Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020 #4

[Rachelj1]

Bet one of them is "Grandma". The one who the other four kids were on vacation with, and who last saw Orrin & Orson. Wonder if she's paternal or maternal.

I think the same thing!
Moo

 

[Rachelj1]

Bet one of them is "Grandma". The one who the other four kids were on vacation with, and who last saw Orrin & Orson. Wonder if she's paternal or maternal.

I think the same thing!
Moo

It really does bother me how differently the biological mother and the adoptive parents were behaving on their respective interviews.

The biological mother was frantic, inconsolable, it took her a minute to be able to get some words out. She lost custody of these kids while they were still very little, and she hasn’t seen them in maybe two years, I’m guessing.

The adoptive parents don’t seem fazed at all. Not even with accusations and hostility towards them. Orson and Orrin disappeared while under they care. Where is the concern? And with all of that people screaming at them, how can they stay so calm and collected? I would be crying and begging those people to believe me and help me find my kids. Why was it just “yes, we understand why the biological family is upset, thanks”? Come on.

Because the biological mom was showing true emotion IMO . The AP don’t really care .

moo

 

[Knox]

The document is about lifting restrictions and instead allowing foster parents to exercise prudence etc. Some examples it gives are

“activities such as sports and extracurricular events, getting haircuts, staying over with friends”

Then it goes on to explain about training to support people in exercising that prudence etc.

We shall agree to differ

https://cdss.ca.gov/lettersnotices/EntRes/getinfo/acl/2016/16-31.pdf

Maybe this is helpful? http://policy.dcfs.lacounty.gov/Content/Attachments/010057005_att3.pdf

 

[MoeInVA]

Just curious, why do you think Grandma W has been helpful ? Has anyone spoken to her on record ?

No media has talked to Grandma W to my knowledge. As I said, just speculation but it is based on:
- the West family statements (said they fully cooperated, very deliberately distanced from parents)
- the fact that the West family was silent in media/social from the first missing report (no pleas for the missing boys made me think they immediately knew something wasn’t right)
- the fact that the West family did not immediately echo the parents’ story

As others pointed out upthread, even Letecia Stauch had her family defending her for awhile before the investigation took a turn. The same cannot be said here IMO.

I suspect they have just told LE the truth. And whatever their truth is, it is such that they were not acting how one would expect if they believed that their grandchildren had wandered off or were abducted. JMO

 

[Dawookie]

I am thinking perhaps the bio mother might have been given the lie detector test?? A neighbour? Adopted grandparents?

I think it's a safe bet to say the adoptive grandparents were asked to unless they have information about others

 

[MsBetsy]

Can we tell if it looks like a family friendly pooch or some sort of a guard dog? (Could be both of course)

Amateur opinion and speculation

I couldn't actually see it but at one point the neighbor says, there is the dog, or that's the dog (behind the fence.) It probably just looks like a dark shadow through the fence. I can't remember at what point he said it but I think it was while the dad was outside under the tree waiting for police. The neighbor points out that "they are not even looking" for any kids.

It's very hard to see anything clearly in that video.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Delete please

 

[Frodosdojo]

Agreed. Some of these folks seem to be true “characters” I’ll be interested to see if and who takes a lie detector, and if anyone shakes out to be part of this tragic situation. I’m hoping to hear of searches happening at at least one of these homes in particular, moo.

Yes, indeed ! I like how you described them as characters. We just don't know if they have already been searched or not. I hope they have already searched all the homes and the apartments in Bakersfield. But Chief did say they work going from most adjacent outwards.

