California WildFires 2017

[margarita25]

"Fire officials said Saturday that wind gusts up to 45 mph could further spread the massive blazes across Northern California that have been ravaging the region for almost a week.

Saturday’s winds are forecast to be similar to those that stoked the first flames Sunday night, which have mushroomed to more than 15 fires that have scorched 220,000 acres, destroyed an estimated 5,700 structures and caused at least 35 deaths.

Firefighters throughout the region are facing red flag warnings of 10- to 20-mph winds, with gusts up to 40 to 45 mph on Saturday, said Cal Fire spokeswoman Jaime Williams. The wildfires have charred more than 220,000 acres across Northern California."

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-california-fires-20171014-story.html

 

[margarita25]

http://www.latimes.com/local/califo...lag-conditions-napa-1508004115-htmlstory.html

"One of the wettest winters on record, followed by the hottest summer on record, has created possibly the worst potential for fire in Napa County that the state has seen, authorities said Saturday.

Already entrenched in a weeklong battle against a series of fires scorching wine country that have killed dozens, the potential for more running flames remains, said California Department of Forestry and Fire Protection spokesman Mike Smith.

Experts use a scientific formula to determine the potential of a fire, called its energy release component, Smith said.
On Saturday, that potential is the worst "in recorded history," Smith said.

Crews have not seen this amount of fuel this dry in the path of a fire in at least 26 years, he said."

 

[margarita25]

Despite red flag conditions, Napa officials are optimistic about the Atlas fire
http://www.latimes.com/local/califo...lag-conditions-napa-1508004115-htmlstory.html

""Today is going to be a much different day than you've experienced unless you were here" for the beginning, Tom Wright*of the National Weather Service told fire crews at a Saturday morning briefing in Napa. "It's a really critical day."

But Napa County officials expressed some optimism at a Saturday morning news conference just an hour and a half later, saying they were confident that the Atlas fires would remain under control. Around 9 a.m., as supervisor Belia Ramos spoke, winds were light and no new evacuations were expected.

Outside of a troublesome 22- to 30-acre spot fire on the northern face of the Atlas fire, the blaze has stayed mostly within its current footprint, Napa County Fire Chief Barry Biermann said."

 

[zencompass]

Is there any chance they could run out of retardant?[emoji120]

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Awesome question!

Short answer is no because many companies manufacture it.

The fire retardant is manufactured in North American, primarily in the States. I'll look for some companies who manufacture it.

eta: Here's one from Montana: https://www.fs.fed.us/rm/fire/

 

[margarita25]

"Recognizing the eagerness of residents to return to their homes, authorities on Saturday pleaded for patience.
No one was going to be allowed into the evacuation areas Saturday, officials said, because Caltrans was spending the day trying to restore the roads.

The National Guard has been called in to help the California Highway Patrol block*the roads, as Caltrans crews in the hills clear rocks, mud, burned trees, fallen branches and downed power lines, CHP Capt. Chris Childs said.

Locals have been urged to avoid trying to help the cleanup. The county public health director declared a local emergency to order to bring in more resources to remove toxic ash and burnt remnants of homes and cars."

http://www.latimes.com/local/califo...lag-conditions-napa-1508004115-htmlstory.html

 

[margarita25]

"Of 224 people unaccounted for in Napa County, 146 have been found safe, four have been identified as dead and 74 remain missing, county spokeswoman Molly*Rattigan*said."

http://www.latimes.com/local/califo...lag-conditions-napa-1508004115-htmlstory.html

 

[roche.analisa]

I was curious about what hazards other than breathing will be faced by homeowners as they return. The CDC indicates that at a minimum there will be driving dangers and electrical dangers.

https://www.cdc.gov/disasters/wildfires/afterfire.html

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[margarita25]

Awesome question!

Short answer is no because many companies manufacture it.

The fire retardant is manufactured in North American, primarily in the States. I'll look for some companies who manufacture it.

(I've wondering about the red dye...is it nontoxic to animals/nature?)

 

[zencompass]

Praying hard, along with all of you, for the citizens and the brave and tired firefighters in California.

 

[zencompass]

(I've wondering about the red dye...is it nontoxic to animals/nature?)

Brilliant question. I don't think there is great certainly on this topic concerning Phos Chek.

