Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #13

[otto]

Do we know that the items you mentioned were not sold? Perhaps they were that last fateful day?

It's certainly possible that dining/living furniture was sold and picked up before the sale ended on Sunday. That would mean that the couple was not sitting at the dining room table counting the proceeds of the sale when they were attacked, because they didn't have a dining room table. That means, they were either in the master bedroom, the family room, or the kitchen (not likely standing in the kitchen). The family room furniture is still for sale. I have no doubt that if someone contacted kijiji to have an ad removed because the seller was deceased, it would be removed.

 

[otto]

I completely agree. I tend to believe the three were bludgened in their sleep and there was no "struggle" involved. While LE use technical, legal terms, they are also cognizant of the facts - If indeed the evidence pointed towards a "violent struggle" - they would have said as much.

They might be bound to use the criminal code term of: violent incident

 

[otto]

Yes your thoughts meander a similar trail to my own. As you may recall, I have always envisaged a scenario where the three were overcome in their sleep (counting sheep rather than the takings from the three day estate sale). I believe the fact they were sleeping is what enabled DG to attack and overpower them very quickly. I think he would have had a struggle on his hands (yes I chose that word specifically) had all three or even just the two adults been awake. I have no thoughts as to how he entered the premises but agree not likely the milk chute. So my scenario works i.t.o. a violent incident as opposed to a violent struggle.

What sort of weapon might have been used, and which door do you think he entered (front, side, dining room sliding glass door, back yard patio door)?

 

[Tinkerbel1]

At least they didn't say that they found no evidence ... they simply did not find the victims at the Airdrie property.

IMO, "no trace" means "no trace" of anything pertaining to these victims and the murder case. Maybe I'm obtuse, and being that I like to look at every possibility, what do you have in mind that they may have found that does not fall under the under the general category of the "victims"? You have the wonderful ability of looking at things and seeing things in a way that most don't.

 

[Cherchri]

What sort of weapon might have been used, and which door do you think he entered (front, side, dining room sliding glass door, back yard patio door)?

Oh my gosh - I have to admit - I wince to even think about his choice of weapon. I have though and there's been much wincing. I think a tyre iron. As for entry, as I said, I have no strong convictions as to how he gained entry. If I were to choose an option under duress, I think I would go with a glass sliding door. Is the patio door also a sliding door? I mentioned I once managed to gain entry to a home I lived in (having lost my keys while enjoying the stampede), using a credit card. It was a glass sliding door and very easily opened with my credit card.

 

[Blue Amethyst]

Is it OK to say that the two Amish girls have been found. I first heard about it when someone came on here looking for help to start a thread. That is such good news.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

O'Brien Trust Fund CIBC and/or ‘Super Heroes Are Real’ Funds both are at CIBC as per attached msm article.
http://www.mountainfm.ca/2014/08/13/super-heroes-are-real/ with audio interview of long time friends from Canmore Cherri and Ken Hodgins.
BBM from article ~ Cherri also told me that her and Kathy had made a promise that if something bad ever happened to one of them, the other would do whatever they could to look after that person’s family. This is why they’re driven to get as many donations as possible for the ‘Super Heroes Are Real’ fund to benefit the O’Brien family. Bow Valley Basics has contributed some donation boxes that will be popping up around town this week

Alvin has six adult children, four from a previous marriage that ended in the late 80s or 1990. I wonder when they plan to return to work, if at all. I hope that their friends are able to bring them food and look after their day to day activities so that they don't fall into depression.

Funeral (memorial) costs for murder victims are paid by the government. Loss of work funds are also available through the government for families of murder victims. Links for this were posted when the funds were first set up.

Yes, I am of the same understanding as you are Otto However, Ms. Hodgins made it clear that "no one was working" (in the O'Brien household) and that the fund was specifically for the O'Brien's. You have already responded to ibdb's quote #275 above regarding the fund name and who the fund is intended for. I've not heard of any other trust fund to help out the other Liknes children.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

Alvin has six adult children, four from a previous marriage that ended in the late 80s or 1990. I wonder when they plan to return to work, if at all. I hope that their friends are able to bring them food and look after their day to day activities so that they don't fall into depression.

Funeral (memorial) costs for murder victims are paid by the government. Loss of work funds are also available through the government for families of murder victims. Links for this were posted when the funds were first set up.

On another note Otto, I hope that there are friends helping out the other Liknes' as well, they have all been affected. IMO the public really has a soft spot for the child victims in terrible instances such as this. I think that's the purpose of the trust fund...it's being done in Nathan's memory. There could well be other trust funds set up to help the other Liknes' out in the coming days. We have such great resources in our Province for those in need, I'm sure all will be taken care of, whether through the Federal, Provincial or Municipal governments or through independent businesses, family and friends. Canadians are known for their generosity.

