Still Missing CA - Orson & Orrin West (3&4), California City, 21 Dec 2020 #4

[MoeInVA]

That's what I thought, I wonder why they'd print she was still in the boys lives

Media Stoking the flames... hoping to get the adopted family to speak up?? Just a thought.

 

[Knox]

Reportedly, two search warrants were previously requested and issued by a judge, granting LE authorization to search the residence and surrounding property. However, the warrants would have identified the property, area, and specifically noted what they were looking for. The grounds were reportedly excavated and the boys were not located. These searches were executed more than a month ago and police have taken any evidence granted under the warrants.

Police have not taken extended custody of this property -- sealed it off as a crime scene, preventing anybody including the owners from accessing their property because the constitution protects owners from such measures.

I believe a large number of people do not believe the boys ever resided in California City, and that the boys disappeared before the family moved to their new residence. Except for the statements by the parents that the boys disappeared from the backyard, I'm unaware of any evidence that proves their statements true or that the home was ever a crime scene!

I understand the owners voluntarily left their property after receiving death threats, and not absent because the house is under seizure by authorities. MOO

Bayan Wang 23ABC
01/22/2021
UPDATE: Authorities are also investigating inside the home, but police chief unable to disclose further.
----
INVESTIGATION: Authorities from various agencies are gathering "statistical" data Friday of the perimeter of the California City home where two toddler brothers were reporting missing. Cal City Police Chief Jon Walker told me they are using drone imaging and also gathering more information of the back gate of the home, which the adoptive parents of the boys said was left open, when the boys went missing Dec. 21.
PC: Jamie White






The fourth and most recent search warrant was served on January 22, 2021.

 

[Dawookie]

I believe that RD or her people most likely misspoke to ABC and they printed the recent story before completely vetting the facts. ABC gave promo-billing on Thurs/Friday that GMA Saturday would feature RD, bio-mom of the missing boys. I think the producer learned too late that the story they printed did not check out. I believe the result was GMA airing 5-seconds of RD video and filling the remaining allotted segment with clips of old news.

Just to be clear, I think RD is a victim here with the knowledge that the beautiful children she gave birth to probably met with foul play. I also think she may be surrounded by individuals that are giving her bad advice, instead of supporting and comforting her, and that's an added tragedy.

MOO

That could be. Just seemed odd to me that they would print that despite all the information being out there

 

[Seattle1]

That could be. Just seemed odd to me that they would print that despite all the information being out there

I found it peculiar that the incorrect data originated at such a late date with the same ABC correspondents linked to GMA story --albeit a month after their local ABC affiliates knew better. Maybe the locals gave them the heads up. IMO, I think they were relieved they killed the (bogus) GMA story before it aired.

 

[DeDee]

Admittedly, I am not all that familiar with minute details of this case; however, I did watch a few news videos including Tricia's special on Jan. 14.

Two very cute little boys move into a new neighborhood in September but none of the neighbors saw them in 3 months? :Red Flag:

If they disappeared before the move, that could explain the reason for moving to a different area or being able to afford to move or, in order to, place a span of time since their actual disappearance. If the boys have been gone for months, instead of weeks, that should provide the foster parents ample time to develop an airtight story yet... Perhaps they postponed announcing their disappearance due to obtaining continued financial support payments.

It appears Chief Walker suspected foul play straight away. He revealed in a Bayan Wang interview on Jan 21 that they have POI(s) and admitted trafficking is a possibility. Trained scent dogs did not detect the scent of the boys outside of the home.

Not blindly but I do support the Foster Care System. Recently, I viewed an awesome movie about Foster Parents titled "The Ride." It's an inspiring true story of a BMX champion who overcame an abusive childhood through the love and life lessons of his interracial foster family.
Ride (2018) - IMDb

The father told the realtor that sold them the current home that they had four children.

 

[MadTing]

Here's why I refute that speculation. An accident with one of the children....maybe. But two?! Really hard to fathom.

Amateur opinion and speculation

If one of kids were a witness to an accident happening to the other child then i could see why they AP's would not want either one around to be questioned by LE.

 

[kittythehare]

While this is more likely focused on prostitution of vulnerable victims (usually girls 11-13 yrs. old), I certainly hope LE is investigating whether any of these Perps had any ties (financial or otherwise), to the subjects of this threads investigation.

Yes, I believe the boys were sold. For what, I shudder to speculate.

https://www.turnto23.com/news/local-news/bpd-operation-underway-at-desert-star-motel-on-s-union-ave

Amateur opinion and speculation

I do as well.

 

[Inquisitive2018]

I’m playing catch-up so if this was already explained please scroll on.

Can you elaborate on your statement more for me please?

I just feel the boys are no longer with us and whoever is responsible had enough time to clean up and cover their tracks. Of course I'm not sure what cops actually have.

 

[imstilla.grandma]

While this is more likely focused on prostitution of vulnerable victims (usually girls 11-13 yrs. old), I certainly hope LE is investigating whether any of these Perps had any ties (financial or otherwise), to the subjects of this threads investigation.

