Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 Jun 2014 - #21

[Tealgrove]

I don't know how much stock we can put into Archie's testimony, i.e., dates and times. Based on tweets I've seen, he has some hearing difficulties and some difficulty understanding some questions asked by the Defence. The Defence isn't pushing either. Such a very hard and sad position for DG's father to be in. Sad Sad Sad.

MOO

 

[dyannaON]

Are we not seeing any defence Qs on cross? Or am I missing it all?


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[Satchie]

Re: the grudge

As I see it, Alvin was urged by his son to give his daughter-in-law’s ex-con, disturbed but basically bright brother a 2nd, 3rd, 4th chance to do something positive with his life. Alvin probably didn’t want him as a partner, and didn’t have the personality to mentor someone like that, he just wanted to do the right thing by his in-laws and give the guy some work and a good reference when he found other jobs. Garland didn’t understand he was a charity case and expected to be a partner, and didn’t understand that Alvin always had lots of projects on the go, and didn’t care much if something didn’t work out. The breakdown in the relationship seems inevitable.

Calgary’s economy from 2010 to 2014 was booming like gangbusters. Garland could have found other work, instead of living with his parents and dwelling on this one incident.

 

[JadeSLeuth]

Are we not seeing any defence Qs on cross? Or am I missing it all?


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Nothing much it seems. I mean it does no good to cross examine your elderly parents who don't have much info anyway (other than the farm info). Hitting J'OB yesterday with anything wouldn't have helped defense for sure.
I think we won't see much on cross until maybe LE and Forensics testify. After prosecution rests is when defense will come to life IMO

 

[dyannaON]

Thanks Jade!! Makes sense.


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[Tealgrove]

How much cross can be done on the grieving mother of a murdered 5 year who also lost her parents? I think their hands are kind of tied on crossing JO. Now we have DG's elderly parents and when AG was crossed didn't really have the ability to answer the questions very well so Defence backed off.

I think once the "technical evidence" starts to arrive then the Defence will step up hard.

MOO

 

[JadeSLeuth]

Kevin MartinVerified account ‏@KMartinCourts 57s58 seconds ago
Archie Garland was on pain killers which made him groggy night of alleged killings and Doreen Garland took a sleeping pill. #Garland


Bill GravelandVerified account ‏@BillGraveland 1m1 minute ago
#Garland got up at 7 the next morning. Her husband was having coffee. She asked him if Douglas had left for his psychiatric appointment.


Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney 2m2 minutes ago
Did anything out of the ordinary occur that night? Crown asks of June 29. Nothing she knows of, says Doreen #Garland

 

[JadeSLeuth]

And here we go (things start picking up)

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney 45s46 seconds ago
Doreen #Garland then phoned Patti, who was Allen Liknes' common-law spouse. Says she was shocked.

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney 1m1 minute ago
She told accused about the tv news alert, he said he didn't want to talk about the Likneses. #Garland
0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney 2m2 minutes ago
"I go the impression the Liknes' had taken their grandson," says Doreen #Garland
0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney 2m2 minutes ago
Doreen #Garland went down that evening to watch tv news. Saw a storm was coming when she saw Alberta alert. then saw picture of three.

 

[Hez]

Nothing much it seems. I mean it does no good to cross examine your elderly parents who don't have much info anyway (other than the farm info). Hitting J'OB yesterday with anything wouldn't have helped defense for sure.
I think we won't see much on cross until maybe LE and Forensics testify. After prosecution rests is when defense will come to life IMO

I predict the defense will try to attack LE and their investigation (i.e., apparent rush to judgement, didn't appear to investigate other suspects, focused only on Garland, etc., despite that being directly where the forensics and other evidence lead them, Garland's 'perp walk', etc.), and attack the forensics (i.e., methodology, quality assurance/control, etc). That's really all they have. :moo:

 

[Tealgrove]

So they weren't camping. They were there at the farm when whatever was transpiring was transpiring.

My Goodness! I can't believe that he brought them back to the farm with his parents there!

 

[JadeSLeuth]

I predict the defense will try to attack LE and their investigation (i.e., apparent rush to judgement, didn't appear to investigate other suspects, focused only on Garland, etc., despite that being directly where the forensics and other evidence lead them, Garland's 'perp walk', etc.), and attack the forensics (i.e., methodology, quality assurance/control, etc). That's really all they have. :moo:

LOL and good luck on attacking any of it!
I mean we have PICTURES of the bodies clearly on your property. DNA everywhere on your farm. Digital evidence of your research. And that's not all, but its umm ... plenty yo.

All they could try is insanity or blame it on ... what, the parents of DG??
It blows to be on that defense team methinks.


MOO IMO

 

[JadeSLeuth]

Lunch break now till 2:00 MST

 

[LoisLane]

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney · 14m14 minutes ago
Doreen #Garland says she was confused as to why Alvin and Kathy would take their grandson.

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney · 14m14 minutes ago
Doreen #Garland says usually when Allen Liknes' name was brought up, Douglas would say he didn't want to talk about him.