 

[otto]

IMO, "no trace" means "no trace" of anything pertaining to these victims and the murder case. Maybe I'm obtuse, and being that I like to look at every possibility, what do you have in mind that they may have found that does not fall under the under the general category of the "victims"? You have the wonderful ability of looking at things and seeing things in a way that most don't.

Not exactly. Was there a question prior to that information? If so, what was it?

Authorities have also scoured the property of Garland’s parents northeast of Airdrie and turned up no trace of any of the victims.

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/accused-in-liknes-and-o-brien-murders-in-court-1.1959334#ixzz3AQQs567H

I look at things for holes in the story. No trace of the victims, or no trace of the "murder case"? I think it's quite possible that there was evidence of the victims in the burn pit along the tree line near the South edge of the property ... clothing, anything else that was removed from the crime scene and which could tie back to the crime scene. It is a second crime scene for these murders. I interpret that comment as meaning that we can stop speculating that the victims were burned (with fire, lye, or acid) on the property.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

O'Brien Trust Fund CIBC and/or ‘Super Heroes Are Real’ Funds both are at CIBC as per attached msm article.
http://www.mountainfm.ca/2014/08/13/super-heroes-are-real/ with audio interview of long time friends from Canmore Cherri and Ken Hodgins.
BBM from article ~ Cherri also told me that her and Kathy had made a promise that if something bad ever happened to one of them, the other would do whatever they could to look after that person’s family. This is why they’re driven to get as many donations as possible for the ‘Super Heroes Are Real’ fund to benefit the O’Brien family. Bow Valley Basics has contributed some donation boxes that will be popping up around town this week

Alvin has six adult children, four from a previous marriage that ended in the late 80s or 1990. I wonder when they plan to return to work, if at all. I hope that their friends are able to bring them food and look after their day to day activities so that they don't fall into depression.

Funeral (memorial) costs for murder victims are paid by the government. Loss of work funds are also available through the government for families of murder victims. Links for this were posted when the funds were first set up.

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/accused-in-liknes-and-o-brien-murders-in-court-1.1959334
I read the msm article to mean no one is working as in the O family and extended L family
"I think it's essential because the Liknes' had six children and twelve grandchildren and the family is in pieces," Hodgins says. "Nobody is working, nobody can get back to normalcy, whatever normalcy is at this point. It's going to take a long time for us to be able to recover. This is a young family who didn't deserve this, but does deserve our love and support."

Ms. Hodgins quote above indicates, IMO, that she was speaking of the O'Brien family...|``This is a young family who didn`t deserve this, but does deserve our love and support``

I think its` admirable that people want to help out the O`Brien and Liknes families.

Brings up another question for me...in the beginning, there was talk of perhaps offering a $ 100,000 reward to help find the victims, which LE cautioned against due to the potential of it bringing in overzealous tips, etc. (no link to share atm, I haven`t looked for it yet)...that might indicate that there was funding available for this reward? Does anyone know where that money was coming from? I believe the fundraising goal was set at $ 100,000 as well (again, no link to share atm)....is it possible that this may be what the fund is for? Just curious to know if there's a tie-in?

 

[Tinkerbel1]

Not exactly. Was there a question prior to that information? If so, what was it?

Authorities have also scoured the property of Garland’s parents northeast of Airdrie and turned up no trace of any of the victims.

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/accused-in-liknes-and-o-brien-murders-in-court-1.1959334#ixzz3AQQs567H

I look at things for holes in the story. No trace of the victims, or no trace of the "murder case"? I think it's quite possible that there was evidence of the victims in the burn pit along the tree line near the South edge of the property ... clothing, anything else that was removed from the crime scene and which could tie back to the crime scene. It is a second crime scene for these murders. I interpret that comment as meaning that we can stop speculating that the victims were burned (with fire, lye, or acid) on the property.

If there was a question prior to the comment, its not indicated in the article, so I'm not sure.

Ah, so no trace of the victims. IMO, that would include burned clothing etc., however, it may not include items such as a wheelbarrow if it were used to transport the bodies, or rags that may have been used to clean up the blood, etc. I get it. Thanks!

 

[Sillybilly]

Is it OK to say that the two Amish girls have been found. I first heard about it when someone came on here looking for help to start a thread. That is such good news.

Yep .. a good ending with the girls alive and safe. An even better ending will be when they get the 2 suspects involved.

 

[otto]

Ms. Hodgins quote above indicates, IMO, that she was speaking of the O'Brien family...|``This is a young family who didn`t deserve this, but does deserve our love and support``

I think its` admirable that people want to help out the O`Brien and Liknes families.

Brings up another question for me...in the beginning, there was talk of perhaps offering a $ 100,000 reward to help find the victims, which LE cautioned against due to the potential of it bringing in overzealous tips, etc. (no link to share atm, I haven`t looked for it yet)...that might indicate that there was funding available for this reward? Does anyone know where that money was coming from? I believe the fundraising goal was set at $ 100,000 as well (again, no link to share atm)....is it possible that this may be what the fund is for? Just curious to know if there's a tie-in?

