GUILTY CA - Michelle Hoang Thi Le, 26, Hayward, 27 May 2011

[slowpoke]

"The family also announced that the FBI is providing support to the Hayward Police Department investigation but cannot intervene unless the investigation crosses state lines."

Can someone explain what that means, exactly, regarding the role the FBI is playing in this case? Just an advisory role to the Hayward Police? Is that what it means?

Just saw the video there, and it says the FBI has offered "forensic assistance". What does that entail? Can anyone comment on that?

Other things from the article:
--it has been thanks to the donations from strangers that upped the reward money from $20,000 to $45,000!
--family will not receive an update until Monday
--she was born and raised in San Diego.
--moved to the Bay Area around 8 yrs ago to attend college at SFSU.
--has lived in Daly City, Oakland, and currently, San Mateo.

http://ranchobernardo.patch.com/articles/video-200-gather-in-support-of-missing-mt-carmel-high-grad

 

[jedi]

FBI might be in to help with computer and phone details? There is a local FBI office in the same city.

I find it interesting the police already arrested/detained someone under 24 hours of the disappearance.

 

[marycarney]

Thanks for this information. Michelle really is trusting, to leave her purse and wallet while she left the building! I'd never do that...Unless it was locked in a locker or someplace safe.

I thought she might have been at some type of seminar, where you have your purse and such stowed under the table you're sitting at - among friends/ classmates - and say "Hey, keep an eye on my purse, I'm gonna duck out to my car for a minute"

Which indicates to me that she never intended to DRIVE the car at all.

 

[evelyn24]

I thought she might have been at some type of seminar, where you have your purse and such stowed under the table you're sitting at - among friends/ classmates - and say "Hey, keep an eye on my purse, I'm gonna duck out to my car for a minute"

Which indicates to me that she never intended to DRIVE the car at all.

yes, and from a link posted back a bit it appears Giselle Esteban was initially arrested on kidnapping.


http://www.localcrimenews.com/lookup.php?jid=6052111

 

[jedi]

Which indicates to me that she never intended to DRIVE the car at all.

Or she didn't want anyone to know she was going do duck out somewhere. So leaving the purse behind was less obvious?

I do that at work when I want to duck out of the office to a quick store run on my break for snacks or to the post office. I don't have a purse but I leave discretely :crazy:

 

[Columbo]

"The family also announced that the FBI is providing support to the Hayward Police Department investigation but cannot intervene unless the investigation crosses state lines."

Can someone explain what that means, exactly, regarding the role the FBI is playing in this case? Just an advisory role to the Hayward Police? Is that what it means?

Just saw the video there, and it says the FBI has offered "forensic assistance". What does that entail? Can anyone comment on that?

Other things from the article:
--it has been thanks to the donations from strangers that upped the reward money from $20,000 to $45,000!
--family will not receive an update until Monday
--she was born and raised in San Diego.
--moved to the Bay Area around 8 yrs ago to attend college at SFSU.
--has lived in Daly City, Oakland, and currently, San Mateo.

http://ranchobernardo.patch.com/articles/video-200-gather-in-support-of-missing-mt-carmel-high-grad

The article also says she has a brown belt in martial arts--I'm not sure what level or rank that is, but it sounds like she would have been able to fight off an attacker.

Editing to add, I looked up "brown belt" online and couldn't quite figure out the grading system, but it sounds basically as if the brown is a higher-up rank.

 

[slowpoke]

Ah, I missed that piece of info, Colombo. Thanks for pointing it out.

My understanding is that a brown belt is the level just under a black belt. I would think she would be quite capable with that ranking. Gives me a little more hope!

The article also says she has a brown belt in martial arts--I'm not sure what level or rank that is, but it sounds like she would have been able to fight off an attacker.

Editing to add, I looked up "brown belt" online and couldn't quite figure out the grading system, but it sounds basically as if the brown is a higher-up rank.

 

[cluciano63]

Brown belt or no...where is she? I don't think physical strength or self-defense ability helps too much if someone is determined to harm you...

 

[marycarney]

Brown belt or no...where is she? I don't think physical strength or self-defense ability helps too much if someone is determined to harm you...

Yeah, a brown belt (unless made of Kevlar) doesn't stop a bullet

 

[cluciano63]

The fact that Michelle may have a brown belt doesn't seem to have affected the POI...who was found alive and well...I really fear Michelle has been murdered.

 

[Columbo]

Yeah, a brown belt (unless made of Kevlar) doesn't stop a bullet

Or a chemical means of overwhelming her...

 

[jedi]

Or a chemical means of overwhelming her...

I thought they only did that in the movies.

 

[cluciano63]

I thought they only did that in the movies.

Exactly where younger perps probably get their ideas...

 

[Herding Cats]

A quick note about martial arts, and levels/capabilities.

One can achieve a high rank, and not be a good fighter. Similarly, one can be a low level and be a great fighter. The difference is the person, and their level of "willingness", if it can be said like that.

I am a black belt in Tae Kwon Do, and have dabbled in other forms. I was an accomplished tournie fighter, and the one time I needed it on the street, I was successful. However, I regularly beat higher levels, because I am a more aggressive, no-holds-barred kinda fighter...

Most people are not that kind of fighter.

