Deceased/Not Found Canada - Alvin, 66, & Kathy Liknes, 53, Nathan O'Brien, 5, Calgary, 30 June 2014 - #9

[deugirtni]

I find it interesting that at least some MSM are referring to the victims as 'presumed victims', as headlined here in The Toronto Star, "Son of presumed victim watches Douglas Garland’s court appearance" (http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014/07/16/douglas_garland_appears_in_court_on_three_murder_charges.html), and yet media and others are asking Garland what he did with the bodies, and do not seem to even notice that Garland is charged, but not convicted. It bothers me that people are so willing to presume guilt even with such little information to support this (no smoking gun, no reported DNA in the man's vehicle, no bodies, etc). IMHO, I can't stop picturing the 'real purps' celebrating their luck in having LE and MSM already hanging this DG person, and not even bothering to investigate other avenues.

 

[Menci]

I've been looking back trying to find the pictures that were posted of the suspect shortly after his arrest. I'm specifically trying to find the picture (blown up) of his back, showing his hands in handcuffs. I believe it may have been Otto that posted it. I've tried to find it to no avail. If someone can help find it, I'd be appreciative. I've looked through the threads, and through Otto's posts specifically, and have come up empty, and am getting frustrated.

The reason: At the time, I was looking for any sign of marks. I thought his right elbow was a bit red, and thought maybe a recent scab had fallen off, or something similar. Or was it just a regular elbow look - lol! Then I was looking at the rest of his forearms, and thought to myself, do they look a bit bruised, or is this just my imagination? I didn't go back to it for some reason, and now it's bugging me. I do note, that no one else made comment though.

Okay, I finally found it. For some reason, couldn't reply with quote on that page, so here's the location:

Thread 8, page 43 - 07-17-2014 - 3:56 a.m., post 1063 - Poster: ztzt (inactive)

 

[OutOfTheDarkness]

I find it interesting that at least some MSM are referring to the victims as 'presumed victims', as headlined here in The Toronto Star, "Son of presumed victim watches Douglas Garland’s court appearance" (http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014/07/16/douglas_garland_appears_in_court_on_three_murder_charges.html), and yet media and others are asking Garland what he did with the bodies, and do not seem to even notice that Garland is charged, but not convicted. It bothers me that people are so willing to presume guilt even with such little information to support this (no smoking gun, no reported DNA in the man's vehicle, no bodies, etc). IMHO, I can't stop picturing the 'real purps' celebrating their luck in having LE and MSM already hanging this DG person, and not even bothering to investigate other avenues.

You mean just like OJ?

 

[deugirtni]

Wasn't there a little more evidence in the OJ case?

You mean just like OJ?

 

[Wondergirl]

IMHO, I'm not convinced DG's green truck was the only method of transportation used.

I still think it's entirely possible that DG parked his truck in the back lane behind their house, gained entry either by slipping in an unlocked door or by being let in, and left with the 3 victims in AL's truck. He disposes of the 3 victims in some manner or places them somewhere to deal with later, brings AL's truck back, cleans up quickly outside the property, wipes down surfaces he remembers touching on the inside and leaves out the back way of the Parkhill home and drives away in his truck.

It was mentioned that SpyHill landfill is where garbage would go from his parent's property although I suspect they haven't found much there. I would suggest that he is fairly thorough and methodical in his approach.

Problem is, he had a few days before LE was on to him. He had a number of chemicals at his disposal and he more than likely planned and plotted this out. Yes, he got caught out by (probably a plethora of) CCTV cameras, they may prove to be his undoing. Sucks to be a loner and not engaged as much in the real world.

Also IMHO, I think LE HAVE found trace evidence of chemicals in his truck that match chemicals found at the acreage. Still not 100% convinced though he took the 3 victims to the acreage, I still feel he didn't go far. He was a child, early teen in the Bankview/South Calgary neighbourhood (16th Street/26th Avenue), back in the day when children ran free compared to now. I'd be looking in South Calgary Park (which is not far from the Parkhill home), again IMHO.

BBM - Have there been searches in South Calgary Park?

I think it's possible that LE found the murder weapon and/or trace DNA evidence at the farm.

I also think it's possible the bodies aren't there, and he did dispose of them elsewhere.

LE has a 30 Day Plan. They don't need the public assisting in searching. They haven't left the farm. They are methodically searching their grids. By all observations, LE seems pretty sure that there are bodies, that they are in that area, and they will find them.

I am with LE on this one.

JMO

 

[musicaljoke]

I still think they should water board DG to make him talk.