Yes, I believe the boys were sold. For what, I shudder to speculate.

https://www.turnto23.com/news/local-news/bpd-operation-underway-at-desert-star-motel-on-s-union-ave

Amateur opinion and speculation

I believe the same. I’ve had that gut reaction since the beginning of my research into Kern County’s crime. It’s off the chain. Way too dang many Fed/FBI/DOJ involved arrests including undercover stings, drug busts, trafficking operatives, financial property fraud, welfare fraud, firearms, prostitution etc. and the list goes on. These kids are long gone. Either dead by now or worse! Whatever happened, it’s gonna be all about the almighty dollar. Greed and Sloth at the very least...

 

[MoeInVA]

Great list, Moe. I have a couple questions to add as well.

• Why did the parents lie about all six children leaving the house with them on the 19th to go Christmas shopping?
• Where did the parents tell grandma O&O were when they dropped off the other four children?
• Is the grandmother being truthful about the last time she saw O&O?
• What was the family's plan for Christmas? ie: Were the other 4 children supposed to come back home for the holiday? Was the family going to gather in Bakersfield? How long had this "vacation" been planned?

More questions reporters should ask to add to our rolling lists.

• Have all the grandparents’ homes and yard(s) in Bakersfield been searched with cadaver and SAR dogs?
• If TW and JW had foster children in the home, when was the last home visit by a social worker? When is the last time a social worker laid eyes on O and O? There should have been a home study of the new house with all occupants present, did that occur?
• Is everyone in the case still cooperating?
• Have any family members refused interviews or searches?
• Has any evidence been recovered to suggest their were illicit drugs in the TW and JW home?

 

[musemoon]

You seem to be very “matter of fact” with the rules & procedures of DHS & fostering. I appreciate an inside view of the system do you by chance specialize in this field?

I wish it was as cut & dry as you describe but I lived through the opposite myself.

I have a couple questions for you if I may? While the West were living in Bakersfield they lived in a 3 bedroom apt with 8 people. When I was in the system we were only allowed so many in each bedroom based on the size of the room. Is it still this way? Would that apt be approved during all the home visits? Was it ok for the West to home school the other foster children?

TIA I really appreciate your thoughts.

I am a foster/adoptive parent currently being recertified to adopt through foster care in Los Angeles county. Because I love kids and not for the money, trust me!!!! I have two foster/adoptive children and I am still friends with their DCFS workers who have told me a lot about their caseloads (both no longer work with DCFS). I have also taught classes to prospective foster/adoptive parents to help educate them about the needs of foster adopted children. Highly traumatized kids have severe behaviors at times, they need care, patience, and therapy, but it shouldn't discourage parents from wanting to give these kids homes.

I will say I know nothing about the particulars in this case, I only know the way California DCFS works. I have great empathy for the birth mother as I'm sure she loved her sons and is in deep pain losing them. I don't think birth parents understand how serious they have to be with DCFS. I have heard horror stories on both sides.

Recently, I think it was in 2019 DCFS increased the number of children that could be in one bedroom from two to four children of the same sex. They each have to have a closet, dresser, or wardrobe. It depends on the caseworker and the need in that county, but you can have up to six children in one three-bedroom home, however, six is the maximum amount of children you can have under a certain age. I think the West's were at their limit as far as DCFS is concerned.

I don't know what happened to the boys, obviously, they didn't just walk out of their home. It's hard for me to think that if they had so much interaction with DCFS that they could get away with ongoing abuse but maybe. With everyone in the family fostering it's just really hard for me to think that ongoing abuse could happen, but maybe it did. I have no idea what happened, I just know what the current DCFS procedures are (they were modified because of the Gabriel Fernandez case) because I am currently working with DCFS.

They can't homeschool the foster kids, but we are all on lockdown in CA so everyone is going to school remotely. I would assume the kids were on Zoom with their teachers, but I don't know.

Here is the home inspection checklist
Your California Foster Care Home Inspection Checklist – Alternative Family Services

 

[kittythehare]

I am a foster/adoptive parent currently being recertified to adopt through foster care in Los Angeles county. Because I love kids and not for the money, trust me!!!! I have two foster/adoptive children and I am still friends with their DCFS workers who have told me a lot about their caseloads (both no longer work with DCFS). I have also taught classes to prospective foster/adoptive parents to help educate them about the needs of foster adopted children. Highly traumatized kids have severe behaviors at times, they need care, patience, and therapy, but it shouldn't discourage parents from wanting to give these kids homes.

I will say I know nothing about the particulars in this case, I only know the way California DCFS works. I have great empathy for the birth mother as I'm sure she loved her sons and is in deep pain losing them. I don't think birth parents understand how serious they have to be with DCFS. I have heard horror stories on both sides.

Recently, I think it was in 2019 DCFS increased the number of children that could be in one bedroom from two to four children of the same sex. They each have to have a closet, dresser, or wardrobe. It depends on the caseworker and the need in that county, but you can have up to six children in one three-bedroom home, however, six is the maximum amount of children you can have under a certain age. I think the West's were at their limit as far as DCFS is concerned.

