this laying in bed last night haha I don't know if I have ever watched a trial where that is the case.

I still don't know that he is "innocent", but I sure have some questions about the evidence at this point. I am somewhat floored by what came out about the cell phone evidence, when the State has been using that to show their belief of the timeline and using the cell phone as supporting evidence of that. I figured the defense would imply a whole bunch of stuff and not be able to show it, but when you get the State witness saying he doesn't want to answer questions until he confer's with AT&T... that IS significant, IMO of course. More significant is the fact that he had time during his 3 days of testimony to do just that, and he didn't. (unlike the Accountant who got a phone number from the prosecutor to do more investigating overnight)

All JMO

Good points.

 

[LadyL]

I have a keen interest in and research statement analysis techniques used to train law enforcement in interviewing skills.

If I can just show one example extracted from Chase's interview on Feb 17th with my own interpretation:

CM: I’ve never talked, before this, this happened to Joseph, I’d never, never talked to Dan ever.

He states something happened to Joey. What's important here is what he doesn't state, the expected, that Joey possibly went off, of his own accord. So I'm expecting him to state 'before Joseph disappeared'. It's not only about detecting lying, because people don't like lying and avoid it if they can to avoid the tells, so it's focusing on what statements reveal. Speech is very fast and automatic and it reveals what our knowledge is, often with unintentional leakage.

He then goes on to say -

Didn’t even, I mean I knew of his existence, I knew his role in Joseph’s business, I knew um that Joseph was almost, had almost paid him off and I think he was paying him $50,000 for his part of the business, I think that was the number..

He doesn't say has. He's stating knowledge that Joey is dead.

Another example I quoted yesterday was Chase saying he thought Joey paid for lunch by card and they could look that up. They would have had no need to doubt he met Chase for lunch at that stage so he revealed the possibility and I believe likelihood that he didn't meet Joey, because he had even given consideration to alibiing himself.

the 'tells' are fascinating to me

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If the family wasn't killed in the home, and were dead by the time San Diego even knew of them going missing, there may not have been a whole lot more they could have done-aside from more scrutiny of video cameras at the border.

I'm still so puzzled how this all went down at first.

99 percent of all the missing person cases I've seen on crime channels or followed here, the first thing the investigators did is obtain a SW to search through all of their bank accounts, and the latest activity on all of them. They continued to monitor them to see if there is any activity after the date they disappeared. Did they do this when they suddenly disappeared?

So if all of them were able to get SWs this police department could have too. It's like they didn't even try.

All of the other investigators were able to get probable cause for those search warrants, and at the time, they had no idea either if the people were willingly missing, even thinking it was a possibilty at the time they had left willingly. But they didnt rule anything out because the missing persons hadn't been located so there was no way for them to know what had really happened.

The 100K still in the bank sitting dormant should have sent off big red flags.

There were so many suspicious things found inside, and outside the home, that would have given them enough probable cause to get any SWs. Many LE have been able to obtain countless SWs with much less to go on.

Ita! The first police department failed miserably to do their job, and didn't really investigate it like it deserved to be.

Imo

 

[asyousay]

I blame Chase. He was in contact with JM multiple times every day for months. JM's and SM's families were not. He worked for JM. If JM was going to be out of pocket for a family vacation, Chase would have known. JM had contractors to pay, Chase forged checks to keep the heat off of a foul play investigation. And more than likely moved the Trooper to the border. And throwing shade on Summer?

As an aside, for an employee (CM) to be "working" as much as CM claimed, he sure wasn't at Metro Sheet Metal very often according to his cell phone pings.

Chase didn’t botch the investigation though. If the police had done their best at the beginning then this was solvable.

So the bad investigation is on LE not Chase. Chase didn’t tell them to suck at their jobs!!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Chase didn’t botch the investigation though. If the police had done their best at the beginning then this was solvable.

So the bad investigation is on LE not Chase. Chase didn’t tell them to suck at their jobs!!

True, but I'm sure he was very glad they did. It gave him more years of freedom because of the Keystone cops. Barney Fife could have done a better job. Ha

Like many detectives have said, before cases were finally solved years later, 'sometimes all of the luck seemed to be all on the side of the murderer when it first happened.'

Thank goodness his luck finally ran out, just like it has for so many others like him, who also had gotten away with their own murders for years, before finally being arrested, and charged.

Jmo

 

[asyousay]

Court cancelled for today

Court is cancelled for today. The trial originally scheduled to be in session for the morning only due to juror prior commitment, however now there will be no trial today. I'll update with any new info I receive

 

[geevee]

Court cancelled for today

Well, at least now we'll have time to finish listening to the audios from yesterday and the day before (and not have more catching up to do before the stream comes back tomorrow ).

 

[asyousay]

How long before jurors want to walk?

I have no idea on how that works in the U.S but if I was then I would be wanting to quit.

 

[geevee]

How long before jurors want to walk?

I have no idea on how that works in the U.S but if I was then I would be wanting to quit.

During jury selection they were all warned of and asked about conflicts concerning the prospective length of trial (4-6 mo. at that point), so I don't think the judge would allow any of them off the panel for that reason.

He seems to be very fair in giving them time for prior commitments or medical appointments, etc. so far, hopefully they are all committed for the long haul as long as the judge remains reasonable in that regard.

In the Hawaii (Capobianco) trial that lasted 6 months, they took two long breaks (a couple weeks in between prosecution and defense cases) and a break for one or more jurors who had planned vacations and were promised trial would be finished long before those dates (which of course it wasn't, that trial moved at a snail's pace, even compared to this one).

ETA: I have to add "IIRC" on the last break in the Capo trial, it was close to the end and they ended up losing one juror, the vacation break was discussed but rethinking it, I can't recall perfectly if they took the entire break or a few days, the end of that one was a grueling as the entirety.

 

[geevee]

Cathy Russon‏ @cathyrusson 17m17 minutes ago
#McStay - A juror had a personal issue this morning and since court was only scheduled for the morning, the judge cancelled the trial for today. However, Judge, attorneys are in court (different courtroom) for a hearing, likely go over admin, scheduling, etc..

Cathy Russon‏ @cathyrusson 17m17 minutes ago
#McStay - Charles Merritt is in his jail clothes. Merritt's sister, brother and sis-in-law are in the gallery. His sister is on oxygen. Patrick McStay & Summer's sister are also in court.

 

[geevee]

Cathy Russon‏ @cathyrusson 42s42 seconds ago
#McStay - Judge now on the bench. Reason for trial cancellation today: Alternate juror #5 took his wife to the hospital with chest pains.

 

[katydid23]

Yes definitely, is it known whether or not he owned one?

Between him, CJ and his kids, I bet he had access to one.

 

[Emi]

geevee thanks for posting all of the tweets

 

[katydid23]

When did Cathy tweet unfairly? I keep trying to find the tweets people are intimating to and I haven't been able to find a biased tweet.

It is not what she has said, it is what she hasn't said.

 

[katydid23]

I blame San Diego Sheriff's Dept lol Seriously... once they said it looked like a 'voluntarily missing person's' case, the media seemed to drop it... Tim Miller saying the same back in 2010 didn't help. JMO

IDK. The media must have noticed the 4 bodies found buried in the desert. Surely they realized it was no longer a voluntarily missing case by then.