I have fought, in tournies, several opponents at once. It was tough, but I was able to "escape" (that was the goal of the exercise - to fight until you could get an opening and then leave). Most folks in that exercise do not "survive."

And we would do an exercise with the littler kids at the studio where an adult "kidnapped" the child, and the child's job was to get free. One 7 year old girl took me out - thumped me so hard in the eye I dropped her. LOL. Headbutts are a very effective tool if you can get one in.

I don't think it matters what level of martial arts you hold, or what type of martial artist you are, if you're not willing to go to the mat (e.g. die). Most people don't assess the situation accurately; they don't realize the danger, or, if they do realize the danger, they think going to a second place will help them survive. It doesn't...but it's the trap a lot of people fall into. Never, ever go with the bad guys, and fight with everything available to prevent being taken.

O.K., enough of that. Just a bit of an explanation about MAs, levels, and abilities. I don't care what level you have earned, if you are not the kind of person who is aggressive and willing to fight, and fight hard, you may not make it out of a situation. I can go from mild mannered, overweight middle aged female into a screaming raging whirling fury in less than a moment...most people can't.

In re: Michelle, I do suspect that she was taken by one single person, and that she was unable to defend herself to her level perhaps because of the type of person she is. That's not criticizing the victim; not at all. It's just what happens.

I wish there was more information forthcoming. I think, the longer we go without information, the more likely it is that there is a SK targeting young nursing students present in the Bay Area. Why? Because if it were a solitary incident, we'd be hearing more...we often hear "no need to worry" in situations, but we have not yet heard that here...and I don't know that we will.

Frankly, this is enough for me to have emailed a few folks in my nursing school, and asked them to be more aware and observant in their surroundings (e.g. not listening to ipods, on the phone, et cetera) while walking to class/clinicals.

I just hope I'm wrong.

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[cluciano63]

HC, they do seem to have a POI in Michelle's case, a young woman she knows or knew...over a personal matter dealing with a male. But if the POI does not pan out, I would tend to agree that there could be a serial...

 

[Herding Cats]

HC, they do seem to have a POI in Michelle's case, a young woman she knows or knew...over a personal matter dealing with a male. But if the POI does not pan out, I would tend to agree that there could be a serial...

You know, I thought about the POI. I'm not happy with her, if that makes sense. There is very little to indicate it's her, unless there is a lot of stuff they're withholding (and there may be). I mean, there are folks in my world who might say "I hate her openly" (my ex, for example), kwim?

It could be the POI, but I'm just not sure...and I don't think it will pan out. That's me guessing, and who knows the future? Not me, for sure...

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[cluciano63]

You know, I thought about the POI. I'm not happy with her, if that makes sense. There is very little to indicate it's her, unless there is a lot of stuff they're withholding (and there may be). I mean, there are folks in my world who might say "I hate her openly" (my ex, for example), kwim?

It could be the POI, but I'm just not sure...and I don't think it will pan out. That's me guessing, and who knows the future? Not me, for sure...

Best-
Herding Cats

I guess I have come to the point where if LE actually names someone as a POI, I am all over it, due to cases such as Kyron's where they absolutely refuse to do so, even when they have clearly spent a year investigating a person. But I also know ever jurisdiction is different and uses different standards to decide when they will name someone. I guess I am assuming they have more here than the fact that these two young women had a disagreement.

 

[Columbo]

I believe they also have more than one POI, but they've only named one of them, Giselle Esteban, and that was because she turned herself in to the media. Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm sure I read that.

 

[MLE]

Martial arts skills are better than no skills, but if outnumbered or of the opponent has a lot more practical experience, I don't think it's as valuable.

When I was in school, a small guy who was always in fights somehow ended up in a fight with another guy who was known for having a black belt. I don't know if the guy with the black belt had ever been a real fight and I don't know why this one even started, but all I saw was the tail end of the fight where the little guy with tons of real fighting experience and no belt had the guy with the black belt in a headlock and was ramming his head into the wall.

Several years later, I saw three latino gang members completely demolish four US soldiers in a fight in a cantina. It obviously wasn't these gang members' first rodeo. The soldiers needed some air support or a tank.

I think black belts may sometimes give people a false sense of security. When I lived in Seoul, I preferred to take a long route walking to and from work since the direct route went right through a major red light district and the Koreans can get rather hostile when they see a foreigner in a red light district. One evening soon after the place where I worked had hired a new guy and when we got off work, we were walking together and he headed straight home (we lived in the same apartment building). I told him we should go to one of the adjacent streets to avoid the red light district and all of the associated hostility and confrontation. He replied, "I'm not worried! I have a black belt..." ...in some martial art and I can't remember which one he said. Jujitsu or something. But jeez, everybody and their cousin in Korea knows martial arts and it's not going to do any good anyway during a twelve on one curb stomp.

It makes me wonder if Ms. Le didn't take adequate precautions because of a false sense of security from the brown belt.

 

[Mimi K]

Back to POI -- I heard 2 different reports (maybe bad journalism) that final cell phone pings were Saturday morning, one said from the POI's area, one said from the canyon area. Moot point, as the 2 locations are very close, 2-3 miles apart at closest points. And could be suspicious that POI started blabbing to press right away - "yes I hate her openly, but I didn't do this." Yet, the similarities with the other case farther north are scary.....def pointing to SK.