I don't know what happened to the boys, obviously, they didn't just walk out of their home. It's hard for me to think that if they had so much interaction with DCFS that they could get away with ongoing abuse but maybe. With everyone in the family fostering it's just really hard for me to think that ongoing abuse could happen, but maybe it did. I have no idea what happened, I just know what the current DCFS procedures are (they were modified because of the Gabriel Fernandez case) because I am currently working with DCFS.

Here is the home inspection checklist
Your California Foster Care Home Inspection Checklist – Alternative Family Services

Thanks for the great information.
Do you happen to know whether a case worker or whoever it is that allocated the children will be questioned if something serious occurs, like the children disappearing?
Are any disciplinary measures taken if omissions are discovered that should have been red flags from the outset but were disregarded due to need or some other reason?

 

[rosesfromangels]

I speculate that with COVID concerns, some of the inspections that the Foster/adoptive agency provides have been curtailed, reduced, or modified. Unfortunately, this may result in tragedies, as this case appears to be. Who was the case worker for these four placed children, and does the public have access to their routine (?) reports?
How did they not know 2 kids weren’t around?

Whomever is responsible for the disappearance of these children WILL be brought to justice soon. The community is not going to let this one go, or dwindle in to a memory.

amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Ontario Mom]

I am a foster/adoptive parent currently being recertified to adopt through foster care in Los Angeles county. Because I love kids and not for the money, trust me!!!! I have two foster/adoptive children and I am still friends with their DCFS workers who have told me a lot about their caseloads (both no longer work with DCFS). I have also taught classes to prospective foster/adoptive parents to help educate them about the needs of foster adopted children. Highly traumatized kids have severe behaviors at times, they need care, patience, and therapy, but it shouldn't discourage parents from wanting to give these kids homes.

I will say I know nothing about the particulars in this case, I only know the way California DCFS works. I have great empathy for the birth mother as I'm sure she loved her sons and is in deep pain losing them. I don't think birth parents understand how serious they have to be with DCFS. I have heard horror stories on both sides.

Recently, I think it was in 2019 DCFS increased the number of children that could be in one bedroom from two to four children of the same sex. They each have to have a closet, dresser, or wardrobe. It depends on the caseworker and the need in that county, but you can have up to six children in one three-bedroom home, however, six is the maximum amount of children you can have under a certain age. I think the West's were at their limit as far as DCFS is concerned.

I don't know what happened to the boys, obviously, they didn't just walk out of their home. It's hard for me to think that if they had so much interaction with DCFS that they could get away with ongoing abuse but maybe. With everyone in the family fostering it's just really hard for me to think that ongoing abuse could happen, but maybe it did. I have no idea what happened, I just know what the current DCFS procedures are (they were modified because of the Gabriel Fernandez case) because I am currently working with DCFS.

Here is the home inspection checklist
Your California Foster Care Home Inspection Checklist – Alternative Family Services

Your personal experience is especially helpfull in understanding the foster system in this case, so thank you for taking the time to share. It's very much appreciated.

jmo

 

[MsMarple]

The boys weren’t at the grandmother’s home prior to the West home. The lady standing next to RD was the prior Foster mom whom RD developed a friendship with & was able to visit with the boys & bonding with them.

The boys were then taken from her home & placed with T&J West with what sounded like continued supervised visits at DHS until the last court visit before adoption.

The above is my own words from listening to the interviews with Bio mom in the archives.

Thanks for that correction. I think I got misled by an early msm report that said the boys were with their bio grandmother at one point but removed from her care. I don't know if that was a separate time or if the reporter made the same mistake that I did and assumed the foster lady was the grandmother. I've been looking for that story but it may have been overwritten. If I find it I'll post.

 

[Doghairrules]

I’ve thought about this too. Do you think they would go this long without coming forward though ?

i hate to be the wet blanket but scenarios like this are always theorized in missing kid cases and I can’t remember one time when it turned out to be true that something happened accidentally and the parents panicked. So as much as I wish that were the case here, I seriously doubt it is.

 

[ChatteringBirds]

I can’t remember one time when it turned out to be true that something happened accidentally and the parents panicked.

Quote RSBM.
I also can't remember any case of an actual accident leading to panicked cover-up. ETA: At least never heard one where the parents staged a kidnapping.

 

[floridamomma]

Does either of the parents work outside of the home? When I was a case manager under the auspices of the DA, I worked with school-aged children and their parents. I made frequent home visits and found that families took in foster care and many of the parents did not work outside the home. Red flags for case managers.

Why would that be a red flag?!

 

[imstilla.grandma]

https://missingkidsla.org/
Edit: Notice you can sort by column headings: sort by age and you will see how many runaway babies in the system. 5 months? 7 month? Detained babies? Also we have children 121 years old. What a joke!
Los Angeles County's Missing Foster Children ... LA Community Policing

Can we find a site like this for Kern county?
Child Protective Services Statistical Reports | Kern County, CA - Department of Human Services

Children in Foster Care - Kidsdata.org

 

[floridamomma]

Does either of the parents work outside of the home? When I was a case manager under the auspices of the DA, I worked with school-aged children and their parents. I made frequent home visits and found that families took in foster care and many of the parents did not work outside the home. Red flags for case managers.

Why would that be a red flag?!

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