Found Deceased CA - Rachel Nguyen, 20, & Joseph Orbeso, 21, Joshua Tree Nat'l Park, 27 July 2017 #1

[cvaldez1975]

I really feel someone upthread was right, they were looking for water and caught a flash flood. there was rain a few days after they were last seen.

Maybe one slipped into a crevice and got stuck, and the other then fell trying to help. Maybe the heat and lack of water removed all possible chance of survival after 2-3 days of walking, and they crawled into a cave. Maybe a wild cat with babes chased and got them. Maybe they did walk towards the lights on the highway, but ran out of steam and succumbed to the elements in the open desert and just haven't been spotted. Maybe maybe maybe. We really do not know anything right now.

 

[Force Ten]

Phones "ping" on towers to communicate that the phone is in the proximity of that tower so calls will be routed through the closest tower for the best connection.

Phones send the pings out frequently so that if the phone changes location, the tower will change too, again to allow for the best connection.

Sometimes if one tower has too much traffic, calls will be routed through another tower that is farther away, usually the previous tower that the phone pinged on.

Phone companies are able to ping phones from towers, also. Law enforcement is able to use this to attempt to locate people who could be in danger.

The ping from the cell phone in this situation means that at the time of that ping, the phone was able to communicate with the tower. No one would have to be using the phone for this to happen since the phone is always seeking a tower connection for service.

In theory, if the areas in the park where cell phone reception is present are known, this could help narrow down the possible location of the missing couple. However in reality, it probably doesn't really narrow it down by much.

The phone's battery will drain much faster in areas where connection is spotty due to the constant search for a signal.

All of what you stated I have read to be true. But different articles I've come across have stated the opposite, one of recent, that only outgoing calls and texts would ping a tower. Ping data is thoroughly confusing.

 

[Force Ten]

It struck me that even if they had lost the path or lost sight of the road by going behind an outcrop of rocks, wouldn't it be possible for them to find their way back to the road by walking towards the sound of traffic on Park Boulevard? Wouldn't other people have parked up at the trailhead or along the road if only to take photos?

From memory of being in the desert in Jordan, sound does carry further than you expect simply because there are few other sounds to drown it out.

Also, the prevailing wind would be from the west so it would carry traffic sound eastwards towards the trail.

If you were in between the road and a set of rock outcroppings, yes maybe. Once away from any large rocks, sound deadens quite drastically in the desert.

 

[Force Ten]

North View Trail. This the possible trail they may have gone through. Beautiful but you can see how unforgiving and how it beat down one's determination if lost out there without water and exhausted.

[video=youtube;pT_ctbgubRE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pT_ctbgubRE[/video]


Boy Scout Trail from Indian Cove. This trail intersects with Big Pine Trail that connects to the Maze Trail about where the footprints were located.

[video=youtube;312dpNFa--A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=312dpNFa--A&t=312s[/video]

 

[Satchie]

Thanks for the links. If I was overcome by the heat, I'd probably crawl into a crevice under one of those irregular boulders to get a bit of relief from the sun.

 

[yannick_1709]

I was thinking about making a Google Earth/Maps Map with all clues so far (I guess it is easier to get an overview), as soon as I've got the time. Do you think it would be useful here?

 

[GigTu]

The map would be useful, and I hope you make it. But what information could go on it since we only know a couple of things.... hmmmm

 

[GigTu]

Is any of that vegetation in those videos edible? Also, mines were mentioned. If they explored one they may have run into trouble. Did searchers check them all, as well as all the giant rock formations (boulder crevices) and caves?

 

[Force Ten]

Is any of that vegetation in those videos edible?

Not to my knowledge. Any of it would probably be bitter.

 

[Jenjen37]

You can eat some types of cactus. Right?

Not to my knowledge. Any of it would probably be bitter.

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[thekarmabus]

Is any of that vegetation in those videos edible? Also, mines were mentioned. If they explored one they may have run into trouble. Did searchers check them all, as well as all the giant rock formations (boulder crevices) and caves?

The only cactus that is edible would be the prickly pear. Palo verde, Indian paintbrush,chia (salvia),catclaw.. a few I know. They are not going to give you much in way of hydration. There are enough snakes out there to kill and eat. It's the dehydration that will kill you not lack of food.
I would hope all mine shafts and caves were searched or are being searched. ..


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[yannick_1709]

So, I think I'm finished with the first version of the map. I'll be posting a .kmz download link on my Google Drive (for use with Google Earth) and a Maps version. The maps version will be lacking the topographical overlays though, so for best overview you should use the Earth version. Coming in a few minutes!

 

[Force Ten]

This is at the end of the North View Trail video. Dollarjoint cacti. I can't find anything to state that this particular species is edible.

 

[AffirmationChick]

Not sure what you mean about red 22 and 23? If I knew what map they were using I could be sure where it's at. I'm pretty certain that the "?" on the trail is where they found them. Also the squiggly lines seem to be trackers on foot and the straighter lines, helicopters. The trackers stayed to the trails and choppers the open areas. It does look like they hit every possible route. But it looks like the mark for the "two set of tracks" seem to be just before the North View Trail and this coincides with the report stating that the tracks seemed to be heading into a canyon heading north. But they didn't find anything in that canyon. I could understand searchers frustration after so many days, and by this map alone it seems this was all done in one day, July 30th. I'm surprised they let family members come out and help in the search as this is rarely allowed but still very comforting.