Here is an article about some negative effects:

(Looks like it is the "ammonia compounds" that can kill fish)

From article: "Ammonia compounds, which are an ingredient in fire retardant used in Canada, can kill aquatic life if they're not diluted or if it they aren't flushed out by moving water."



http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/bc-wildfire-fire-retardant-fish-environment-1.4216249

 

[margarita25]

I was curious about what hazards other than breathing will be faced by homeowners as they return. The CDC indicates that at a minimum there will be driving dangers and electrical dangers.

https://www.cdc.gov/disasters/wildfires/afterfire.html

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk

(Um, don't get me started...CDC...

California / Hepatitis A Outbreak 2017
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?352479-California-Hepatitis-A-Outbreak-2017 )

 

[zencompass]

From (below) site:

"Don't power-wash Phos-Chek. If using a higher pressure power-washer, the tool may force the product deeper into whatever is being cleaned, especially porous services like concrete, advised George Matousek of ICL Performance Products LP in Rancho Cucamonga. If you power-wash Phos-Chek, it might never come off."

"Don't let pets eat the Phos-Chek, and be careful not to leave standing water that may have run off from washing."

"The retardant has the ingredient ammonia, and may burn if it gets into cuts, so avoid getting it on your skin."

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/l...-Sand-Fire-Homes-Red-Retardant-388489672.html

https://phoschek.com/industry/wildland/

 

[zencompass]

"A glimmer of hope".

From article (below):

"
"A fifth day of desperate firefighting in California wine country brought a glimmer of hope on Friday as crews battling the flames reported their first progress toward containing the massive blazes."

"The emergency is not over, and we continue to work at it, but we are seeing some great progress," said the state's emergency operations director, Mark Ghilarducci."

"Over the past 24 hours, crews arrived from Nevada, Washington, Idaho, Montana, New Mexico, North and South Carolina, Oregon and Arizona. Other teams came from as far away as Canada and Australia."

https://www.itv.com/news/2017-10-14...-first-progress-against-california-wildfires/

 

[margarita25]

From (below) site:

"Don't power-wash Phos-Chek. If using a higher pressure power-washer, the tool may force the product deeper into whatever is being cleaned, especially porous services like concrete, advised George Matousek of ICL Performance Products LP in Rancho Cucamonga. If you power-wash Phos-Chek, it might never come off."

"Don't let pets eat the Phos-Chek, and be careful not to leave standing water that may have run off from washing."

"The retardant has the ingredient ammonia, and may burn if it gets into cuts, so avoid getting it on your skin."

Rsbm

https://phoschek.com/industry/wildland/

"INDUSTRIAL/MILITARY

ICL’s Phos-Chek and Auxquimia Class B foams are ahead of the curve, using only C6 surfactants. Our full line of AFFF, AR-AFFF, Fluorine Free, Training and Specialty foams include products that are UL Listed, EN1568 Certified, ICAO B and C certified and Last Fire certified. ICL guarantees that every batch produced and sold meets the same performance requirements as the certifications it holds. Don’t take chances with cheaper, unreliable products. ICL has been known for Technology, Service, Performance for over 50 years.

Rapid flame knockdown saves lives, improves fire fighter safety, protects assets, and minimizes collateral damage. ICL’s Phos-Chek and Auxquimia Class B firefighting foams utilize the latest technology in chemistry and are among the most effective and environmentally responsible products on the market. Our Class B product portfolio includes Aqueous Film Forming Foams (AFFF), Alcohol Resistant Aqueous Film Forming Foams (AR-AFFF), and Fluorine Free foams. These foam concentrates will be offered in 1%, 3%, and 6% proportioned versions and include freeze protected and low viscosity foam concentrates. The AFFF and AR-AFFF foams are based on short chain fluorochemistry (C6) and meet some of the most stringent third party approvals including UL162, EN1568, ICAO B&C, and LastFire. Our Fluorine Free foams include a 1% proportioned foam for hydrocarbon fuel fires and a 3×6 foam proportioned at 3% for hydrocarbon fuels or 6% for polar solvent fuels."

 

[margarita25]

From (below) site:

"Don't power-wash Phos-Chek. If using a higher pressure power-washer, the tool may force the product deeper into whatever is being cleaned, especially porous services like concrete, advised George Matousek of ICL Performance Products LP in Rancho Cucamonga. If you power-wash Phos-Chek, it might never come off."

"Don't let pets eat the Phos-Chek, and be careful not to leave standing water that may have run off from washing."

"The retardant has the ingredient ammonia, and may burn if it gets into cuts, so avoid getting it on your skin."

