GUILTY CA - Lauren Key, 4, thrown off cliff, Rancho Palos Verdes, 8 Nov 2000

[jilly]

Cam Brown's mother says her son loved Lauren:

http://dailybreeze.com/news/articles/3451761.html

 

[Anita Richman]

I think it is a moot point where Lauren went off the cliff. Just looking at the photographs of the area makes it pretty clear no parent in their right mind would take a child anywhere near that place.

Where we live, there is a rocky cliff area, also called "Inspiration Point". It is breathtaking in it's beauty...the view is spectacular. We often take our children and visitors (various ages from adult to 2 1/2) picnicing and hiking there. (And there are always several other families or groups of people up there doing the same thing-it's a very popular area.) We are very careful to not approach the edge, but invariably some hotshot (usually a teenaged boy) will walk right up to the edge and look over.

I am sure if someone took an aerial photo of the cliff-face of our Inspiration Point, people would think we were crazy for hiking up there, as well. From the perspective of getting there, it is alot less frightening.

 

[Aghast]

The mainstream media didn't pick it up and I think it's partly because Geragos doesn't want us to!:crazy: I think he's laying low until he ever gets a win after being disgraced on the Peterson case.

Hey all, I haven't been here in quite a while. I was glad to see there is a thread here on this case.
Don't even bother going to court tv to find anything, it seems as if there is a geragos blackout over there.
I did find one place that seems to be covering it regularly - try
cameron-brown.blogspot.com
see ya all soon!

 

[Aghast]

Hey all, I haven't been here in quite a while. I was glad to see there is a thread here on this case.
Don't even bother going to court tv to find anything, it seems as if there is a geragos blackout over there.
I did find one place that seems to be covering it regularly - try
cameron-brown.blogspot.com
see ya all soon!

lol, just read that it's a loretta site. there seems to be some good info there though. I'll just not post. :snooty: :crazy:

 

[LaMer]

Cam Brown's mother says her son loved Lauren:

http://dailybreeze.com/news/articles/3451761.html

Mama had more excuses for her son than Carters has liver pills! :boohoo: NOT!

 

[LaMer]

lol, just read that it's a loretta site. there seems to be some good info there though. I'll just not post. :snooty: :crazy:

LOL I wondered if you knew that! Welcome to our little discussion Aghast!

I am wondering what the jury is thinking, suppose we all are eh?

To me it is crystal clear about this guy's intentions, but will it be enough? Enough for the jury? Opinions?

 

[jilly]

Mama had more excuses for her son than Carters has liver pills! :boohoo: NOT!

Yes, he didn't "shut down" when his former girlfriend broke up with him.

I really don't know about this case though. Haven't really read enough about it to get a feel for a solid guilty verdict. The field trip is coming up Wednesday. I wonder how that's gonna work. I read elsewhere that they'll be going by helicopter.

 

[Anita Richman]

lol, just read that it's a loretta site. there seems to be some good info there though. I'll just not post. :snooty: :crazy:

You should probably mask your ip addy with an anonymizer if you go there.

Otherwise the only paper that is doing stories on the case is the Daily Breeze.

 

[LaMer]

Yes, he didn't "shut down" when his former girlfriend broke up with him.

I really don't know about this case though. Haven't really read enough about it to get a feel for a solid guilty verdict. The field trip is coming up Wednesday. I wonder how that's gonna work. I read elsewhere that they'll be going by helicopter.

Helicopter? I do remember reading the judge wasn't in favor of the jury having to take the same path as CB and Lauren. I wonder if they will be able to set foot or if they have to view the top from the helicopter.

I was also doing some reading today, and I agree with you about your statement on a 'solid guilty' verdict. I have my doubts too, very circumstantial, and I have always thought circumstantial was just about the best. This case tho, I don't think the amount of 'circumstantial' will convince the jury, not the entire jury.

What stands out to me to be very damaging, was CB's lying about Lauren leading the way up to IP, when 2 or 3 witnesses testified otherwise. One if not two, stated Lauren looked to be very tired and was trailing behind CB.

Why lie?

I have also read where CB gave 3 different stories to what he witnessed when he heard/saw little Lauren as she was falling. As for two of them, I don't see much difference between Ohh and Ahhh, nor the description. I wonder how that was portrayed when LE testified.