 

[Jo in Calif]

ADMIN NOTE:

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Bump

 

[MoeInVA]

Bayan reported that Police confirmed they:

• Searched adoptive parents previous properties in Bakersfield
• https://www.turnto23.com/news/local...-city-boys-adoptive-parents-officials-confirm

 

[Dre]

Does anyone recall what “silver saddle ranch” is and why they would search it?
I wonder if the Bakersfield sightings by grandma and someone else was back when they lived there or more recently for a visit.. I don’t think we will know for awhile though moo.
https://www.turnto23.com/news/local...-city-boys-adoptive-parents-officials-confirm

 

[MoeInVA]

Does anyone recall what “saddle back ranch” is and why they would search it?
I wonder if the Bakersfield sightings by grandma and someone else was back when they lived there or more recently for a visit.. I don’t think we will know for awhile though moo.
https://www.turnto23.com/news/local...-city-boys-adoptive-parents-officials-confirm

There was a citizen tip which could be heard during the 12/29 press conference which referenced a sighting of a vehicle like TW’s heading back from the ranch I believe. We don’t know if there was further corroboration of that to support the large search effort there a few weeks later or if they were just checking it off the list.

 

[rosesfromangels]

There was a citizen tip which could be heard during the 12/29 press conference which referenced a sighting of a vehicle like TW’s heading back from the ranch I believe. We don’t know if there was further corroboration of that to support the large search effort there a few weeks later or if they were just checking it off the list.

White vans are a dime a dozen, but the heavily tinted windows are a bit unique.

Amateur opinion and speculation

 

[MsBetsy]

I couldn't actually see it but at one point the neighbor says, there is the dog, or that's the dog (behind the fence.) It probably just looks like a dark shadow through the fence. I can't remember at what point he said it but I think it was while the dad was outside under the tree waiting for police. The neighbor points out that "they are not even looking" for any kids.

It's very hard to see anything clearly in that video.

Oops, sorry. I guess we aren't supposed to mention what is said in the video.

So the answer to the question is that the dog cannot be seen clearly through the fence.

 

[Frodosdojo]

Does anyone recall what “saddle back ranch” is and why they would search it?
I wonder if the Bakersfield sightings by grandma and someone else was back when they lived there or more recently for a visit.. I don’t think we will know for awhile though moo.
https://www.turnto23.com/news/local...-city-boys-adoptive-parents-officials-confirm

It's Silver Saddle Ranch.

 

[Rachelj1]

True that.

I think maybe a little of both Bc I’ve always felt TW is the “boss”. I think she’s definitely nervous and may even feel a tiny bit bad, BUT I’f they are responsible for these little boys being diceased she has had so much time to come clean. So many different choices could of been made . It bothers me too that they have 6 boys . I know when you foster children you can ask for age group and sex that you would prefer .

moo

 

[wary]

It really does bother me how differently the biological mother and the adoptive parents were behaving on their respective interviews.

The biological mother was frantic, inconsolable, it took her a minute to be able to get some words out. She lost custody of these kids while they were still very little, and she hasn’t seen them in maybe two years, I’m guessing.

The adoptive parents don’t seem fazed at all. Not even with accusations and hostility towards them. Orson and Orrin disappeared while under they care. Where is the concern? And with all of that people screaming at them, how can they stay so calm and collected? I would be crying and begging those people to believe me and help me find my kids. Why was it just “yes, we understand why the biological family is upset, thanks”? Come on.

I wouldn’t draw any conclusions until I knew how they usually reacted to extremely stressful situations. And I certainly am not going to think of the bio-family as any model of how to behave!

 

[Frodosdojo]

Thankyou. I was hoping someone might have referenced the dogs name

I would like to know that, too, from an official source. TW did say in the press conference that the kids were playing with "Chalk".

 

[elliefant]

I wonder if they wanted all boys to save money via hand-me-downs maybe?

 

[MsBetsy]

I think maybe a little of both Bc I’ve always felt TW is the “boss”. I think she’s definitely nervous and may even feel a tiny bit bad, BUT I’f they are responsible for these little boys being diceased she has had so much time to come clean. So many different choices could of been made . It bothers me too that they have 6 boys . I know when you foster children you can ask for age group and sex that you would prefer .

moo

It could just be a coincidence that they had only boys or it could be that they didn't have enough bedrooms to accommodate girls.

And yes, I thought TW came across as being more authoritative and in control. He prompted JW at the beginning and reminded her what to say and then again when she stumbled on the word "assumptions."

It seemed as if he took the lead and she backed him up with a few statements. If there is anything they haven't told investigators, she may end up being the one to do it.

IMO