If any case warrants such treatment, it's this one!!!

There is no place for waterboarding in our justice system, and no time when torture is warranted for the interrogation of accused individuals in Canada.

 

[news.talk]

I find it interesting that at least some MSM are referring to the victims as 'presumed victims', as headlined here in The Toronto Star, "Son of presumed victim watches Douglas Garland’s court appearance" (http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2014/07/16/douglas_garland_appears_in_court_on_three_murder_charges.html), and yet media and others are asking Garland what he did with the bodies, and do not seem to even notice that Garland is charged, but not convicted. It bothers me that people are so willing to presume guilt even with such little information to support this (no smoking gun, no reported DNA in the man's vehicle, no bodies, etc). IMHO, I can't stop picturing the 'real purps' celebrating their luck in having LE and MSM already hanging this DG person, and not even bothering to investigate other avenues.

It would be my guess that given that LE doesn't have the bodies yet have gone ahead with formal charges, that they have over-whelming evidence... I.E. DNA in his truck and home, surveillance we haven't seen, perhaps a manifesto or journal belonging to the suspect, witness statements, etc. The CPS has a very fastidious set of standards and a top-notch forensic and investigative team. IMO, they aren't looking for other suspects because they have strong evidence that the suspect acted alone and that he indeed is theperpetrator.

 

[Krystine]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clifford_Olson

Parents everywhere were terrified of this man, for good reason. It was a terrible time in British Columbia and the ensuing court case and eventual 'bargain' ( $10,000 for each victim) was despicable. He rotted in jail until his death. Good riddance.

Yes, and if I remember correctly, his wife did very well financially because of the deal. I don't recall though, (I was young and more self absorbed) whether law enforcement were out in full force searching for victims as they are for this case.

 

[daniela40]

There is no place for waterboarding in our justice system, and no time when torture is warranted for the interrogation of accused individuals in Canada.

Whatever, I'm entitled to my opinion.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ilovepierre]

A creepy thing is with DG going under different names and emails he could even have been on here commenting on his own websleuth case between June 30 - July 4th. JMO

Yikes....that is creepy!

 

[Wondergirl]

I do too, and dg was a hunter so he would have various winches and dressing articles for caches that get hung in trees. or it could be concealed in a hole or wrapped around a limb.

Matthew Hoffman was obsessed with leaves, and thought he was a squirrel, even though he used to shoot the squirrels and eat them inside his leaf-filled home- no joke. When he murdered his 3 innocent victims in Ohio, Tina Herrman, her young son Kody Maynard and friend Stephanie Sprang, he hoisted them up and into a 60 foot hollowed tree, using his tree climbing equipment.

I don't know if there are bear traps dug out of the ground in Alberta or not. Bodies hoisted up in a deer tree stand, or something outside the box like this, could be something that Garland may have thought up.

I know many logically focus on the chemicals given his background, but, if he was actually a hunter this may be an avenue worth exploring.

Putting them down a well seems the highest likelihood, given the background.

Just thinking outside the box.

Would Garland have been lazy in his disposal or keen?

Is it possible that Garland made at least one victim walk to where he would end their life?

 

[news.talk]

BBM - Have there been searches in South Calgary Park?

I think it's possible that LE found the murder weapon and/or trace DNA evidence at the farm.

I also think it's possible the bodies aren't there, and he did dispose of them elsewhere.

LE has a 30 Day Plan. They don't need the public assisting in searching. They haven't left the farm. They are methodically searching their grids. By all observations, LE seems pretty sure that there are bodies, that they are in that area, and they will find them.

I am with LE on this one.

JMO

ITA. They have to have a solid reason such as trace evidence to lead them focusing on this one area. They have obviously ruled out other areas. The fact that they don't want public help, leads me to think they know exactly what they are looking for and where.

 

[Cherchri]

Matthew Hoffman was obsessed with leaves, and thought he was a squirrel, even though he used to shoot the squirrels and eat them inside his leaf-filled home- no joke. When he murdered his 3 innocent victims in Ohio, Tina Herrman, her young son Kody Maynard and friend Stephanie Sprang, he hoisted them up and into a 60 foot hollowed tree, using his tree climbing equipment.

I don't know if there are bear traps dug out of the ground in Alberta or not. Bodies hoisted up in a deer tree stand, or something outside the box like this, could be something that Garland may have thought up.

I know many logically focus on the chemicals given his background, but, if he was actually a hunter this may be an avenue worth exploring.

Putting them down a well seems the highest likelihood, given the background.

