CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #5

[No_Stone_Unturned]

:what: Just re-watched the video posted by dotr above. YES! The term 'one stranger' does imply one stranger + someone she knew.


I mean.....one stranger (to Audrey) did the killing and was assisted by someone known to her. (Look young and look close).

 

[colette]

In the video linked by Dotr they say stranger, the article below the video also says stranger.

"This was a stranger attack, perhaps the most frightening kind, done at the hands of a person or people who Gleave didn't even know, homicide Staff-Sgt. Steve Hrab said Friday."

 

[Woodland]

Hrab was taken off the case. He seemed to have gotten it wrong.

 

[Woodland]

It seems the best way to have gained entry to AG's home with the dogs kennelled in some way is to be expected.

The cake delivery was after the fact and planned that way according to PK, the soup delivery was rather last minute according to LV.

Was there a delivery between Tuesday and Wednesday? Difficult to know.

I always like the scenario that someone was in AG's home for sometime before she was killed. One could have accomplished whatever one needed to accomplish. Jmo.

 

[colette]

Hrab was taken off the case. He seemed to have gotten it wrong.

I don't see how we know if he was was wrong or right as this case has not been solved.

 

[Chorley8]

It's hard to imagine AG having an enemy... Certainly we had none in common. She wasn't the kind of person it was possible to hold a grudge against .

Would hate to have every statement I make picked apart like this but - this is a puzzling little group of statements from PK. If anyone else thinks so too maybe they can help. All I can think of here is:

Thought he disavows the idea of AG having an "enemy" he is the one bringing up the idea of "enemy". He then says that they have no common "enemy" he and AG that is a strange sentence you might be expected to say"or if he had one I didn't know who" but we had not common enemy strikes me as odd. Just possible they had no common enemy because 1. AG doesn't know he is her enemy or 2. the killer known to PK is not his enemy. Overall it sounds like he knows more about something here is not saying it.

Also is the way he points to the serviceman and vandal here the way the original suspect got pointed out? I am wondering if what turned police attention back to the group of friends is when LE began thinking about about where the original info came from. Do we know who pointed the finger at the vagrant in the barn I am forgetting his initials right now.

Maybe someone can help.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

The initials of the guy in the barn are DLS. And he was an easy scapegoat.

Hrab got it wrong because he failed at catching the killer.

A BIG problem here is that we really only have PK's word to go on; Hrab was silent most of the time. No info was coming out.

IMO, PK led us all down the path he wanted us to follow.

I still think PK was involved and he perhaps had someone to help him with the killing. But who? His brother? His wife? Other friends from McMaster? Other family members.

I also FIRMLY think that the killer was in Audrey's house for a long time before the killing. Who would she admit to her house? Who sent the 'Amazing Grace' video? How did they get into the house? Has PK's wife's whereabouts been accounted for during the days prior to the killing?

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

In the video linked by Dotr they say stranger, the article below the video also says stranger.

"This was a stranger attack, perhaps the most frightening kind, done at the hands of a person or people who Gleave didn't even know, homicide Staff-Sgt. Steve Hrab said Friday."

Is there a link for this, please?

 

[Woodland]

It is correct we do not know if the stranger killer scenario is what happened or not.

My point regarding Hrab was taken from a post by PK - thread 2, page 9, #201 - .. police have restarted the investigation 'from scratch' ... making PK a person of interest again.

Post #210 from the same page has PK saying the detectives are putting lots of pressure on those who know AG well. Hrab was off the case by this time.

I should have posted this at the same time.

 

[Woodland]

I agree Chorley8 on the enemy comment. Very puzzling - and seems unnecessary.

I would love to know more about DLS becoming a suspect. He was caught in a bank with a knife - in the washroom. I doubt there are cameras, so seems someone must have seen him with the knife. Upon release from that, Hrab arrested him for AG's murder.

I really think Hrab was mislead rather than taking a step back and viewing all there was to see. With all due respect Hrab did redeem himself soon after by catching the nut that was riding around on his bike and stabbing people at random in Hamilton plus the murder of an elderly man in his home.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

It is correct we do not know if the stranger killer scenario is what happened or not.Very true......'look young and look close'.


My point regarding Hrab was taken from a post by PK - thread 2, page 9, #201 - .. police have restarted the investigation 'from scratch' ... making PK a person of interest again.Oh dear.....not 'poor PK again'!

Post #210 from the same page has PK saying the detectives are putting lots of pressure on those who know AG well. Hrab was off the case by this time.Well OK......they MUST put pressure on 'persons of interest'! Everyone knows that!

