CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #3

[nicgumshoe]

I agree - 'if' AG was planning to leave everything to LV that it would have been kept simple.

So why not give LV POA in the event of illness, accident etc to ensure things were looked after while AG could not?

Maybe at 70 she still couldn't imagine herself as being incapacitated in some way. She drove a camaro...so still had the "drive" of a younger person

 

[Woodland]

The following article is by far the strangest item I have seen on-line regarding AG.

http://thebestovens.info/audreys-story-continues-hamilton-spectator/

It appears to be a really bad re-write of the Spec series last September. I have seen it a couple of times but only focused on the re-write - why would someone take an article already written in English and re-write it in really bad English?

I just looked more at the actual site and it's contents - ovens? We have read earlier that AG had a convection oven installed (or only purchased) a month or so before she was killed and complained to PK that the person was rude to her. Is this that person and are they mocking AG or LE for that matter? If it is the 'oven guy' that was at AG's home why do this? If it isn't the same 'oven guy', why do this?

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Here's what I'm thinking - that article posted above ^^^^^ is a translation of a translation. I mean someone must have translated the Jon Wells story (to send to someone who doesn't speak English??) and then someone else has tried to re-translate it back into English.

So, this leads me to my next question - did AG have friends/family in another country who spoke only her parents' native tongue?

ETA: And why on earth was the re-translation written on an ovens site?

 

[bodhi93]

The following article is by far the strangest item I have seen on-line regarding AG.

http://thebestovens.info/audreys-story-continues-hamilton-spectator/

It appears to be a really bad re-write of the Spec series last September. I have seen it a couple of times but only focused on the re-write - why would someone take an article already written in English and re-write it in really bad English?

I just looked more at the actual site and it's contents - ovens? We have read earlier that AG had a convection oven installed (or only purchased) a month or so before she was killed and complained to PK that the person was rude to her. Is this that person and are they mocking AG or LE for that matter? If it is the 'oven guy' that was at AG's home why do this? If it isn't the same 'oven guy', why do this?

It's really weird. I thought that the site might troll the net looking for anything that mentions ovens and pull it back to use on their site... to try and get more people to find their site (for example: we are looking for links to Audrey and this site comes up in the search results and we follow it back to the ovens site). But in the very poorly re-written article it doesn't even mention an oven... they have it listed as a "convection heater".

I'm really not sure what to think...

 

[Hazel]

Here's what I'm thinking - that article posted above ^^^^^ is a translation of a translation. I mean someone must have translated the Jon Wells story (to send to someone who doesn't speak English??) and then someone else has tried to re-translate it back into English.

So, this leads me to my next question - did AG have friends/family in another country who spoke only her parents' native tongue?

ETA: And why on earth was the re-translation written on an ovens site?

Very odd indeed. I think you might be right N_S_U in your assumption that the original article might have been translated to another language, then back into English, but it still doesn't make sense to me posting the article like that, instead of the original version. Also no link to the original article.

IMO this person collects all articles he finds that contains the keywords "OVEN" or 'CONVECTION" (jmho)

I checked the links on the left hand side, and found the link to that particular article under:

Archives >> September 2011 >> page 9 : http://thebestovens.info/2011/09/page/9/ (scroll down)

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

I decided to go back in time and I looked at this article again:

http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/595858--who-is-audrey-gleave

This part jumped out at me and perhaps it holds the key to who and what AG became:

When her life began, she was Otte Wilma Doveika, born in Hamilton on Feb. 6, 1937. Her parents were from the Baltics, Latvia and Lithuania; their anglicized names in Canada became Antanas (Tony) and Marie Doveika.

Tony Doveika worked in Hamilton as an engineer for Greening Wire Co. He lived on Oxford Street near Barton and Locke streets, before marrying Marie and moving to 179 Locke Street N., and then to 19 Mulberry Street downtown.

Otte changed her name to Audrey as a teenager. She did not get along with her mother; they barely talked.

By 1960, Tony had moved the family to 11 Beulah Avenue, off Aberdeen Avenue near Dundurn Street. At 23, Audrey worked as a clerk at Bell, and in 1964 was enrolled in science at McMaster University.

In first year at McMaster she met Allan Gleave, who was six years her junior and studying engineering. Allan had attended Hill Park Secondary School, his father was a purchasing agent for Firestone, and his uncle, also named Allan, was a Hamilton police officer.

Allan found Audrey attractive. She was full-figured and in good shape, with long hair she usually coloured red. Most appealingly, she had a sharp wit fuelled by her intelligence.

“She read only two magazines,” quipped Allan. “One was Scientific American and the other MAD Magazine.”

She was also a private woman who volunteered little about her past. Maybe that was because she was older than her peers, or perhaps something had happened to her as a young woman that inspired such caution.

Whatever it was that led Audrey to form a protective shell around herself, it would remain for the rest of her life.

