Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #20

[OutOfTheDarkness]

I tend to not rely on what is reported.

I'm the same... but you have to put yourself in the reporter's mind... if LE had hinted in the slightest way there was new information about the body location, you'd be all over that to be the first to report it. The report, albeit worded semi-ambiguoisly, is most likely that they have received no further information about location.

 

[news.talk]

I wonder if that means Douglas Garland is cooperating. Or if by evidence it means the bodies have been recovered.

Usually the Defense Council will go to the crime scenes to obtain additional photos, and further forensic studies in preparation for their case. They often hire outside forensic professionals to counter the Police findings.

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

I wonder if the sale of the house was stalled by the murder case??? I have seen it happen before, where the home where a homicide took place was left empty until after trial. If Prosecutors are theorizing that at least one, if not all the murders happened in the home, it is possible that the house is now tied up with the case.

I thought there were movers in there after it was released though. Perhaps circumstances changed, or perhaps the dealings behind the sale are in question?

 

[news.talk]

I thought there were movers in there after it was released though. Perhaps circumstances changed, or perhaps the dealings behind the sale are in question?

It's possible. Were the movers moving stuff in or out?

 

[deugirtni]

Thanks for finding that! I wonder if this means they feel they may not have enough evidence? I can see the defence hiring whatever professional to go in and obtain evidence, but that would not include police, as police released the property months ago.

I am just quoting a small portion of the article you linked, in case it later disappears:

CALGARY – Calgary Police Service say investigators were out at a property east of Airdrie Sunday, in relation to the Liknes and O’Brien homicides.

Investigators are searching the property to collect more evidence to support the upcoming court case.

Calgary Courts Centre
March 29, 2015 1:34 pm Calgary time (approx)
Calgary Police collecting more evidence at Airdrie property in relation to Liknes and O’Brien homicides
LISA MACGREGOR By Lisa MacGregor Reporter Global News
http://globalnews.ca/news/1910353/calgary-police-collecting-more-evidence-at-airdrie-property-in-relation-to-liknes-and-obrien-homicides/

Police collecting more evidence at Airdrie property, in relation to Liknes & O’Brien homicides http://bit.ly/1GEzL8b

Investigators are searching the property to collect more evidence to support the upcoming court case.

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

It's possible. Were the movers moving stuff in or out?

I do believe the article said moving furniture out and let a neighbor in to have a look around...

 

[deugirtni]

I guess your province's Ministry is different from ours.. our sticker on the plate means the vehicle is licensed for that specified time period, but nothing about insurance. And when we transfer ownership of a vehicle, it doesn't include transfer of plates, and people can either keep them or hand them back in to the Ministry. Is it different out there?

I will pull title next week and see if anything changed. The license plate would have the month and year of the insurance with the sticker that you put on the plate. When the vehicle is transferred thru ownership the plate would be returned back to the registries. I have the plate number and when I have time I will search pics to see that it is the same plate from July.

 

[news.talk]

I do believe the article said moving furniture out and let a neighbor in to have a look around...

That was my understanding - The family were putting some belongings into storage. I have a feeling that the house is tied up in some legal limbo, whether because of the case or because the sale wasn't finalized for some reason. There may be an issue with probate too.

 

[news.talk]

Thanks for finding that! I wonder if this means they feel they may not have enough evidence? I can see the defence hiring whatever professional to go in and obtain evidence, but that would not include police, as police released the property months ago.

I am just quoting a small portion of the article you linked, in case it later disappears:



Note: the time on the article may be appearing in 'my' timezone which is EST, so it may instead by 1:34pm Calgary time?

I have it written down as 1:30 pm.

 

[deugirtni]

The hose... if nothing else.. if it had been used for clean-up after the gruesome act, would have been tested for prints and blood, and therefore, even if none were found, that would be considered evidence, either for the prosecution or the defence, depending on what was found.

And the truck with bodies in it, apparently no matter how much you wash away blood, it doesn't get rid of it completely and it can still be seen with that stuff they put on it, and then tested. I'm confident, for myself, that forensic experts would have made the testing of that vehicle a major priority, considering a madman was on the loose at the time, but yet no arrest until days later, and only after he had been let out on bail on the other charges and then re-arrested for breaking his release conditions.

So.. not going to get into debating endlessly, we really can agree to disagree.

Welllllllll... back to this debate... DNA testing takes time, so we don't really know yet what they found. If the perp was smart enough to clean up the scene, one would imagine he was smart enough to clean up a transportation vehicle... however, if you strip the vehicle apart, DNA could have been washed into any number of nooks and crannies...