Sometimes I should go to bed instead of posting, ha. Fuller explanation: the grid boxes throughout the map are numbered in small red lettering. The numbers on both maps matched, which makes them a reference point to use the maps together. Because I'm on my phone, I couldn't do what I really needed to compare.

Some of the straight lines are wilderness boundaries, which those tracks fall outside of.

Excited for the forthcoming (or maybe posted by now) map of our reference points done better than mine!


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[yannick_1709]

I decided to make a new post instead of making an edit of the older one. Here you go:

I will try to keep the map updated, so criticism/new information is welcome.

I hope I'm not violating any rules here, but I can't find anything about linking to filehosting sites.
Edit: Ok, here the links:

• https://drive.google.com/open?id=1cnCYV0wQ0sMgHoMuy3JAEwtSxBQ - This is the map on Google Maps and will open a Google Maps page, although I would advise you to use the file below, as Maps doesn't allow overlays.
• https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B4V0ri-0rHPdeHlGeU94UTNRb2M (18 MB)- Here the .kmz-file (download). To open it you will need either Google Earth on your PC/Mac or Google Chrome.

To open in the file in Chrome, go to https://earth.google.com/web/ and start the web Version. Klick on the bookmark sign and choose "import KML-file". Upload the KMZ and you're good to go.

Explanation of the contents:

• Car: probable path after entering the park to the parking space
• Topos: two topographical maps of the area (taken from the JTNP site)
• 2 sets of tracks: the found tracks
• trails: the trails in that area.
• verizon tower: coverage from a Verizon tower in that area (found on http://www.otherhand.org)

 

[Force Ten]

I decided to make a new post instead of making an edit of the older one. Here you go:

I will try to keep the map updated, so criticism/new information is welcome.

I hope I'm not violating any rules here, but I can't find anything about linking to filehosting sites.
Edit: Ok, here the links:

• https://drive.google.com/open?id=1cnCYV0wQ0sMgHoMuy3JAEwtSxBQ - This is the map on Google Maps and will open a Google Maps page, although I would advise you to use the file below, as Maps doesn't allow overlays.
• https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B4V0ri-0rHPdeHlGeU94UTNRb2M (18 MB)- Here the .kmz-file (download). To open it you will need either Google Earth on your PC/Mac or Google Chrome.

To open in the file in Chrome, go to https://earth.google.com/web/ and start the web Version. Klick on the bookmark sign and choose "import KML-file". Upload the KMZ and you're good to go.

Explanation of the contents:

• Car: probable path after entering the park to the parking space
• Topos: two topographical maps of the area
• 2 sets of tracks: the found tracks
• trails: the trails in that area.
• verizon tower: coverage from a Verizon tower in that area (found on http://www.otherhand.org)

LOVE THIS!!!!!!


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[Force Ten]

Sometimes I should go to bed instead of posting, ha. Fuller explanation: the grid boxes throughout the map are numbered in small red lettering. The numbers on both maps matched, which makes them a reference point to use the maps together. Because I'm on my phone, I couldn't do what I really needed to compare.

Some of the straight lines are wilderness boundaries, which those tracks fall outside of.

Excited for the forthcoming (or maybe posted by now) map of our reference points done better than mine!


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I often post too soon before I finish my first first cup of coffee which results me later yelling "Cr*p cr*p cr*p!!! That's not what I meant to say!" LOL


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[yannick_1709]

Thanks!

So, looking at the map it seems if the two were actually in that canyon they found the footprints in, there's not many directions to go - only southeast, southwest and north. If they took one of the southern routes, they should have been found by now, right?

 

[yannick_1709]

I managed to find out some more about pings here: http://www.otherhand.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Ewasko-ping-discussion.pdf

First of all, what's a "ping"?
A ping is the lay term for what's technically called a "registration". It's the procedure a cellphone goes through when connecting itself to the cellular system, and it is very involved. There's a whole pile of different data packets that get exchanged between the cell tower and mobile phone before registration is complete. Things like synchronizing time, serial numbers, channel to use, power levels, what other towers are around, is the one it's connecting to the best, and so on. Once that's done and the tower and handset are both happy, the phone is registered. And that's before a call is even made.

In the case of Verizon, there about 10 different ways a phone can do a registration. For example, a phone registers one way when it's first turned on, sort of like, "Hi world, I just turned on!! What's new?". Another type of registration occurs when a phone is turned off, when it says, "Good bye, my annoying owner is shutting me down!". There's also a timer-based registration where every 5 to 15 minutes (depending on the cell system's settings) the phone checks in and says, "Hey tower, just wanted to let you know I'm still here, ya know, just incase!". And the last registration I'll mention is zone based registration where the phone goes,"Ooooh, I hear a new tower! I just wanted to let you know, Mr. Tower, I'm new in your reception area and I'm eager and willing to please!", after which the phone goes into a standby mode doing the timer registrations.

This is for the Verizon-system on another case, but it seems to confirm that a ping only means the phone was turned on and connected to a tower.

 

[Elainera]

I have two questions that probably sound stupid for experienced hikers, but here goes:

It was said that they haven't found anything left behind by Rachel and Joseph, like food wrappers, bottles, or any other discarded item. Now I'm wondering, there are 1000s of visitors coming to this park all the time, even now in the summer heat. Surely at least some people will leave some trash behind or lose something, for example a piece of clothing, along their hike. And likely searchers have come across those items during their search. How do they know that they were definitely not left behind by Rachel and Joseph?

Second question is, how do they know the two sets of footprints are Rachel's and Joseph's and were not made by other hikers? Because the dogs were alerting on them?