One day, Allan spotted an old elementary school science textbook of Audrey’s. He opened the front cover. There it was, handwritten: Otte Wilma. She had never told him her original name.



OK, my gut feeling is that *something* happened to AG when she was known by her real/birth name.

Now, why would a young girl turn her back on her own mother?
1. Shame - had AG thought she'd somehow shamed the family?
2. Disrespect - was something going on the that home which AG thought her mother could/should have prevented?
3. Men - was there a male(s) who were dismissed by AG's family but with whom AG wanted to associate?
4. Religion - was AG being pushed to follow the 'family religion' and her scientific mind simply couldn't buy it?
5. Abuse - was AG's mother abusive to her daughter?

Please add to my list if you think it's worthwhile. I firmly believe that *something* happened to young Otte Doveika and she was never the same again.

Sad, really..........:tears:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Very odd indeed. I think you might be right N_S_U in your assumption that the original article might have been translated to another language, then back into English, but it still doesn't make sense to me posting the article like that, instead of the original version. Also no link to the original article.

IMO this person collects all articles he finds that contains the keywords "OVEN" or 'CONVECTION" (jmho)

I checked the links on the left hand side, and found the link to that particular article under:

Archives >> September 2011 >> page 9 : http://thebestovens.info/2011/09/page/9/ (scroll down)

I know what you mean - it's bizarre! Why would *anything* about AG be posted on an ovens site? Unless she herself went there to praise/complain about the product? And why is it all about her horrendous murder and not about ovens?

:dunno:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Trying to learn something about AG's mother, I Googled "Marie Doveika" and this came up:

http://www.mountmary.ca/

kay::websleuther:kay:

 

[Hazel]

I know what you mean - it's bizarre! Why would *anything* about AG be posted on an ovens site? Unless she herself went there to praise/complain about the product? And why is it all about her horrendous murder and not about ovens?

:dunno:

There is NO connection, other than the word "CONVECTION" in that re-written article.

The original article has both keywords "CONVECTION" and 'OVEN" -- though my guess is the real keyword is 'OVEN' .... once translated back and forth, the word oven was changed to "heater' resulting in 'convection heater', as bodhi93 pointed out in his post #686 - that is how it appears in the re-written article.

So in my humble opinion, we shouldn't sweat over that site like I said before it seems that person likes to collect every single article he finds that contains OVEN .... that site has not only "oven" articles from other countries like Chile, Holland, etc., but also Flicker photos and video clips from a variety of sources....all they have in common is O V E N .... hope I explained it clearer this time

 

[nicgumshoe]

Trying to learn something about AG's mother, I Googled "Marie Doveika" and this came up:

http://www.mountmary.ca/

kay::websleuther:kay:

NSU, did you put quotation marks around the name when you googled it? I tried with quotations and didn't see that site.

 

[Hazel]

NSU, did you put quotation marks around the name when you googled it? I tried with quotations and didn't see that site.

This is the weird site I get when googling:

Marie Doveika : http://nuclear.carboncapturereport.org/cgi-bin//profiler?key=Marie_Doveika&pt=2

Wilma Doveika : http://nuclear.carboncapturereport.org/cgi-bin//profiler?key=Wilma_Doveika&pt=2

Tony Doveika : http://nuclear.carboncapturereport.org/cgi-bin//profiler?key=Tony_Doveika&pt=2

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

NSU, did you put quotation marks around the name when you googled it? I tried with quotations and didn't see that site.

No quotations. And I Googled Marie Doveika of Ancaster Ontario Canada.

 

[Hazel]

Not really, imho. Per Woodland, the will was dated 23 Feb 2007 ( link ) At that point, PK had been working for her for a little under a year. That is, he reportedly began working for her when he was 18, which would be sometime in 2006.

The Camaro was bought later that year (2007), so was not included in her Will.

Not long before her murder, Audrey had been cleaning up her house, books, papers with PK's help.

Could Audrey had been thinking it was time to redo/update her Will to make provisions for PK? Seems to me, after five years she had grown to trust him a lot and maybe even felt she was his mentor? (just speculation on my part, no real facts)

 

[Sillybilly]

This is the weird site I get when googling:

Marie Doveika : http://nuclear.carboncapturereport.org/cgi-bin//profiler?key=Marie_Doveika&pt=2

Wilma Doveika : http://nuclear.carboncapturereport.org/cgi-bin//profiler?key=Wilma_Doveika&pt=2

Tony Doveika : http://nuclear.carboncapturereport.org/cgi-bin//profiler?key=Tony_Doveika&pt=2

That's one of those "who's related to who" type sites Hazel ... IOW, with any of the names you googled, if you click on who they are related to (i.e. articles that contain their names), the articles will track back to articles about Audrey's death. Lordy, if you click on some things, they end up being related to Barack Obama because there is a nuclear component to some of the articles.

