cadaver dog hits in Irwin home~search warrant served on family home #5

[MissJames]

You guys are so fast! I am not all the way caught up so please forgive if these are repeat questions.

1. This recently-dug dirt in the back yard -- is this something that they just recently found? It seems they've been combing the whole area for such a long time that they would have found it much sooner. Did they find it a couple of weeks ago and we are just now seeing it on their report?

2. The one thing that keeps sticking in my mind is, if you have a sick or deceased baby (geez it's hard even to write that), why would you put the body on the floor when you've got a perfectly good bed right there? Could be perhaps because someone else (an asleep son?) was on the bed and she didn't want him to see?

I was holding it together up til now but I feel kinda like I'm gonna cry, or maybe be sick.

I've been on both sides of the fence as well as balanced on top, but I will say that the mom has struck me as someone who thinks she's a bit more clever than she actually is. Which might be why LE let her talk as much to the news media as she wanted.

My first real post so I hope I haven't broken any rules ....

If you have a sick or deceased baby ,why aren't you calling for help?
And what's on the freakin' cell phones that are missing ? Was DB calling JI to come home and clean up her mess? Was she calling someone else to help her? She didn't drive,right?

Concerning smothering/body fluids,etc. ,as soon as a person dies muscles relax and fluids that could normally be held in,seep out.

 

[believe09]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Cadaver Dog
A narrow term, used in a search-and-rescue context, to indicate a canine primarily trained as a trailing or area search dog that has also received cross training in the location of dead human bodies.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Decomp Dog
The term "decomposition dog" was started by the NecroSearch group. They felt it better describes how dogs will indicate decomposed human scent which includes blood, feces, urine or other material with human scent on it."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT]
http://www.k9forensic.org/faq.html

Are these accurate characterizations?

 

[cluciano63]

What is it that Dr G stated in the KC trial? "100% of accidents are reported." I know this was reported but, it wasn't reported as an accident. How many accidents are reported as an abduction?

Well as far as she knows...how would anyone know about the ones who are never found? I still think it is possible Haleigh Cummings died by accident, perhaps ingesting something she found in the house, just as an example.

 

[MissJames]

You guys are so fast! I am not all the way caught up so please forgive if these are repeat questions.

1. This recently-dug dirt in the back yard -- is this something that they just recently found? It seems they've been combing the whole area for such a long time that they would have found it much sooner. Did they find it a couple of weeks ago and we are just now seeing it on their report?

2. The one thing that keeps sticking in my mind is, if you have a sick or deceased baby (geez it's hard even to write that), why would you put the body on the floor when you've got a perfectly good bed right there? Could be perhaps because someone else (an asleep son?) was on the bed and she didn't want him to see?

I was holding it together up til now but I feel kinda like I'm gonna cry, or maybe be sick.

I've been on both sides of the fence as well as balanced on top, but I will say that the mom has struck me as someone who thinks she's a bit more clever than she actually is. Which might be why LE let her talk as much to the news media as she wanted.

My first real post so I hope I haven't broken any rules ....

If you have a sick or deceased baby ,why aren't you calling for help?
And what's on the freakin' cell phones that are missing ? Was DB calling JI to come home and clean up her mess? Was she calling someone else to help her? She didn't drive,right?

Concerning smothering/body fluids,etc. ,as soon as a person dies muscles relax and fluids that could normally be held in,seep out.But there doesn't have to be fluids for a cadaver dog to detect a scent,IIRC. JMO

 

[marge_rita]

i still don't think mom is involved...would i bet myhouse on it..no way. The fact is none of us have any evidence of anything at the moment...my gut tells me mom is not involved but my gut could be wrong.

No evidence? Please read the news linked here today along with the search warrent. There's evidence. Now LE needs to find the baby's body. Soon mom can be arrested.

The admitted drunk mom who knows what happened to this precious baby. imo

imo

 

[Katana]

The attorney for Lisa Irwin's parents said she is working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
by Karen Yancey/Staff 4:44 PM


Read more: http://livewire.kmbc.com/Event/Live_Blog_Amber_Alert_Issued_For_Missing_10-Month-Old#ixzz1bS2FpAXm

Hopefully, it will not be along the same lines of what Baez had to say about cadaver dogs.

 

[dog.gone.cute]

Perhaps a SAR here can answer whether or not they believe the dog would have hit on urine like it was decomp.

May I add to your question another ?, since it is kind of "related" ...

Since Baby Lisa was 10 months old and still wearing diapers ...

Is it possible that a dog can "hit" on a diaper that the baby was wearing at the time when she passed -- release of fluids -- and then later, the diaper was disposed in the trash and the dog "hit" on it while in the trash?

I know it sounds "far-fetched" ... and I sure hope it made sense ...

TIA !

 

[Wise Old Owl]

CliffJudy Cliff Judy
Attorney for #LisaIrwin parents says she's working on a response to the info from the search warrant & affidavit.
2 minutes ago
http://twitter.com/intent/user?screen_name=CliffJudy

knbc reporter tweet

I bet she is! Wonder if Tacopina has been contacted? Duh - dumb question - of course he has - they got the warrant that morning LE/FBI went in. So, they knew this was coming.