Are you thinking that the promise only extended to her two natural children? That's possible. That would mean that the friend, Cherrie, is bound to look after Kathryn's daughter and son, not the Liknes family?

The community fundraising amount has been stuck at $47-48k for a few weeks. If the issue is that the two children are out of work, what can be offered that would give them the skills to move forward. There are tragic events in some people's lives, but they have to move forward to survive.

 

[otto]

Ms. Hodgins quote above indicates, IMO, that she was speaking of the O'Brien family...|``This is a young family who didn`t deserve this, but does deserve our love and support``

I think its` admirable that people want to help out the O`Brien and Liknes families.

Brings up another question for me...in the beginning, there was talk of perhaps offering a $ 100,000 reward to help find the victims, which LE cautioned against due to the potential of it bringing in overzealous tips, etc. (no link to share atm, I haven`t looked for it yet)...that might indicate that there was funding available for this reward? Does anyone know where that money was coming from? I believe the fundraising goal was set at $ 100,000 as well (again, no link to share atm)....is it possible that this may be what the fund is for? Just curious to know if there's a tie-in?

If someone offers to post a $100,000 reward for information, one would expect that the money was in place prior to that statement. At the same time as the statement, an online fundraising site was started by the neighbour of Nathan. That is the same man that introduced his brother to the Calgary police so that his brother's company could provide high definition aerial photos of 10 miles around the acreage. Perhaps police are checking those areas. That fund seems to be set up for the Obrien family, not the children of Kathryn.

 

[Tinkerbel1]

Are you thinking that the promise only extended to her two natural children? That's possible. That would mean that the friend, Cherrie, is bound to look after Kathryn's daughter and son, not the Liknes family?

The community fundraising amount has been stuck at $47-48k for a few weeks. If the issue is that the two children are out of work, what can be offered that would give them the skills to move forward. There are tragic events in some people's lives, but they have to move forward to survive.

No actually, there was no mention of JL at all. Ms. Hodgins spoke of JO and being a sort of self-appointed godmother to JO. I believe the fund is on behalf of Nathan, therefore meant for the O'Brien's only. The fund is referred to the "O'Brien Trust Fund" at CIBC locations. I hadn't even thought past the O'Brien's at all when I read the article and watched her on the video, could be my oversight but the impression I definitely got was that this was meant for the O'Brien family's use.

 

[Deleted member 117120]

For clarification purposes there are 4 concurrent fund raising efforts for the O and L family.
1. O'Brien Trust Fund CIBC
2. ‘Super Heroes Are Real’ Funds CIBC
1 & 2 funds go into the same account at CIBC
3. Nathan, Kathy and Alvin Fund on go fund me fundraisers
4. ATB Financial see post #323

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/neighbours-launch-fundraiser-for-family-of-missing-calgarians-1.1917293

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/accused-in-liknes-and-o-brien-murders-in-court-1.1959334

 

[Deleted member 117120]

Ohhhh!!! Thanks! Good to know! I had no idea there were 2 trust funds! That's great!

Actually 3 Tinkerbel1 see #318

 

[Tinkerbel1]

Actually 3 Tinkerbel1 see #318

lol...yeah...I just got that! Not as quick as I used to be...lol Thank you so much!

 

[Tinkerbel1]

For clarification purposes there are 3 concurrent fund raising efforts for the O and L family.
1. O'Brien Trust Fund CIBC
2. ‘Super Heroes Are Real’ Funds CIBC
1 & 2 funds go into the same account at CIBC
3. Nathan, Kathy and Alvin Fund on go fund me fundraisers




http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/neighbours-launch-fundraiser-for-family-of-missing-calgarians-1.1917293

http://calgary.ctvnews.ca/accused-in-liknes-and-o-brien-murders-in-court-1.1959334

We must've typing this at the same time! Yours is much better! I've deleted my post

 

[otto]

No actually, there was no mention of JL at all. Ms. Hodgins spoke of JO and being a sort of self-appointed godmother to JO. I believe the fund is on behalf of Nathan, therefore meant for the O'Brien's only. The fund is referred to the "O'Brien Trust Fund" at CIBC locations. I hadn't even thought past the O'Brien's at all when I read the article and watched her on the video, could be my oversight but the impression I definitely got was that this was meant for the O'Brien family's use.

That's great that the friend of Kathryn Liknes is appointed to look after Kathryn's family, but that would include Nathan's mom, and her youngest brother - the natural child of Kathryn and Alvin Liknes. If the focus is only on the Obrien family, then this person is not looking after Kathryn's family ... because Kathryn's son is not an Obrien, but he is her family. So is Alvin, but not necessarily his children ... that would not necessarily be included in the wishes of Kathryn.

I suppose that would mean that the fund should be divided somehow such that Kathryn's two children split the roughly $50,000 dollars?