Dumb and useless info really ... kinda like the convection oven stuff :banghead:

 

[Sillybilly]

The Camaro was bought later that year (2007), so was not included in her Will.

Not long before her murder, Audrey had been cleaning up her house, books, papers with PK's help.

Could Audrey had been thinking it was time to redo/update her Will to make provisions for PK? Seems to me, after five years she had grown to trust him a lot and maybe even felt she was his mentor? (just speculation on my part, no real facts)

You're not alone in your speculation on that one Hazel. I questioned before what they could have had to discuss if everything was being left to LV. The Camaro was a major item that was not addressed in the Will. If AG and PK talked about what would happen after she died, then the one thing that has stood out in my mind is that she may have mentioned she would bequeath him the Camaro. Maybe something she said led him to believe the Will had already been revised.

Food for thought ... what if someone else did have a copy of a more recent Will? Might be kinda scarey to come forward with it when there is so much focus on who the perp might be.

I recall on the auto-related FB page that PK is associated with, there was a notation on the wall in late December to the effect "nothing ventured, nothing gained".

 

[dotr]

This video gives a nice taste of Hamilton.
VIDEO: "This will make you want to live in Hamilton


This video from Hamilton’s economic development department shows off a side of the city that many outsiders don’t get to see."


http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/627240--video-this-will-make-you-want-to-live-in-hamilton

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

The Camaro was bought later that year (2007), so was not included in her Will.

Not long before her murder, Audrey had been cleaning up her house, books, papers with PK's help.

Could Audrey had been thinking it was time to redo/update her Will to make provisions for PK? Seems to me, after five years she had grown to trust him a lot and maybe even felt she was his mentor? (just speculation on my part, no real facts)

Hazel - Camaros were out of production for a few years. In 2006/7 GM made a concept car (not road worthy and not for sale). AG's Camaro was the new one , a 2010 which would have gone for sale in late 2009.

ETA: Camaro link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Camaro_(fifth_generation) Please click on "fifth generation" for info about the production of AG's Camaro!!

 

[Hazel]

Hazel - Camaros were out of production for a few years. In 2006/7 GM made a concept car (not road worthy and not for sale). AG's Camaro was the new one , a 2010 which would have gone for sale in late 2009.

ETA: Camaro link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Camaro_(fifth_generation) Please click on "fifth generation" for info about the production of AG's Camaro!!

Oh Thanks NSU, I stand corrected then Audrey purchased it in 2009 so still not included in her 2007 Will, one reason she might have wanted to update it (that was the point I was trying to make )

 

[Hazel]

Maybe I'm imagining this, but I thought I saw somewhere that she once advised a student to "keep it simple".

You're not imagining this, it is on the very first picture in the Memorial site:
KISS - Keep it simple [and] stupid

http://beckettglaves.frontrunnerpro.com/runtime/8242/runtime.php?SiteId=8242&NavigatorId=78497&op=tributeFamilyPhotos&viewOpt=dpaneOnly&ItemId=619536&LinkId=282






how odd -- I just noticed the caption under one of the pictures. Perhaps is a common saying?

Broaden your horizons, and keep smiling stupid

Book of Memories -- Photos & Amazing Grace --> http://beckettglaves.frontrunnerpro.com/runtime/8242/runtime.php?SiteId=8242&NavigatorId=78497&op=tributephotomemories&viewOpt=dpaneOnly&ItemId=619536&LinkId=279&TB_iframe=true&height=602&width=951

 

[nicgumshoe]

OK, my gut feeling is that *something* happened to AG when she was known by her real/birth name.

Now, why would a young girl turn her back on her own mother?
1. Shame - had AG thought she'd somehow shamed the family?
2. Disrespect - was something going on the that home which AG thought her mother could/should have prevented?
3. Men - was there a male(s) who were dismissed by AG's family but with whom AG wanted to associate?
4. Religion - was AG being pushed to follow the 'family religion' and her scientific mind simply couldn't buy it?
5. Abuse - was AG's mother abusive to her daughter?

Please add to my list if you think it's worthwhile. I firmly believe that *something* happened to young Otte Doveika and she was never the same again.

Sad, really..........:tears:

I agree. Something traumatic must have happened to her. We saw in the Wells story somewhere that her father liked his booze. I've wondered whether he was abusive because of that, and AG may have blamed her mother for not stopping it. (Maybe the abuse was insestual and that's where she developed a fear about being raped again, in the future)

Whatever it was seems to have sent her on a path to break away from becoming a typical woman of the time. (Maybe she disrespected her mother for being a slave to her father's domination...and vowed that would never happen to her.)

Whatever happened, her childhood is possibly where a general mistrust of people began (where she first came to the notion that many/most people are liars....Maybe there were many broken parental promises). Later, that may have resulted in her being a guarded/private person.