Such a shame there had to be such a battle between Lauren's mother and CB, especially since he was to have agreed to let her and her husband adopt Lauren. What was a problem after this agreement? Was it about the money/support CB was going to have to continue paying until the adoption became final? Was it about the back support money he owed?

CB supposedly readly agreed to the adoption, then I read where a few of his friends wrote CB and Patty were so happy to have Lauren in their lives.

Poor darling little Lauren. Something here is very wrong.

Was he very neglectful oftaking her to such a dangerous area or did he intentionally take her there to kill her? Definetly, he was putting her in danger! What proof is there that he threw her off the cliff? Will Lauren's injuries convince the jury she didn't trip and fall over? Why were there shoe prints of adults and not Laurens? Is that enough proof? CB's lack of empathy and grief enough? CB's financial situation enough? CB's lack of actions/demeanor when recovering his daughter enough? CB's attitude/small talk while waiting with LE, enough?

CB was sitting about 4 feet away from where Lauren was standing, and I believe CB said Lauren was on the edge of the cliff, what was he doing---supposedly looked away for a second. Never heard he dove for her as he saw her feet going over the side. Nothing about that, that's for sure. He was right there!!!! That is--if he didn't throw or push her over!


My granddaughter is almost 4, and I can attest she would have a very difficult time making the hike up to the top of IP. In the first place I would never ever consider taking her on a hike to such an area. Four year olds are little little people, tiny little darlings, just emerging from toddlerhood and not to be subjected to danger or have monsters wipe out their precious lives.

If he intentionally killed Lauren, I pray he sits and rots in jail for the rest of his life. From all I have read about him, he didn't exactly lead the life of someone who was interested in marrying and having children. Preferred abortion and denied paternity, that's CB!

 

[LaMer]

You should probably mask your ip addy with an anonymizer if you go there.

Anita, how does one do that? Just interested, however, I'm not going there! 'There' is scarry!

 

[tybee204]

I am undecided on this case as well. There isnt very much unbiased info to read. Many families do adventerous activities with 4 year olds. I have seen 4 years olds snow ski, motocross and yes even hiking down the Grand Canyon. I dont know if he was extremely neglectful and endangered his child or intentionally killed her. The Jury is hearing the full story an I think they will have a difficult decision to make.

 

[nanandjim]

I think that he is guilty as sin. Hope that the jury sees it this way, too.

 

[Anita Richman]

Helicopter? I do remember reading the judge wasn't in favor of the jury having to take the same path as CB and Lauren. I wonder if they will be able to set foot or if they have to view the top from the helicopter. ~snipped

I wonder why the judge wouldn't have the jury hoof the same path. It *might* be in CB's favor to have them take the walk rather than view it from a helicopter, in my opinion.

 

[Anita Richman]

A friend suggested to me that the judge is against the jury trekking up there on foot because of liability issues. That's an interesting point, and probably true.

I just wonder if that could be considered prejudicial. "The walk is too dangerous for the court and the jury...but the defendant took his four year old child there."

 

[LaMer]

A friend suggested to me that the judge is against the jury trekking up there on foot because of liability issues. That's an interesting point, and probably true.

I just wonder if that could be considered prejudicial. "The walk is too dangerous for the court and the jury...but the defendant took his four year old child there."

Anita, very good point! Have to be careful too, as some of the jurors might be up there in their years or have a heart condition or some other kind of health condition. OMG wouldn't want one of the jurors keeling over from a heart attack. The trek is over a mile, and all up hill too!

I remember reading awhile back, the judge approved the trip, but said the jurors would be starting from a different point than where CB and Lauren began their hike, and closer to the area. (did I post this already?) :doh:

 

[tybee204]

Also it is August and the heat is miserable. Hiking a mile in August heat for anyone not in condition,elderly or with any pulmanary or heart condition is out of the question.

 

[LaMer]

Another LIE by CB!

http://www.dailybreeze.com/news/articles/3370826.html

No Longer available, but here is a snip

Earlier Monday, a friend of Brown's testified that Brown took measures to avoid being involved in Lauren's life.