 

[Morag]

Crikey you folks post at the speed of light! I had to use the facilities + 3 more pages appear! I have a question if someone could so kindly explain please. What does "Property for which possession is an offense under the laws of this state" indicate they were looking for in this case? It's one of the boxes checked on pg. 7 of the SW pdf. The only thing I could come up with was drugs? :waitasec:
TIA

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf

I noticed that also, Codger. I think it was a CYA in case they found drugs, weapons, etc. That way they could be arrested without any questions of an illegal search.

 

[vlpate]

You guys are so fast! I am not all the way caught up so please forgive if these are repeat questions.

1. This recently-dug dirt in the back yard -- is this something that they just recently found? It seems they've been combing the whole area for such a long time that they would have found it much sooner. Did they find it a couple of weeks ago and we are just now seeing it on their report?

2. The one thing that keeps sticking in my mind is, if you have a sick or deceased baby (geez it's hard even to write that), why would you put the body on the floor when you've got a perfectly good bed right there? Could be perhaps because someone else (an asleep son?) was on the bed and she didn't want him to see?

I was holding it together up til now but I feel kinda like I'm gonna cry, or maybe be sick.

I've been on both sides of the fence as well as balanced on top, but I will say that the mom has struck me as someone who thinks she's a bit more clever than she actually is. Which might be why LE let her talk as much to the news media as she wanted.

My first real post so I hope I haven't broken any rules ....

I can't answer the dirt question, but I know it has been answered here somewhere via a tweet. I can, however, say...
Welcome!! :great::seeya:

 

[Bon]

Because D admitted on tv that she was drunk when her child went missing, she failed her LDT, and a cadaver dog hit in her bedroom.

Add 1 + 1.

FWIW-this isn't a support thread for <modsnip>. :waitasec:

Just keep connecting the dots...........

 

[luckyme]

I bet she is! Wonder if Tacopina has been contacted? Duh - dumb question - of course he has - they got the warrant that morning LE/FBI went in. So, they knew this was coming.

Hes gonna be on every news possible probally every morning show. moo

 

[nursebeeme]

please attack the post and not the poster... :seeya:

 

[Lera213]

Let me Guess, the response by attorney's will be. Mrs or Mr so and so died in that house back in blah di blah blah. *rolls eyes*

 

[marge_rita]

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Cadaver Dog
A narrow term, used in a search-and-rescue context, to indicate a canine primarily trained as a trailing or area search dog that has also received cross training in the location of dead human bodies.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Decomp Dog
The term "decomposition dog" was started by the NecroSearch group. They felt it better describes how dogs will indicate decomposed human scent which includes blood, feces, urine or other material with human scent on it."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][/FONT]
http://www.k9forensic.org/faq.html

Are these accurate characterizations?

Yes if the blood or urine is from a DECEASED person.
No hit if the blood or urine is from a LIVING person.
Big difference.

 

[believe09]

Please knock off the name calling and personal attacks. We know emotions are running high, but we can still treat each other respectfully.

TIA.

 

[gwenabob]

I wonder if a tape dispenser - maybe one like a packing tape dispenser? - would make a sound similar to a 'clicking' sound to a child?

I very saddened by this news but not surprised...

Yes, it certainly would! She packaged her up in a little plastic bundle. Now to figure out where she left her!

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Getting here late...did anyone try to magnify those images of the search warrant yet? If so, can you post them please? (I'm still reading @ page 4 of this thread.)

 

[believe09]

Yes if the blood or urine is from a DECEASED person.
No hit if the blood or urine is from a LIVING person.
Big difference.

Thank you-it says blood, urine and feces with human scent on it, hence my confusion.

What about urine or feces that has been on the carpet for a while?

Did they bring another dog in to confirm the hit?

ETA: From the same link I posted before:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]"Human Remains Detection Dog
This Detection Dog is a specialist and has never been trained to look for live humans. They specialize in crime scenes, old cases, small scent sources and residual scent. These dogs have been trained to exclude fresh human scent along with all other animal scents."[/FONT]

So a cadaver dog has not been trained to exclude fresh human scent?

 

[21merc7]

Crikey you folks post at the speed of light! I had to use the facilities + 3 more pages appear! I have a question if someone could so kindly explain please. What does "Property for which possession is an offense under the laws of this state" indicate they were looking for in this case? It's one of the boxes checked on pg. 7 of the SW pdf. The only thing I could come up with was drugs? :waitasec:
TIA

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf

Doubt I can help much, I don't know the laws of Missouri. Here it is illegal to own a gun if you have a felony conviction. Some states it it illegal to have a CB Radio. You get the drift. It could mean the cell phones as there are now to be evidence, and if found, that would be illegal possession of the cell phones. It could mean illegal drugs, illegal anything. Kind of a broad statement that can be manipulated to something found.