... and you don't necessarily need to confiscate the hose, just like they didn't pull up the sidewalk for court to prove there was blood evidence. That would make for a very long trial if every item had to be presented, rather than just a picture or a theory.

 

[LoisLane]

I wonder if the sale of the house was stalled by the murder case??? I have seen it happen before, where the home where a homicide took place was left empty until after trial. If Prosecutors are theorizing that at least one, if not all the murders happened in the home, it is possible that the house is now tied up with the case.

The sale of the house shows the transfer from the seller to buyer (lawyer). They were supposedly renting it back or the living arrangement was worked into the sale.

 

[deugirtni]

From memory, the (now retired) Chief of Police stated that the bodies would never be found. So if the bodies were in fact found, I believe it would contradict whatever their existing theory is on what occurred during that crime. If that happened, their entire case may fall apart in regard to their accused, since it was built, piece by piece, likely one piece upon another upon another. I doubt if they are even therefore looking or hoping to find the bodies. MOO

I wonder if that means Douglas Garland is cooperating. Or if by evidence it means the bodies have been recovered.

 

[deugirtni]

Interestingly, in a case here in Ontario, detectives did exactly that (pull up evidentiary concrete) BBM:

XXXXXXXX
10-06-2014, 01:01 PM
Susan Clairmont of the Hamilton Spectator is live tweeting from the trial:

https://twitter.com/susanclairmont

Susan Clairmont @susanclairmont · 3h 3 hours ago
Jury has just been brought in. Trial expected to last three months. #hamont

Crown says Mark had a failing golf business and killed Bill for money. By killing sister too he inherited it all: $1.4 million. #hamont

Crown's first witness is Terry Hill, retired
@HamiltonPolice detective.

Susan Clairmont @susanclairmont · 1h 1 hour ago
Describing arrival at Park and Fly near Toronto airport at 2:15 am June 9, 1998. Truck with bodies had been found.

Susan Clairmont @susanclairmont · 45m 45 minutes ago
Detective wrote search warrant to remove slab of concrete from shed at farm after forensics found blood stains. Showing photo.

Susan Clairmont @susanclairmont · 32m 32 minutes ago
Jury now seeing photos of incinerator on Staples farm in Binbrook. Witness saw Mark burning something around time Bill and Rhonda vanished.

Susan Clairmont @susanclairmont · 31m 31 minutes ago
Police sifted through ashes and found two buckles, six buttons, three zipper pulls, eight pennies.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-255713.html

... and you don't necessarily need to confiscate the hose, just like they didn't pull up the sidewalk for court to prove there was blood evidence. That would make for a very long trial if every item had to be presented, rather than just a picture or a theory.

 

[deugirtni]

So are any WSer's going to attend? Man, I would love to fly out there for that!

May 19th by the way... the start of the preliminary hearing.

 

[deugirtni]

I wonder how many reporters are now hanging out at the Airdrie acreage, 'just in case'? Man, they would hate themselves if they relied on being told one thing, and a completely different thing ended up happening, and they missed the story!

I'm the same... but you have to put yourself in the reporter's mind... if LE had hinted in the slightest way there was new information about the body location, you'd be all over that to be the first to report it. The report, albeit worded semi-ambiguoisly, is most likely that they have received no further information about location.

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

I wonder how many reporters are now hanging out at the Airdrie acreage, 'just in case'? Man, they would hate themselves if they relied on being told one thing, and a completely different thing ended up happening, and they missed the story!

Exactly. My point was though, that reporters are no different from everyone else... career oriented and make more by the bigger audience they attract... if it could have been twisted into something sensational to keep people clicking and updating... it would have most likely read differently.

 

[news.talk]

So are any WSer's going to attend? Man, I would love to fly out there for that!

I will be there.

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

"Police also cautioned that they do not have “new information” in regards to the location of the victims."

http://www.ctvnews.ca/mobile/canada...perty-to-gather-additional-evidence-1.2303095

 

[LoisLane]

Exactly. My point was though, that reporters are no different from everyone else... career oriented and make more by the bigger audience they attract... if it could have been twisted into something sensational to keep people clicking and updating... it would have most likely read differently.

This could be the same reasons as to why investigators are only telling reporters what they are willing to share at the moment.

 

[news.talk]

This could be the same reasons as to why investigators are only telling reporters what they are willing to share at the moment.

There is also a little known fact... Often Reporters are told inside information about cases but are not allowed to publish it. They sit on the information until such time that they can report it, or use it to obtain the same information from a source other than LE. They guard the information because exposing it will irreparably damage their career. They would NEVER be trusted by sources again, which impedes their ability to do their job. Sometimes you can tell by what they are saying that there is more than they are telling.