Douglas Simonson said Brown told him that Lauren's mother, Sarah Key-Marer, was "accusing" him of fathering the girl but that Brown didn't think it was possible because he used protection during sex.

Simonson said Brown told him Key-Marer, a native of England, was trying to trap him so she could stay in the country. Brown broke up with Key-Marer soon after that, and did what he could to avoid her, changing his cellular telephone number, telling his employer not to accept calls for him and calling immigration officials to have Key-Marer deported, Simonson said.

Simonson said he told Brown he didn't think that was "very cool" because he would also be deporting his own child.

Brown responded: "Well, it's not mine," Simonson said.

Eventually, Simonson said Brown told him paternity was established and he started paying child support. Brown mentioned that someone from the court told him that he could reduce his payments if he applied for visitation, so he did.

The prosecution has presented evidence that purports to show Brown resented the financial imposition the child support was having on his outdoorsy, adventurous lifestyle.

Simonson described Brown as a "grown-up teenager that liked to have fun all the time." However, he also said that Brown introduced Lauren to him and Brown said it was "not that bad" having a daughter.

A week after Lauren's death, when Simonson said he learned about it, he said he called Brown.

"Hey dude, what's up?" was how Brown greeted him, Simonson said.

Simonson said he offered his condolences, and Brown replied: "Yeah, it was an awful accident, but you can't dwell on it forever. If you do, it will ruin your life."

Can't Dwell on it forever! Give me a break, people grieve all their lives when they lose a loved one, forever and ever! He is one heartless dude! :furious:

This was a very damaging day for CB, wouldn't ya say? Another LIE! A big playboy and "grown-up teenager"! I figure he is 47 now, also read where he had been employed for 14 years, so what did he do with all the other years? 47 and no money in the bank and looking at having his life-style and wallet curtailed by child support. :liar: and a :loser: going to :behindbar

I sure hope the jury is seeing him for what he is and what he did! Like I said before--WHY LIE unless he is covering for himself, right?

BIG LIES!

 

[jilly]

KFI today:

Def witness - Ian Brown - Cam's brother. Platoon sgt - Ca National guard on border patrol. In full uniform.

Said Cam never cared about money. He was an adventureous sort. Cam's lifestyle did not require money.

x'exam: Are you trying to sway the jury here - don't you have any other clothes to wear. Ans: I'm a staff sgt on active duty and it's regulation that I dress like this everywhere.

Ken/John point all all his hobbies costs a lot of money. Child support would have crippled his lifestye.

Def Witn - Jack - surfing buddy - says Cam toned down, surfed less when Lauren came along. Lots of hugs, took very good care of her. He could "see it in his eyes".

Interjection: When Cam's mother was on the stand she said Lauren would cry when she had to go back to her mom. Mother also accompanied Cameron to bereavment classes.

xexam of Jack - If Cam took such good care of her, how do you think she managd to fall off a cliff if that's what you believe.

Def wit Scott - buddy - told a story of their younger days when him and Cam drove around in a Van with a bowling ball. Scott opened the doors of Van and let the ball go down the street which almost caused damage. Cam was upset - said Why'd you do a stupid thing like that?

xexam - You haven't talked to CB for 10 years - how do you know what he's like today.

Def wit: Terry Hope. He was in the area of cliff and saw Cam and Lauren 4 times that day. Lauren was throwing grass and rocks - running 3-15 ft ahead of Cam, smiling, playing, on all 4s crawling having a good time.

xexam: only saw them half way up cliff. Also when initially interviewed by detective, when he first saw Cam, Cam looked at him oddly and he thought "something wasn't quite right". He thought it was suspicious.

Geragos will be concluding tomorrow - maybe the witness who claims to have heard Cam screaming, please don't die.

O/T regular court observer who usually sits in the courtroom and clips his fingernails was today reading a book from the library entitled Sex Life of Cannibals.

 

[jilly]

Forgot to add in cross of Cam's brother pros pointed out that Cam owned 2 boats a motorcycle and 2 1/2 Ton Army vehicle.

 

[Anita Richman]

Thanks for the update, Jilly!


(And "EWWW" to the court watcher! Well, at least it wasn't "Favorite Recipes of Cannibals", I guess.)