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney · 13m13 minutes ago
Doreen #Garland recalls Allen Liknes being around the farm in '07, says she'd invite him in if he was there at lunchtime.

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney · 12m12 minutes ago
Doreen #Garland didn't notice anything strange about accused on morning of June 30, but didn't have any real conversation.

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney · 10m10 minutes ago
"You're not going to believe this," Mom told #garland upon seeing the news. "I said fine," when son didn't want to talk about them.

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney · 9m9 minutes ago
Doreen #Garland recalls the frustration of Allen and Alvin Liknes towards accused in '07 over work being done.

Valerie Fortney ‏@ValFortney · 8m8 minutes ago
Court in #Garland triple-murder trial now being adjourned for lunch.

 

[JadeSLeuth]

So they weren't camping. They were there at the farm when whatever was transpiring was transpiring.

My Goodness! I can't believe that he brought them back to the farm with his parents there!

Yes - but likely knowing they were doped up (and old, hard of hearing, etc). Maybe they were even "additionally doped up" by DG but I suppose I don't need to dream up any new charges for this guy.
I suppose just because Kathy, Alvin and Nathan weren't yet dead, it doesn't mean they were conscious. My greatest hope is that all three were unconscious prior to leaving their home and never regained.


1. Now, where did the original "away camping" story come from?? OR were they sent "away camping" while the LE searches were taking place and the media got it wrong?

2. Wonder why DG parents weren't asked if THEY used adult diapers? Just if DG did. Why not get that totally out of the way?

3. We should have a parade for that aerial photography company.

4. SOO looking forward to finding out if there was additional evidence captured outside Liknes home on CCTV. He obviously had to have had three people sprawled out in the back of that green truck, covered with something or not. If CCTV saw him coming, then CCTV saw him going. We spent soooo much time on that CCTV evidence, I can't wait until its covered.

 

[Power of Two]

So they weren't camping. They were there at the farm when whatever was transpiring was transpiring.

My Goodness! I can't believe that he brought them back to the farm with his parents there!

Now that is an interesting twist. IIRC from the beginning there was the assertion that DG's parents were away camping all weekend and knew nothing of the events at the property. Who floated that line of thought? MSM? And why? I remember much discussion around the camping issue, as in...80 year olds away 'camping'??

 

[Cherchri]

Yes - but likely knowing they were doped up (and old, hard of hearing, etc). Maybe they were even "additionally doped up" by DG but I suppose I don't need to dream up any new charges for this guy.
I suppose just because Kathy, Alvin and Nathan weren't yet dead, it doesn't mean they were conscious. My greatest hope is that all three were unconscious prior to leaving their home and never regained.


1. Now, where did the original "away camping" story come from?? OR were they sent "away camping" while the LE searches were taking place and the media got it wrong?

2. Wonder why DG parents weren't asked if THEY used adult diapers? Just if DG did. Why not get that totally out of the way?

3. We should have a parade for that aerial photography company.

4. SOO looking forward to finding out if there was additional evidence captured outside Liknes home on CCTV. He obviously had to have had three people sprawled out in the back of that green truck, covered with something or not. If CCTV saw him coming, then CCTV saw him going. We spent soooo much time on that CCTV evidence, I can't wait until its covered.

With you on all points but ESPECIALLY number 2.

 

[KMouse]

I am going to make an assumption about the adult diapers and say that a package or some were found in DG's room, or in a bag, or in the truck, or at the Liknes residence.

 

[JadeSLeuth]

Now that is an interesting twist. IIRC from the beginning there was the assertion that DG's parents were away camping all weekend and knew nothing of the events at the property. Who floated that line of thought? MSM? And why? I remember much discussion around the camping issue, as in...80 year olds away 'camping'??

Since we're on lunch anyway, I'm going back to the early reports of Garland's arrest when the whole "away camping" story was out there. I'll see if I can track it down. I remember we speculated that perhaps they had an RV, but still, in hindsight, 80 years olds camping???? No. At least highly highly unlikely (some 80 years olds are very active, respect to them!)

 

[Sillybilly]

Since we're on lunch anyway, I'm going back to the early reports of Garland's arrest when the whole "away camping" story was out there. I'll see if I can track it down. I remember we speculated that perhaps they had an RV, but still, in hindsight, 80 years olds camping???? No. At least highly highly unlikely (some 80 years olds are very active, respect to them!)

It's been a while and I could be wrong, but seem to recall it was a church pastor who initially tweeted Garland seniors were away camping?? Could have been done just to protect their privacy once such a horrendous set of circumstances was plopped into their lives.

 

[JadeSLeuth]

Oh Man! I totally forgot about DG's stolen identity charge from years before. AND when he was first picked up, he was charged with debit or credit card fraud. Did he use debit/credit under the stolen identity's name to purchase some or all of the many tools and supplies he bought???
IMO
Sorry, I'd forgotten so many of the side details!!
From the media thread:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...terest-has-criminal-past-new-charge-1.2698107