I should have posted this at the same time.It's OK!!

Responses are within the quote itself, in colour.

MY biggest questions: :doughboy: and :cupcake:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Quoted from Woodland:

<<< I would love to know more about DLS becoming a suspect. He was caught in a bank with a knife - in the washroom. I doubt there are cameras, so seems someone must have seen him with the knife. Upon release from that, Hrab arrested him for AG's murder.>>>

My opinion is that *someone* pointed DLS out to police........deliberately. It had to be someone who knew the area well; someone who frequented Audrey's house a great deal; somone who KNEW DLS would immediately be taken in by LE.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

More questions;

- Hrab said it was the most horrific crime he'd seen in 20 years; PK just called 911 and said she was dead!

- what was the murder weapon?

- who's to believe - PK or Hrab?

- why was PK so 'chatty' at the funeral home?

- why does PK insist that he and Audrey were bosom buddies of sorts?

- what tripped PK up on the polygraph?

 

[colette]

Is there a link for this, please?

It was from Dotr's last post, one page back.


http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2010/12/31/16718126.html

 

[dotr]

Thinking about AG having a smoke in the garage...

http://www.thespec.com/news/local/article/774735--police-seek-help-in-solving-sunday-sex-assault
"Police seek help in solving Sunday sex assault

Hamilton police are appealing to the public for help in identifying a suspect in a sexual assault.

The assault occurred after a female victim walking on King Street East near Burris Avenue between 3:30 and 4 a.m. Sunday asked a male for a light for her cigarette. The complainant advised police she had seen the suspect in the area shortly before.

The complainant said the suspect reached into his pocket for a light and grabbed her. She lost consciousness and was taken behind a King Street East building before being sexually assaulted and robbed"

 

[2soccermom]

Hi all --
I've been trying to catch up on the posts. I understand why PK and LV are under suspicion here -- these are really the only "leads" we have and there is what seems like opportunity for one and possibly opportunity AND motive for the other. For my part, I don't find PK's relationship with Audrey odd at all. She liked SMART young people and by her choice of car she enjoyed being edgy and "with it" -- a young friend fits that profile equally as being an older woman living alone meant she needed to RELY on another's help. She saw herself as mentor to PK and she needed his assistance. I imagine he likely cared for her (even if, as young people are wont, he may have sometimes been put out by her requests; maybe not -- I don't know). That he appeared here is no mystery or surprise to me; he arrived seeing a community working through Audrey's death and joined here probably as much for support and sharing as in the same general interest in sleuthing that draws a lot of WS folk. I'm equally unsurprised that he left; his answers have been used against him and I've wondered why he stayed as long as he did. I'm not judging those of you placing him under suspicion; this is the goal of the site, to pose possible scenarios and work to try to solve a case. I'm just saying it's no shock he disappeared!

Myself, I don't see any motive for PK. I know violent crime for deranged killers needs no other "reason" than some individual psychological phantasm. My own thought is that Audrey was watched and murdered for the pleasure/release of someone who is very smart but very ill. That the car in the garage was not destroyed or the house/area vandalized fits entirely with my own profile for the perp. This was a crime against a human body. I believe Audrey was surprised in the garage. I know this doesn't fit with what most of you think here. And I support your right to speculate as you do. But I just see PKs statements and actions so differently. He may be guilty; I don't know. But his being here and leaving is not part of what I would find of question. MOO.

 

[colette]

Thanks for your posts 2soccermom, I agree with your thoughts on PK. I really think there was someone peeping in the neighborhood. He probably watched Audrey smoke in her garage, then attacked her.

 

[Woodland]

I would go with AG being surprised in her garage if her dogs were not kennelled in the house at that particular moment. Did AG kennell her dogs on a regular basis when she was home alone with them? Or were they free to roam the house and go outside when she did?

 

[dotr]

Hmm, I forgot about hunters...

http://www.therecord.com/news/canada/article/308671--answers-sought-in-killing-of-retired-teacher
"Deborah Lytle, who lives near to the abandoned barn, said she was unaware that a squatter was living on the property.

“We thought it was occasionally being used by hunters,” she said"

 

[dotr]

Concerning sports/hunting and thinking of SV (and AG).
http://www.hamiltonhunt.ca/
"The club is active year round with winter and spring social functions, summer horse shows, late summer and fall hunting seasons, culminating with our fabulous Hunt Ball in December. "