Rsbm


https://phoschek.com/industry/wildland/

Additionally:

"CLASS A FOAM

Class A Foam is specially formulated to make water more effective for firefighting. The surfactants in Class A foam significantly reduce water’s surface tension and, when mixed with air, create a superior foam blanket that surrounds fuels with a thick layer of water. This creates a barrier between the fuel and the fire, knocking down the fire faster than water alone, and allowing fire fighters to see the areas of application. Making the water more effective reduces the amount of water needed to extinguish the fire, reduces water damage and increases fire fighter safety through quicker knockdown and reduced mop-up/overhaul requirements.

WD881 is highly effective for fighting Class A fires when mixed with water at use rates of 0.1% to 1.0%. It has proven effectiveness in many applications including Compressed Air Foam Systems (CAFS), structural firefighting, forest fire suppression and prescribed burning, mine fires, industrial Class A fires, and for extinguishing hydrocarbon spill fires.

Phos-Chek WD881 is the most concentrated Class A foam product available today. Other products contain significantly more water in the concentrate. This extra water means higher use rates will be required to achieve expected results.

WD881 does not contain fluorinated surfactants such as PFOS/PFOA. Fluorinated surfactants are used in Class B foam concentrates and are necessary to form a film on flammable liquid fires. Class B foams should not be used on Class A fires. Never mix Class A and Class B foam concentrates."

 

[margarita25]

"GEL

Water enhancing gels are designed for municipal, industrial and wildland fire departments for application from ground equipment. Gels can coat most vertical surfaces, including glass, with up to three inches of gel with no slumping. This enables fire fighters to easily and quickly protect buildings, tanks and other structures from flame and/or heat impingement, without tying up valuable resources to continuously spray water. Phos-Chek Insul-8 is a liquid concentrate that mixes easily with water by proportioner, eductor, or batch mixer. The mix ratio, or dilution, can be varied based on the desired gel thickness and the quality of the water. The product can be expertly mixed and applied using ICL’s new PC CODE system. Insul-8 requires significantly less concentrate than other liquid concentrate gels to achieve the same properties, making it far more cost effective. Effective mix ratios are between 0.37% and 3% depending on application and water quality. Insul-8 is fully tested and qualified by the USDA Forest Service. It is safe, non-toxic and environmentally friendly. Cleanup is easy with a garden hose or pressure washer."

https://phoschek.com/product-class/gel-for-wildland/

(Thanks for the links, zencompass)

 

[zencompass]

Thank you dear Margarita25 for all the information.

You, along with the other kind folks on this thread, have been so insightful and compassionate (as always!)

I'm hoping and praying, along with you all, for all of the people in California affected by this. It's deeply saddening.

 

[Hatfield]

From (below) site:

"Don't power-wash Phos-Chek. If using a higher pressure power-washer, the tool may force the product deeper into whatever is being cleaned, especially porous services like concrete, advised George Matousek of ICL Performance Products LP in Rancho Cucamonga. If you power-wash Phos-Chek, it might never come off."

"Don't let pets eat the Phos-Chek, and be careful not to leave standing water that may have run off from washing."

"The retardant has the ingredient ammonia, and may burn if it gets into cuts, so avoid getting it on your skin."

http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/l...-Sand-Fire-Homes-Red-Retardant-388489672.html

https://phoschek.com/industry/wildland/

But their own website in the other link says pressure wash ok. LOL

"Insul-8 is fully tested and qualified by the USDA Forest Service. It is safe, non-toxic and environmentally friendly. Cleanup is easy with a garden hose or pressure washer."

Maybe its the Phos-Chek Insul-8 form of it that is ok. Confusing. I guess firefighters need all the tools they can get.


https://phoschek.com/product-class/gel-for-wildland/

 

[zencompass]

I'm not surprised that their own website states pressure washing is ok. I would be surprised if they mentioned anything hazardous to fish or animals as was stated on the CBC site.

Quite a few companies/manufacturers do not include negative effects on their websites. Sigh..

Power washing would force the red dye into building materials.

The ammonia which is in all the fire retardants for fire fighting will kill fish. If animals ate it that would be destructive to them as well.

Hopefully the industry will look into other materials other than ammonia which could be as effective.

 

[zencompass]

Dear Hatfield,

That was a great catch (as usual!)

It's been difficult for me to find studies on the effects of the fire retardant material on animals and fish. This is surprising to me because apparently this has been manufactured since the late 1960's.