Just thinking outside the box.

Would Garland have been lazy in his disposal or keen?

Is it possible that Garland made at least one victim walk to where he would end their life?

Do we have any evidence that DG was a hunter? I don't believe he was. If there is a link, please share.

 

[news.talk]

Matthew Hoffman was obsessed with leaves, and thought he was a squirrel, even though he used to shoot the squirrels and eat them inside his leaf-filled home- no joke. When he murdered his 3 innocent victims in Ohio, Tina Herrman, her young son Kody Maynard and friend Stephanie Sprang, he hoisted them up and into a 60 foot hollowed tree, using his tree climbing equipment.

I don't know if there are bear traps dug out of the ground in Alberta or not. Bodies hoisted up in a deer tree stand, or something outside the box like this, could be something that Garland may have thought up.

I know many logically focus on the chemicals given his background, but, if he was actually a hunter this may be an avenue worth exploring.

Putting them down a well seems the highest likelihood, given the background.

Just thinking outside the box.

Would Garland have been lazy in his disposal or keen?

Is it possible that Garland made at least one victim walk to where he would end their life?

WARNING - GRAPHIC:

It is my hunch that none of these victims left the home alive. Forgive me for saying, but I have a feeling they left in garbage bags... that would make sense of the drag marks, why no one saw or heard anything, and why no one saw bodies being transported. It may also explain what they saw in the home to lead them to the determination of homicide. Perhaps the bathtub was used. Sadly, a common method of partial disposal as it is easier to clean up yet still would leave behind trace evidence. I also suspect that is why they are so focused on areas of water... weighed down bags. I apologize for the imagery... I tried to say it as kind as possible.

 

[Cherchri]

WARNING - GRAPHIC:

It is my hunch that none of these victims left the home alive. Forgive me for saying, but I have a feeling they left in garbage bags... that would make sense of the drag marks, why no one saw or heard anything, and why no one saw bodies being transported. It may also explain what they saw in the home to lead them to the determination of homicide. Perhaps the bathtub was used. Sadly, a common method of partial disposal as it is easier to clean up yet still would leave behind trace evidence. I also suspect that is why they are so focused on areas of water... weighed down bags. I apologize for the imagery... I tried to say it as kind as possible.

I'm going to go with bedding from the home rather than garbage bags, lye and fire

 

[LoisLane]

Okay, I finally found it. For some reason, couldn't reply with quote on that page, so here's the location:

Thread 8, page 43 - 07-17-2014 - 3:56 a.m., post 1063 - Poster: ztzt (inactive)

View attachment 55202

I think Global news showed DG getting out or into a car and you can see the back of the shirt in full. I just could not make it out... Looked like some sort of race or something cartoon like. It seemed to have an obnoxious slogan and something to do with pigs. It was not clear enough to clearly make out.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

DG would have been assessed for risk of suicide when arriving in the jail. Not sure how Calgary Remand works but anybody that comes in for a high profile crime/child murder etc. would automatically be assessed at a medium risk. A high risk may come from something DG said to a doctor, his lawyer, or a guard. High risk means 24 hour watch and probably on camera.
DG would then be reassessed by a psych nurse or doctor in the jail.

Excellent info, thanks for clarifying with more detail, I wasn't sure the exact criteria and/or protocols regarding suicide watch, so thanks

 

[PrincessButtercup]

I think Global news showed DG getting out or into a car and you can see the back of the shirt in full. I just could not make it out... Looked like some sort of race or something cartoon like. It seemed to have an obnoxious slogan and something to do with pigs. It was not clear enough to clearly make out.

I can see the Calgary Corporate Challenge logo at the bottom right .... all the companies that participate design their own shirts and there is a competition .... that's actually kind of interesting ....

 

[Cherchri]

I think Global news showed DG getting out or into a car and you can see the back of the shirt in full. I just could not make it out... Looked like some sort of race or something cartoon like. It seemed to have an obnoxious slogan and something to do with pigs. It was not clear enough to clearly make out.

Yes that elbow does look a bit gnarly. I think the shirt says Feel the Heat. Ironically he must have been feeling the heat there and then.

 

[news.talk]

I'm going to go with bedding from the home rather than garbage bags, lye and fire

Exactly. We have obviously covered similar crime scenes! Speaking for myself, I have become desensitized to the methods of disposal and sadly too familiar. While the average person may see conspiracies, complicated motives and unique methods of homicide and disposal, I see simplicity, logic and common methods. Sadly , the truth is usually more graphic and horrifying.